What Richas says kinda makes sense tho, i think these programs really go over the line by making reads/conclusions for players that would normaly wouldnt be able to do them, simple as that.
And the people who benefit most are the people who use datamined hand histories obv.
Same as most advanced hud stats benefit dataminers only. I think best for everyone would be if stars go aggresively after controlling huds and software like this.

Whats the chance of Party and Stars tightening the screws simultaneously NOT being a coincidence?

Well, teh only way to get rid of program a is to outright ban program and heavily ENFORCE that. As long as a program is allowed there will always be loopholes...

idk ... you also could 'blame' the NVG thread and all the ppl claiming it was 'PS approved bot' (which was a wrong claim repeated again and again), making it a big news ... but imo this would be a somehow limited pov.

it might be "the straw to break the camel's back" but don't forget all the other straws. it seems that this would have happened anyway. sooner than later another program/discussion would have caused changes.

the whole industry moves to the rec model, and it started long before the skier thread. e.g. MPN announced the 'anti HUD policy', which is imo more drastic than PS' changes, last year

There needs to be a discussion about spinwiz. Stars made an uninformed decision here. Regs and Recs are better off with spinwiz. Can follow the discussion here: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/18...7/index37.html

Regulars that aren't part of a big backing team/clique now are on an uneven playing field as Stars cannot possibly monitor groups of people registering to avoid each other. Spinwiz was a fair program open to everyone, and recreational players benefited from the increased number of 1 reg / 2 rec games too. Stars benefited from regs trying to battle each other as well. It was a win win win situation for everyone and theres no clear logic on why the program was banned. Seems like a few uniformed people said ban spinwiz and stars obliged.

the cliques / skype groups are good for regs outside the cliques as they will have fewer regs per game than they would if the groups did not exist, same goes for recs.

so for the same reason recs had nothing to fear from spinwiz - and actually benefited from not having spinwiz-using-regs mass registering - regs outside the chats also shouldnt worry about the 'unfairness' of it.

fwiw i have never been a part of a skype registration chat, and sat most users when i used wiz.

Is auto-time bank still permitted? Thanks

Can someone here confirm what software is no longer allowed by stars?



I only use HEM2, TN1 and sessionlord.


The last time I used HEM2 i recalled i didn't see any notecaddy notes for players.... so basically aroudn that time was when those notes no longer showed up. What alternative is there to TN1? I tried TN2 and didnt like it. I could not get my bet sizing the same as TN2 even with tableninja2 support. I tried a bit of starshelper and tableoptimizer.



What i need with the programs are


1. Hud stats
2. Never sit out
3. Auto register sng


So what program is there for never sitting out then? I do recall stars has the option for you to sit back in all tables but of course you have to click on it each time. TN1 would automatically sit me back in.


Also does that mean you can't have software that automatically sets the betsize for you on flop, turn and river? For example on tn1, after the flop, it would set my bet size to 1/2 the pot differnet amount on turn and river etc. OF course i then have the pokerstars hotkeys to put in a different bet size. I know tn2 allows this but so does tableoptimizer and starshelper?


I also read preset bet sizing isn't allowed anymore? With TN1, at 100/200 blind level in an sng, it would go to 2.25x thus 450 for me. If someone limps in, it would go to 450 +200 so 650. So basically this isn't going to be allowed in ANY SOFTWARE AT ALL?



Based on this, which software would you suggest me get? I think never sit out is really all i need. Because even though stars only allow 4 different bet sizes, you could have hotkeys and i could put the other percent of the pot bet i want. I'm guessing tableoptimizer is probably best?

Yes, go for Table Optimizer. Takes a bit of time to learn how to get the most out of it but it's a great program.

With preset bets you can still have different sizing for flop/turn/river but can't alter it based on limped/3bet pot etc.

DAE think that banning tools that don't interact with the software, and yet are useful in real-time, such as PokerStove or Equilab will only make it worse for the average player? I'm 99% sure PokerStars can't detect if these softwares are running within a Virtual Machine while the client is running in the physical one, while I'm 100% sure they can't track them in other computers. If someone wants to squeeze in that extra value they might just play on mobile (most people who take time to input the info probably aren't playing that many tables) while running the software on their PC's or have a laptop by the side ready to use whenever necessary. It gives an even higher advantage to anyone willing to do it, while it makes it harder for anyone to have access to the same tools.

In before Pauly's 37 follow-up questions.

i snickered

am i right in thinking huds are still allowed? would be great for online poker if stars just got rid of them completely

So if the NC update has released does it mean that all of the restrictions are applied? no more color coding HUD's or scatter graphs?
whats left from NC beside taking notes (which Note Tracker can also do)?
Def new era in online poker.

Limiting HUDs to 3 colors is pretty ridiculous as it has no effect on the information displayed, only the aesthetics of that information. I agree with all the changes pertaining to note caddy, street-by-street HUDs, and similar programs/features.

