It is rake, but I guess its too difficult for PPN to come up with a points formula for the tournament rake like every other online poker site does.

no doubt the consensus is to award tourney points in the same proportion that rake points are awarded but i'm pretty sure i've played some sites that didn't give points for tourney play (microgaming?) and some that gave less points than the number of points given for an equal amount of rake paid. There certainly is little consistency on the way various sites award rake points, some use "earned" rake, some use "contributed" rake, some award points only if u called the flop, etc. So, you are not justified in expecting that such matters be done a certain way.

The important question is why wouldn't a site want to reward tourney play similarly to the way they reward cash table play? I'm sure there is a significant portion of players who only want to play tourneys and/or sng's. For such players the offer of deposit bonuses and rakeback has no appeal whatsoever.

No, its not the same proportion as most sites award less for tourney fees. The reason is quite obvious as well ... you only pay it once, on cash game you have to play more most of the time to generate the same rake and thus you trigger more action.
Correct. But maybe Gio can help us understand as to why this huge flaw has not been fixed yet in how many months / years?

Anyone tell me how long the servers will be down for during the reset on Stars in a couple of mins?

I assume it was a conscious programming decision, not a flaw as such. I don’t even remember it coming up before. Altho it has occurred to me, there was no issue before the changes last month that reduced the minimum number of players which allowed a tourney to run.

I think I would play more tourneys if tourney fees were treated like rake. Would you?

Can I get a +1?

I do believe you are on the wrong thread my friend

Some replies to some questions/comments posted by posters:

Tournament fees should be treated as rake paid. This is an item that is on our list to have looked into by the network.

We have done some spot promos where a certain amount of people get $5 by creating an account and e-mailing our support. Hopefully this will help get some people on the tables to get games going and jump start the network. The only way to get the network and rooms going is to invest money into it. You just can't build a room and "hope" people show up to play. That's not how it works. This is not only true for RR but all existing rooms on the network.

For those players that have won prior freerolls, I believe the figure was mentioned as $5,000 worth, why they aren't showing up to play is a bit mind numbing. They have to play 1x their money one to cash out so they might as well come and play. I believe changes need made around the freeroll to get people out and playing.

The WSOP promotion that was mentioned is a Rounders Row promotion only and if traffic picks up as a whole, it by far is the easiest way to win a Main Event seat.

For those of you that come and visit the network and don't see any action, don't be afraid to create an account and help build a network that will be a viable option for USA players. Poker Stars, Tilt or any other room wasn't built overnight, it took time. The same holds true here.

Those that are existing members, sit on tables, don't wait for someone to start one, why not sit yourself and be a leader and not a follower. Refer a friend, transfer them $5 and help get things going. There's a difference between those that can and those that do.

Have a great weekend all and keep the comments/suggestions coming.

I do have a question: Has ELG paid out your whole funds when you moved from Everleaf to PPN?

No and I would venture they never will.

After this reply, let's leave ELG out of this topic as there is enough negative with ELG and we want to have PPN be a major positive.

Thanks

i agree. btw EVERLEAF SUCKS!!! oops, did i say that out loud?

Thought so, thanks for the confirmation because there is not really any other place to get the answer.

Good luck.

great news, when can u make that happen? and what about bringing back rake races and adding tourney races? can u do that? the bounty tourney was popular, i would like to see that again too

Indy thanks for the input. Things are going to take some time. The network powers will make the ultimate decision on how things work out in the end. We can only continue to voice our thoughts/concerns/ideas/suggestions.

This not only needs to come from us but current and potential players. However it needs to be in a constructive manner, I am not saying it isn't now but we all know how negative things can get at times.

The network has made changes based on our recommendations thus far. Such as 2/4 cent NL tables, more tournaments, lowering the required registration amount needed for tournaments to name a few.

There is a lot to do, we all agree on that. The new software when completed will take care of a lot of the current issues and deliver above and beyond the current software. Those that did beta testing know that.

For now however, some items are a little bit harder than others due to software restrictions or time needed to get things done.

I can't promise or deliver everything asked for. I will say this though once the network starts to grow you will see more promotions like you mentioned and more.

I know I have said in the past that patience is needed and that is still the case. You've seen some baby steps so you know things are moving in the right direction, it's just not all going to happen over night.

