I like it, nice!

I requested some wiggleation to my avatar..If you notice my guy is a little more creepy then the others.

I like it

And I am getting ready to go take a look at the 10% cashout site. Hope they accept US players...

i just downloaded betraiser and they had 21 players at 5 tables

http://pokerscout.com/SiteDetail.asp...ser&ab=7752390

Might make a good site for mass move and forum advertising etc, or just a good charging method to consider for community run poker sites etc. Obv traffic too lame to grind the site now

I guess with this site available we really have no reason to moan about rake. The thing is there will always be "Obv traffic too lame to grind the site now" unless people made a concerted effort to play on there. Maybe if we had one table of this site running along side our regular number of tables then the traffic would increase 1000's of %. I know this is not likely to happen as people talk about things and moan but never really want to put the effort in to change things themselves. We are all just sitting around hoping that PS and FT listen to us and reduce the rake i.e reduce their profits. I am thinking we have zero chance of this happening.

I will sign up for this site today and try and keep a table open for a couple of hours a day. Who knows, if a few of us just do this it may snowball into something bigger and that would really get our precious PS and FT thinking.

I'm gonna start a cashout-rake-back site and be an affiliate for them

I love these threads. It amazes me how even some good players don't really stop to think about how exorbitant the rake is.

I changed my avatar on PS to this rake one and they allowed it.

maybe it would be a good idea to open this thread so we can discuss what we can do...

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...munity-938389/

Everyone knows the rake is too high, but there is nothing you can do about it. We follow the fish, the fish dont care about rake, the sites have no incentive to lower it. If a lower rake website were made, the regs wouldnt move there unless the fish did. The fish wouldnt move there unless they were bombarded with commercials and the site got a bunch of pros. But the website wouldnt be able to compete becauase it wouldnt make enough money to blow up the TV with commercials. Furthermore, the pros dont care about rake because they dont pay rake.

the french have bbeen able to put enough pressure on poker sites to lower the rake by sitting out everywhere

with that kind of mentality nothing will change.
wake up people and do something.

yes pls reopen that thread, can't understand why an brilliant project like that was locked in the first place. If the dev wants to make some profit out of it then good for him, it still means a much better playing environment.

I couldn't agree more nice post OP

french rake is still ridiculous high

Agreed, I have no problem playing a bunch of regs if I pay almost no rake.

Anyone who uses a pic on a site or on stars plz post and show it. thanks lol

my 2+2 avatar was accepted on PS

Mind showing a screenshot? Thanks

ok what about writing a petition that we agree on , it gets stickied to the first page of this thread and then anyone who is interested can send it to Tilt/Stars.

Something like:

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We, the 2+2 community think the rake of the poker industry is too high and we call for it to be reduced!

Many people who play a high volume rake over $5000 per month! How can an online service be charging 1 person an amount that would allow him to rent 5 houses?

The poker economy is in very bad shape and a big reason for this is that the rake is so difficult to beat. A very good player might have a winrate of around 3BB/100 before the rake. If that player plays at $2/$4 he will have 100% of his winnings taken by the site with 1/3rd returned in the form of rakeback. How is it fair that this player is taxed 66% of all he wins? Now what about a competent player making mistakes but only winning 2BB/100, he receives nothing at all!! This just isn't fair!

Another factor is that the bad players will always lose, but the rake makes them lose really really fast. Perhaps there would be more chance this player reloads if his deposit lasts a month rather than a week since he felt he got better value for his deposit.

This is a benefit not only to the players but also to the site since a lower rake leads to more people playing, more people moving up stakes and continuing to generate revenue. It would not be surprising if lowering the rake actually increases a sites profit, perhaps not this year, but maybe in a couple years time.

We call for the rake to never be more than 1BB/100 for any stake and that the rake be capped at a reasonable amount of $500 per month. A rake cap would encourage loyalty to a site, since once the cap is reached, the player is playing rake free and wouldn't want to be playing anywhere else.

We urge you to take this matter seriously and consider becoming the industry leader in fairness to your players, and demonstrate that the future of online poker is bright.

Yours sincerely

X

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So that's a rough draft, please feel free to edit or completely redo until we have a final product. Anyone like this idea?

i like but lets just be honest that is not was going to happen at least not in near future...

yeh it's unlikely to make a difference, but why not let the site hear our voice? Change has to start somewhere.