My first reaction to the whole thing was to watch it happening since I was playing in a tourney on Tops at the time. I did notice that it seemed, in the brief instances I was able to watch, that the ID's in question didn't seem to play in hands against each other - except for one, and that was about the time I busted out of my tourney and closed up the software. I came back to the thread and it was just one post after another, and the tone of it all just irked me. That's why I posted what I did. Things like that sometimes set me off. If the guy cheated, alright, he cheated. He deserves to pay the consequences no matter who he is. But like I said a few pages ago - the OP could have taken a little bass out of his voice, so to speak, and went about it a more proper way.

I've never traded with Mega either - just went through all of my archived PM's (I saved them to a text file after hitting 1000 sent/received a while back) and the only trade talk I had with him was when I PM'd him looking to sell Lock on October 16th, 2012. He replied "good on lock, ty".

I was a Lock affiliate only for the purpose of running the weekly 2+2 deep stack tourneys - but I haven't done a thing with it since I stopped playing in the tourney (ColdPlayChip posted and kept it going for a while, but it eventually just died off). I contacted Shane in November of 2012 about wanting to be able to create a private tourney and I had to go through becoming an affiliate to do it. But I haven't done anything with that - wouldn't even have much of a clue how to go about setting it up anyway.

Buzz, I do respect you but what you wrote makes me question your "unbiased" stance as a moderator of O8 forum. You come across as protecting one person instead of protecting EVERYONE involved who plays O8 and who post in the O8 forum. Name me a situation when 2+2 forum has exposed multiple scandals/rule breaking and those players were taken to court to be prosecuted? It just doesn't happen. This isn't circumstantial evidence we are talking about either. MD has posted multiple accounts in 2+2 as well as his online blog and has flaunted about VPN use on Facebook as well as other areas including what BoBo posted.

Your responsibility is to the ENTIRE O8 community not just 1 player.

Whoa there fella. Claiming that he's "biased" because his opinion of the allegations in this thread doesn't mesh with yours is ridiculous, especially when you consider who you're directing this at.

Besides, what Buzz (or I) think about what's been alleged doesn't make it any more or less likely to be true, and nobody has prevented anyone from talking about it, anywhere.

And of course it's circumstantial evidence. But circumstantial evidence is still evidence.

I think that your post is very well said.

People get convicted, in a court of law, on circumstantial evidence all the time. In fact it's rare to find a case, convicted after trial, with a full blown confession.

Well first thing is no one has been accused of a crime. There is no punishment in terms of a justice system. Now a jury is not robotic in nature and thus cannot be impartial.(No matter how much people want to believe this.) This thread for example has MegaDisgruntled as cheating and that is going to cause people to assume that there is evidence that MegaDisgruntled is cheating. Even if he is not cheating. However there are a lot of questions that would raise some eyebrows. At the least MegaDisgruntled is guilty of not identifying that he was trading on behalf of a friend. If that is all that he has done.

I think you made it obvious how partial you are earlier in this thread.

People sure do get sick a lot when this sort of thing happens.

Actually, I think that you made it obvious how partial you are earlier in this thread.

You are missing my point and I may very well had not expressed it properly. I think the way Buzz expressed himself came off as someone who has a personal relationship with MD and is standing up for a friend(despite the continued mounting evidence) instead of being impartial. As a moderator of the entire O8 forum I think the stance he has taken and expressed comes across poorly to the rest of the O8 players who play online as well as other online players.

As I stated with Buzz in PM, I did not want to post this in O8 forum just yet until this played out for another day or two. MD is a well respected member of the O8 forum and he deserves the chance to answer these allegations. I think 24-48 is a fair time frame.

But Buzz does not have a personal relationship with Mega. In fact, I don't believe Buzz has ever played O8 on line, and certainly not at the higher stakes games that Mega frequented. So I am not sure why you would even make such an accusation when there's not a shred of evidence to support it. I know Buzz can (and probably will) speak for himself, but I'll take the liberty of stating that the mods of the O8 forum are not acting to protect Mega and have no reason to be biased for him or against him. Personally, knowing Mega to a very limited degree through 2+2 and the tables over the years, I *hope* the allegations prove to be untrue, but there's no reason to view this story with any bias one way or the other. The facts as they come out will speak for themselves.

It's odd that you think that what Buzz said -- basically "innocent until proven guilty" -- is something that "comes across poorly", but of course in that respect you're entitled to your opinion. I do agree with the sentiment about seeing how this plays out for another day or two before drawing conclusions.

Since this thread is on 2+2 already, why should 2+2 Omaha 8 players have to stumble onto the Internet Poker thread to know what Mega is being accused of?

We know 100% that he has multiple accounts on the same site. We know 99.99% that he plays poker using VPN. These facts are confirmed through his own words, not circumstantial evidence. He already has an unfair advantage by doing these two things.

The evidence that he is playing under two accounts at the same table is circumstantial but appears strong. Who only knows what other information would surface when the full 08 community is made aware of the situation.

You are correct sir. I am partial to evidence. I don't know mega. I don't know you, but I know that anyone accused of this with rational explanations would have cleared this up within a 24 hour period.

The fact that you are making this stance just shows that you are somehow being negatively affected by all of this.

You don't have to play online or play same stakes with a person to become friends with someone else. MD is a regular poster in O8 forum correct? I also know O8 is a tight nit group which I think is pretty awesome and you guys care for each other as well. I get no kicks out of seeing this happened to him. O8 is my fav game and I respect all of the regs who play but this is a serious accusation and affects a lot of us who play.

Who said they have to? I am not aware of anyone being stopped from cross-referencing this thread in O8.

Bottom line is, he should be banned from future trading on 2p2 for a violation of Mike Havens Page 1 rules. Which he admitted to trading on an account and not disclosing it wasn't his (if you believe his story).

Also, all sites he's confirmed accounts on should be advised of this thread for thorough investigation.

And it will get posted. I will post in O8 forum this whole situation but I am waiting 24-48 hours until this plays out further. MD has a chance to respond in that time period or someone else can prove OP or others in this thread wrong.

Judging from Buzz's response, he's seems to be inferring that he wouldn't allow a cross-reference thread to remain in the 08 forum.

Buzz Pm'd me to allow cross references. That is not the case.

Right now I think a cross-reference is appropriate, directing people to this thread if they want to discuss or have information to share. IMO, all of the info that people may have -- O8 players and otherwise -- would be best kept in one thread (this one).

Thanks for the clarification. I don't have a personal stake in the matter as I've pretty much stop playing poker after BF, but hate it when players are cheating.

Agreed.

It's also pretty rare also to have a trial when someone's confessed. :-)

Many may not know that MegaDisgruntled was allegedly in the hospital for quite a long period of time, and his wife was even posting on the O8 forum. Whether this was a scam too, I don't actually know.

MegaDisgruntled weighs around 5-600lbs so I actually believe the hospital part. There's a thread around somewhere in the O8 forum.

My point is, and many attorney's will agree, sometimes circumstantial evidence is just as strong as a confession. So we shouldn't just dismiss what we see in the OP for lack of actual confession from the accused.

As for his health problems, I'm not sure what bearing that has, unless you feel it may be a motive.

Which is why I thought Buzz saying what he did about "court of law" was a bit ridiculous as well as stating the evidence which was presented was not strong enough. It really comes across as a biased opinion and protecting "one of his own".