Quote:
Originally Posted by ULoseAnyway
I can't speak for others, but my list of bots is not based on some "feeling". I have been playing poker since 2009 and never had the urge to write anything about sites being rigged etc., that's why I never wrote to 2+2 before. It's only because I have provided WPN all the proofs multiple times (including all my HUD sample on them, key hands...) and they did nothing, if they did, the bots would be long gone.
My list of bots is evidence-based. I am not saying someone is a bot because he "acts fast, doesn't write to chat, plays close to GTO etc.". But obviusly I use detailed HUD and I have a very big sample on those "players". I am not gonna share any detailed info about their playing style, but here are some major factors that convince me someone is a bot:
- Their time to act is exactly the same in certain spots
- They have static bet sizing in certain spots
- Identical stats pre and postflop
- Hand selection in certain spots
- In past they were unable to sit back if they went sit out for the rest of the tournament
- they always play just jackpot games, never play anything else
- they play same stakes (for example mixing 10$ and 15$ games and nothing else) - come on, guys, they play very solid, which real poker player would get stuck on those limits every day and never play any higher stake or anything else?
- they never play or unregister the tournament we get a bonus ticket to every week (meaning they play it as sitting out)
- they have static playing hours
- they don't distinguish between different types of opponents and play exactly the same vs anyone
- they don't adapt to your game heads-up - you can do some crazy **** vs them all the time and while a real player would see that and play back, they never do
All those bots are the same, it is one program. That's why it is so easy for me to recognize it. If you guys have been playing poker for a long time, believe me, you would be able to spot it very easily.
I think there is a decent chance you are correct...on some or most of those who are accused of being bots. But, on its face, some of these points you bring up feel a little flimsy. No biggie. They don't play the Weekly tournament could be related to being a bot...or maybe they don't read English very well and/or aren't aware of the existence of the tournament in the first place. Just an example.
But sure, it is certainly possible and we know that bot rings are a thing.
There is always reason for skepticism or critical questioning of bot accusations...because there are so many incorrect accusations out there.
My hunch is that the poker sites themselves receive 10x more accusations against legitimate players. I have personally bern accused of being a bot quite a few times. Some who are the type to say, "I've played poker for a long time and I can tell."
I've played poker long enough to know that some bot accusations are laughably incorrect. Is 5 million hands enough poker? (I'm guessing. Have lost some databases over the years)
The 3-player spin-and-go format would be a tricky one to determine bots imo because the game can lead to a more formulaic style for certain individuals anyway.
But you seem to have a decent number of different elements that combined do potentially add up to something. That's IF all of the accused do ALL of the things on that list of evidence as I believe you are claiming.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NotSoFastBro
Guys do you want to know another proof about those accounts!
These bots are running by a company or a producer or a network or whatever, they usually change and upgrade their strategy and lines over time, So in my initial post, I talked about a specific stats of them which was iso jamming and funny thing is all those accounts now changed that line and they are not crazy iso jamming anymore!! all those accounts that are playing at same time, coincidence haa? or maybe because all of them are just a product of a company!
So I gave up just one specific thing and they resolved it! and interesting thing is this happened after I gave the URL of this thread to WPN game integrity on their forum! That is why we don't tend to share more technical stuffs about them! Honestly after I posted that, several times I thought about asking 2+2 support to remove that sentence from my post and I wish I did that, and now I feel terrible that they use that to eliminate that leak!
But now at least we know someone is reading this thread and obviously he doesn't care if we have a single digit posts background!!!
I would want to know how many of these accounts were iso jamming and how frequently they are doing so....and how much they are doing so after you think they changed.
But if it is 20 accounts all going from super-frequent iso-jam (more than you seeing them do it once or twice) straight to all of them never doing it at all then I agree that is certainly suspicious and decent evidence. And also possibly indicative of them seeing this thread.
However, I have played quite a few fishy players in spin-n-gos who just love to shove or iso-shove especially in their first hands or first few hands...sometimes multiple times. I've seen this a lot from fishy players at heads-up SNG too. First hand of the heads up...low blinds....preflop shove!! LOL. I will typically have slightly looser standards to call the shove in such a scenario and I end up seeing K3o or something silly.
Semi-related: I've been accused of somehow being unethical when I shove maybe a little bit earlier than others (in terms of stack sizes) against slightly more passive players who would be the type to want to limp in when we have 6BB left or something.
Last edited by Mike Haven; 09-12-2021 at 02:50 PM.
Reason: 2 posts merged