Thanks again for your input.

Results of the Sunday $100 freeroll
March 10
30 players

1. MrsTater $40
2. Ean $24
3. JustFKNdave $16
4. 1BEACHBUM $12
5. Fuglynutz0 $8

I seem to be the only one to answer your call to action.

I'm waiting at a bunch now if you wanna play

Wow, looks like PPN doubled the number of cash game players.

to 4?

Last night we had 5 tables going, NL and Fixed. I think you'll find some action around 8PM Eastern. So if you have that freeroll money, you might as well start putting it to use.

I know 5 tables isn't a lot but considering typically there isn't any going, we are making a step in the right direction.

Theres a bit of a glitch in the RR skin at the omaha tables that prevent u from seeing all 4 hole cards in the corner seats.You can only see all of em in the middle parts of the table.At the corners the player name box blocks 2 of the 4 cards

Results of the Sunday $100 freeroll
March 17
27 players

1. rIlbas $50
2. Must8Fish $30
3. chs600 $20

that rIlbas guy/gal has won $120.00 in freerolls in the last month but I don't remember EVER seeing him play a cash game. He scoops up winnings that he can never withdraw because he can only withdraw it if he meets the play through requirements. What a waste! How hard would it be to limit access to this tourney to players who have paid at least a penny in rake in the 6 days (or 6 days plus how ever many hours before they get around to entering the player names on Sunday) prior to the tourney? they already keep weekly rake stats Monday thru Sunday.

rIlbas is hardly a new player, he has been placing in the freeroll for a very long time. We could still encourage new players with the freeroll by giving them a certain number of tickets to the freeroll or adding them to the entrants list for a certain number of weeks after they sign up.

While I understand what you are saying I respectfully disagree with limiting players. I've probably never played a cash table on PPN but I do use my freeroll winnings to play in tournaments when they come up to meet my schedule. Discouraging any new players by requiring paid play isn't the way to invite new blood to the site. Maybe he is saving it up for use in tournaments once people start showing up. He may not even know about the play through requirement. Before it was mentioned here, I had no idea. Had I known, I might not have bothered playing on PPN.

Speaking of the rake rate to clear money, I have $300 or more in freeroll money. I don't really understand how the rake ratio works out and you seem to have a firm grasp on it. How may hands, hours, days, weeks, whatever would it take to clear that money so it is no longer freeroll money? Not sure if I am asking the question clearly so hopefully you can fill me in. I'm sure it depends on the game stakes and table but I'll let you give me some examples if you would be so kind.




The above was from last night. I was disconnected and when I came back in once again I arrive on my turn with no cards. I also had trouble doing my first rebuy in the $2.00 rebuy/addon game. I sensed the first three people that went out also had trouble as they did not get back in the game. I was trying to do mine at the beginning of the game, when the first hand was dealt, but the chips button wouldn't function. I think I had to shut the table down and then restart it but not the whole client.

Congratulations on your freeroll success!! The clearance rate for clearing your winnings for withdrawal is only 1:1. That means for every one dollar of rake you pay you clear one dollar for withdrawal. The minimum withdrawal by Western Union is $200.00. You can keep track of your rake paid over the current month and the two preceding months by clicking Rake Statistics on the Game menu in the main lobby window. As you say, the rate at which you clear your winnings depends on the type of games and stakes you play. The play through requirement is found in the terms of service, promotional pages and has been mentioned in this forum on numerous occassions for a very long time.

Tournament play does not clear your bonus at this time. I invite discussion of whether tournament play should count to clear bonus and promotional winnings. If you do not play tournaments now are you going to play if doing so would help to meet your play through requirements? We want to know how players feel about this.

Of course you are welcome to play tournaments and you should be able to find tournaments that fit your needs under the new scheduled tourneys, but you can't play if you don't sign up.

Unresolved problems with the rebuy tournaments has led to the discontinuation of all but the sunday tourrney. When most people have problems with a rebuy or add on they disconnect from the game client and return. If you disconnect for any reason you will find that you may have problems if you do not return before the hand begins. Most of the players who play the rebuys know this and all the regular readers of this thread know it and adjust accordingly or simply do not play that tournament. I suggest you sign up for non-rebuy tournaments found on the "scheduled" tab.