I would like to say thank you to Msauce for keeping this movement organized. It is extremely important that we all stick together and on point with our concerns. It's the ONLY way Pokerstars will take our voices seriously.

I will be sitting out 24tables of NL200 SH

And yeah would be great if someone updated the list

Full ring player should wake up, here are my numbers using GobletTamer's sql codes on my HEM database:

365k raked hands
Dealt --> WC = 36.7% reduction in VPPs for me.
Dealt --> WTA = 30,4% reduction in VPPs for me.

99% NL100 Fullring

Let's get this dialogue started. I will either be grinding out 3000 VPPs and starting my SNE run on Jan 1st, or continuing my boycott and joining this movement. Time is against us now, let's open the dialogue.

Here is why I think lowering rake to 4% would be better than 6.5x or 7xVPP

It's better for the poker economy as a whole. It helps fish lose money slower.

- If you give fish more VPP, they still will have their crap silverstar/goldstar fpp multiplier so won't get full value. Moreover, they most likely spend FPPs on stuff like tshirts, caps, etc.

- If you lower the rake, they become bigger WINNERS in the game. Of course, they are losers, so it ends up that they lose at a lower rate. This is great for the games, it's good for the long term and it's also good for us regs. This way, we insure that the changes bring MONEY into fish's accounts, rather than FPPs = caps and tshirts.

Agreed, rather they lower rake than give out more VPP's/FPP's.

Ive noticed a decline in customer support over the past 2 years and this is a culmination of that. I played on pstars long after ftp made changes to combat ssers out of loyalty hurting my bottom line. I now have no sort of loyalty to them and will happily take my business based 100% on what my expectation in the games offered are unless they make an honest attempt at making this right.

The fact that they removed the only good things to offset any changes as a response to our complaints is indicative of their disrespect to us as paying customers.

What a joke.

+1

wrt Full Ring vs rest of site VPP discrepancy:

I think a lot of this feeling towards FR players being more privileged than everyone else is really misdirected. Rather than, as in the past, saying lets increase our rest of site benefits if we can but if we can't can Stars knock those FR players down a notch, take a look at the situation as a whole.

FR players still think that despite their higher compensation for same rake paid, they are still getting screwed. If that statement is in fact true, the rest of the site is getting completely raped. It doesn't make any sense to say well if we're getting raped, then FR should be getting raped too. That doesn't improve the rest of site situation at all, it just leaves you in the same rut while irrationally making you feel a little better about it -- kind of like how you feel much better about your downswing if you see a worse graph from someone else even though it doesn't put any money in your pocket. Don't blame the FR players for receiving more. Blame the site for not giving you your fair share.

A more productive approach would be to ask what do Full Ring players need to feel fairly compensated, do that, and then increase benefits for the rest of the site to match. I agree that 6x site wide still sucks for FR because 6x isn't enough for us in the first place, which probably means an increase to 6x still sucks for the rest of the site despite being an improvement. So increase FR to 6.5x to compensate them fairly, and then boost the rest of the site to 6.5x too.

Tangent: I'm not sure exactly how the additional BoP for SNGs plays into this, but quite frankly if they get 6.5x + BoP, and I just get 6.5x for cash while feeling that's fair for me, then good for them and good for the poker economy as a whole. Using this whole WC fiasco as a prime example, I don't care who gets more than I do as long as the worst deal on the site is the baseline and the baseline is fair. Anything above and beyond that is simply money in the economy rather than in shareholder's wallets.

It's been about 1.5 years since they named Gabriel Campos Woslavsky as their new CEO. He had 0 as the primary operator of a poker site and advertises his specialty as cutting costs. Shocker he thinks screwing over every regular on the site for the sake of a bit more profit on the year is a good idea. Of course there's a little problem when you reduce 'costs' by 20% and lose 30% of your liquidity.

My name is already on the sit-out list but for clarification, I will be sitting out on .5/1 to 2/4 FR LHE tables, if a few other FR LHE players would decide to join me that would be great.

Edit: I made a thread in the micro LHE forums to raise awareness

Put me on this list. Be sitting out of 24 tables of 50/1 NLH 6 Max.

I'm gonna be sitting out across 50nl - 200NL either fr or 6max depending on where there are fewer ppl sitting out at the time. obv i'll start w/200 but if there's already a ton of folks sitting out there and there's not much point, i'll focus my efforts on 100nl where there's more tables


Is it fair to say these are our 'wishes'? We should prob iron out a final list before tomorrow evening IMO


Personally I'd prefer rake be lowered to 4% rather than the multiplier for reasons stated in my previous post.

Agreed. Sit out where your BR allows but take a look around the lobby and determine if there's a gap in coverage even if it's not your regular game.

I'll join you guys at 100-200NL but it prob won't be til like after 3pm EST.

Don't forget to change settings from max buy to min in case you have BR issues and want to max out 24 tables.

i would not be at home during the 1st sit out so i cant help but count me in for the next one for sure

No problemo I think there will be a lot of Strikes from now on until we are compensated for our losses. It would be a pitty if we'd only strike once.

Can you guys please, for the love of god, stop saying **** like this. I should not have to explain why.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...&postcount=878

This post by Duckslayer2k is good.

I've not crunched too many numbers but what are the reasons we would prefer 6.5x or 7xVPP over a decrease of rake to 4%? Are there any?

forgot to say what i would be sitting out.

count me in for 24tables of FR 1/2 and 2/4

Cash game players get Milestone hands that SNG players cant participate in. Didnt run the numbers or anything.....

Yes everyone should get the same VPP/$, if any of you have a good reason why FR players should get more, lets here it. If you dont, kindly stfu

Pretty sure people would accept either an increase in VPP multiplier or a decrease in rake%.



Even FTP rolled out the black card program to give a little that the company take back to the community. Stars = you get nothing in return with this massive take. No wonder Stars put this announcement up after Christmas.



If Stars had made this announcement before Christmas, the company will be the new Grinch/Scrooge of the poker world in 2011.

I will be sitting out in the micros and the low stakes, looks like most of you are sitting out in .50/1 and up, if you guys se them as full of sitouts when you join you should consider the micros, so that we cover the entire site.