Hi guys I never really post here but I want to raise attention to yet another PStars issue, and to ask for your opinion.

I played 3 PLO HUSNGs during PokerStars "Mission Week" all-in shootouts. Two of them were of 100$, one of 200$. The structure was turbo, and I've been a regular there as of late.

During these games, due to all ins at the shootouts, the software froze various times, some of them for minutes. It led to ending up playing as high as 60/120 or 75/150 at HU SNG of 1500 chips, after not having played that many hands (I think only a few times I played over 25/50 in all my normal matches, and never that limits).

Obviously I reported the problem to the support, and asked to be refunded for the money I ended up losing. I paid for a service I was not given, and it wasn't my responsibility, therefore I shouldn't be held financially responsible for not winning - had I known the conditions, I wouldn't have played in the first place.

Their response was the following, after three days of waiting:

"We have reviewed your hand histories ... and found that you did not miss any hands or chips due to these lags ... Since we do not want to profit from this situation, we have refunded the tournament fee for these events" (for a total amount of $13 dollars or so).

What do you think?

Thanks!

youre lucky you got $13 back...

im shocked they even gave that I am expecting 50% cashout admin fees soon.

so basically they can disrupt the games and change the conditions of the games they offered without compensation to costumers?

This is the new PokerStars you're dealing with. In the past, I would usually ask for a couple refunds a year when my connection lagged out and never came back up (and i was regged in all my normal lobbies). I was supernova at the time. I always got the refunds.

Would you have shipped back the profit to Stars if youd won?

exactly - I had been refunded in the past for the exact same situation with no problems at all, and not this time. So I sent extracts of those emails to them and simply asked what is the difference between the situations. They NEVER answer. I asked two questions over an over in my emails to which they refuse to answer. They are:

a) Did you or did you not create in your client the expectation that he'd have an uninterrupted game, which you did not fulfill, and therefore altered the agreed pre-conditions between client and service?
b) What is the different rationale between this situation, and the situation were a few months ago I got fully refunded for a buy-in of a sit-and-go 6max turbo in the exact same situation?

And the extract from previous mails is: "Since all players were affected the issue must have come from our servers. And as we value you as a player at PokerStars we have decided to give you the refund for this tournament. This means that your PokerStars account has now been credited with $___, the amount of the buy-in. We hope this is a solution that you appreciate, and we thank you for bringing this to our attention".


They simply said "We have no interest in debating this situation with you". The only explanation given is the similar conditions to both players, to which I asked: if the SM freezes up to 1000/2000 blinds, conditions are the same too but does it matter to those who pay the entry fee?!

Anyway...

And had shipping the money back had I won is not the question - they are the service providers and we are the customers with legitimate expectations. If they fail, they are to blame, not us. That should be crystal clear.

Where once was the customer there is a new king, his name is shareholder value, he kinda rules the world.

Indeed. But it's really frustrating because I honestly (or should I say obviously) wouldn't have played under the conditions I ended up having for the three games.

And the lack of answers is appalling - just admit the different rationales. Similar situations now simply have different outcomes?

It's pretty much the only question that determines whether youre asking for fair compensation or trying to freeroll.

They refunded you the money you paid them for the service they provided. They essentially gave you a hyper instead of a turbo or w/e but you still had equal opportunity to win as your opponent.

Ive been as hard as anyone on 2p2 in criticizing Stars on their changes; to the point i publicly told a rep to get ****ed. And i was 20 tabling SNGs when these lags happened and was affected too. But you really went wronged to the point you deserve a freeroll here. Imo

I understand your point but there are two issues that remain unanswered to either way. Firstly, why the different response this time, when last time they acknowledge their fault and gave me the compensation and not this time?

And most importantly, it's the question of legal expectations of a service provider. If you are the intermediator that provides you the chance to face another client, you must guarantee that the service you provide runs as expected. If it affects both clients, you are the one that should take the hit, regardless of ending up losing money yourself. That's the perks of providing the service. I am a lawyer and it's something you learn on the first year of any legal course - there's an agreed contract between two sides (in this case me and PokerStars) based on the legitimate expectations on both sides. And mine weren't taken care of. And their responsibility amounts to the total I put on the line under circumstances that differed from what they guaranteed.