I just want my HUD to look as nice as it did before the changes.

Oh yes it can. I believe the security dept has algorithms which can detect suspicious clusters of players that either join "too many" of the same tables, or miraculously avoid each other despite playing a high volume. The security/fraud Dept will presumably investigate if you tell them the screennames of people you suspect may be in cahoots as part of a cartel.

It's particularly easy for Stars to tell exactly who is avoiding each other in SpinGos when certain players publicly admit to using Skype to avoid playing their stablemates.


I think Stars is deadly serious about putting a stop to this kind of "collusion". If you're raking $13,000 in a week, I suspect that getting your account frozen will put quite a dent in your earnings, so it's probably not a good idea to try and skirt around the new rules, especially if you're grinding towards Supernova Elite. The Stars banhammer is an even scarier prospect than the dreaded doomswitch.

awesome news ^, hope many more people get to experience the pain and feel the wrath of Stars stupidity spawned by the angry 2p2 mob and the husng.com idiot crusaders over skier's stuff. hope this ends up costing them $.

I do love it when people start their complaint with how much they have raked, as if that matters in the slightest, when they have broken the rules.

you once were voicing strongly on the danger of players using charts/real time programs on other computers to avoid getting caught. (which one should be, it is against the tos)

now you are okay with guys trying to break the rules, free rolling honest players in a different manner?

also skier's program was within the rules at its inception, this skype tag-teaming thing was black from the start, so i don't understand why you are trying to connect the two issues here.

Damn, i wish i was aware of Skype groups etc cos my six buddies and i who used to play on Stars could have formed a such group and kept up with the Jones's.
Our one buddie who hadnt pulled 99% of his bankroll like we have, had a bit of a drink pre watching a Rugby World Cup match last week, where we all (Stars ex players) went to buddies to watch game and have a few drinkies. Anyways buddie was playing on Stars at the time and he had us as a captive audience. It is hard enough to win on Stars just playing honest, social type poker, let alone some of the cruel shyte that can happen. SNG was his forte and three times he got it in pre to be called by an underpair, the villains didnt even have to sweat some as they invariably flopped it in the window, and every time he had a high pocket pair someone had a bigger pair. One hand he had 56dd and ck raised Jammed a 4d J 7d to be called by villain with KQhh, of course our Hero bricked and villain adds Heros' stack to the 800 chips villain had after his dynamic call. As we watched our buddies crucifixion we were muttering about just how hard it is to win.

Poker players must be secret masochists to keep lining up and playing time after time when all you can achieve at best is to break even for a spell.

We all changed sites from Stars a little while back and with all this Bot, Collusion, Skype type groups,etc and the fact you need be either young to understand the tools etc (this being computer times and young dudes learn all this stuff from virtually out of nappies) all we wanted was a site where you can play and have some actual FUN and not worry about Third Party software etc. We think we have found it in PKR, and they have meet up Live tournies on a reg basis in London, where a couple have actually married thru meeting at such an event. Leave Stars to the wizards imo and i hope they enjoy themselves,whilst we mere mortal donk social players can do our money but not feel violated in nether regions, elsewhere.

Increasingly lately i have read, and heard musings about online pokers being on a decline, i think if this is so then it is going to get worse. It is too demanding a game, both mentally and fiscally to lure newbies into and then turning them into regs,so the pool is getting smaller and smaller and who can blame folks for staying away from playing,imagine you are a newbie wanting to try your hand at a little online pokers.....it dont look too hard,...must be easy as, then you deposit some and give it a shot,..easey peasey eh?.yeah right. The only folks who would keep depositing nowdays would be a Sammy( any two cardstype player) or as we commonly call them...Corporate Fraudsters who have nooo regard for green as it is not their own hard earned, but everything has a price and Fraudsters price when they do get caught is whether to take the top or bottom bunk when asked by cellmate Bubba.

The spin players are doing this because PS recently banned spinwiz register program because of this thread, which all got started because people were angry over skiers software. Some of the people speaking out against skiers software (which was more or less everyone who posted) played spin and goes and thus used spinwiz, or staked players that do, thus their crusade over skiers software ended up biting them in ass, because stars went much farther than just banning skiers software.

Yes I said the rules banning charts are super stupid because someone can easily have them up on a side computer and never get caught.

Is Table Ninja 1 legit? I received a message with a warning today that said me to turn off Tableninja.

It is no longer allowed because it has features that do not comply with the new Stars TPT rules they are implementing.

This is so disgusting by the owners of Tableninja. They know there are a group of players out there who were incredibly loyal customers of TN1 and don't like TN2. They know the fix to make TN1 compliant with Stars is roughly a 5 minute job for one of their programmers. And they also know that they can legitimately trot out the old line of its being "no longer supported" to hopefully force some of the TN1 users to switch to TN2.

How about just doing the right thing for once instead of the most profitable?