Please suggest how they might prove this. The fact is that all they could do is the exact same thing thousands of players do already, and that is show that samples of the output follow normal distributions and have no predictable patterns (i.e. non-random). And from that you can infer that the chance of it being rigged is very low. The confidence is really better with lots of player samples than with a site-provided sample, which riggies won't believe anyway. Proof is not possible.

If you do have a black swan hand history then you need to quit whining about it and share it with the world so people who do understand the math can have a look, otherwise stfu about it.

lol, it's much less pathetic getting banned and creating new account daily.

Man that guy has some kind of mental disability. Surprised he doesn't get OTB&C'd every time

PM me for my email address that you can send all the histories you have, along with every type of analysis and graphing you want done and I'll do it for you within a few days....if it doesn't take me more than a few hours I won't even charge you, fair enough?

He also managed to get through 14 accounts trolling in the software forum before he even discovered the Zoo!

I think he has some kind of personality disorder (seriously).

Juk

I think he is what is technically know, in Southern Ireland, as a 'stoopid, stoopid, eejit".

I'll offer this as well. I suggest you just zip them up and upload them somewhere, and several people would be willing to review them.

I ban him every time now, but I leave his posts intact for everyone's enjoyment.

If he started getting abusive again with one of his accounts, I'd probably OTB&C.

I'm hoping that at some point he'll get the hint that he isn't welcome here any more, but I'm not optimistic.

This.

But I don't use this as a negative. I've learned that much of the posters here don't have much of a life outside this forum. This and online poker is the only communication they have.

This is why I feel bad for sometimes being rude to other users.

I was playing the $3,000 mega freeroll at Party Poker and in a prize position.
The tournement crashed however they didn't not refund or distribute the prize money.

That to me is evidence of a site which is willing to cheat it's customers hence I would have to assume the site was rigged because it indicates a dishonest and immoral management.

The site in question is Party Poker and this is the relevant thread(s).

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/29...-alert-726615/

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28/internet-poker/

A site which is not whiter than white is black, for me any kind unfair behaviour makes the site untrustworthy and unplayable.


It's a bit like finding you doctor deal crack, does that mean he is a bad doctor?
No - but I am fooked if I am going to put my life in his hands!!

Dude, calm down. It's Party Poker. They are a publicly traded company!

You have an arguement that maybe you shoulda got some money back and they pocketed all the free roll money b/c of an error on their part....but untrustworthy and unpayable....no....Rigged...Hell no....

I haven't heard about this and haven't looked at those threads, but lets just look at this example, because I think it brings up a good point.

So party poker screwed some people out of freeroll money. Let's just accept that for the sake of the argument and accept that that's a bad thing.

You may legitimately, IMO, use this as an example to say that PP didn't treat its players fairly and that because of that you choose not to associate with that site anymore.

What you cannot do, however, is rationally assume that because they acted poorly in this one situation, that they are acting poorly in ALL situations and would do any conceivable scheme that you can concoct. You have one event for which you have evidence. That's legit. However this information cannot be used to draw any conclusions about any other SPECIFIC event. You may say you don't trust them and wouldn't be surprised if you found out they did other things, but you can't use it as evidence for any other specific nefarious activity.

That being said, finding out a site has done something nasty may be good reason to look at anything else they do with a fine tooth comb, and seek out other evidence. But that's as far as it goes.

That's why I find people like pooflinger and BOP so bizarre: they suspect that the sites are nefarious. Do NO serious investigation, and the kicker is: unlike the poster I'm replying to: they CONTINUE TO PLAY THERE! They say that they're stilll making money, so they play. That's like saying, my employer is holding back $100/week from my salary but I'll continue to work there, or the store clerk is holding back $10 of my change, but I'll continue to shop there. If you really think a site is conspiring to steal from you, it is madness to keep playing there. The guy a few posts up who went to bodog is at least rational in his response to his suspicions: leave the site.

When did you become so sensible?

TKs not really a riggie. He uses that language but he's really a crusader for regulation. I wish he made that more clear more of the time.

ShuffleMasters are rigged.

GG poker.

Well they way I look at it is - I have been cheat. Now why have I been cheated? Answer because they can get away with it.
Now that I have established they will cheat if they can get away with it I ask myself "Will they restrict the cheating to just this area?"
The answer to that is no, they will cheat wherever they can get away with it. There are other areas where they can cheat so I have to assume they cheat there too. it would be illogical not to.

OK if the site cheats and you are still winning that's not so bad, however you would be winning more elsewhere on a none cheating site.

But we are talking about two things, suspicion and proof, to very different things, but when Party Poker pocketed the $3,000 prize money that is proof beyond doubt for me, I no longer suspect, I know.

Those guys who still play there are still looking for proof, I have mine.
It makes it impossinle for me to play serious poker there. I would have to be mad to play serious poker there.

Cool, I will def. be getting in touch with one of you about an analysis. Hell, I even me be able to be convinced if my numbers turn out even close to expectation. I def keep an open mind.

This is pretty much a "Paranoid Minds for Dummies" excerpt.

This guy thinks he got slighted in a freeroll that was worth 6 cents or so, which who knows maybe he was and complaining about that is perfectly fine. I know I complain to Party a lot because their promos are a mess much of the time (sloppiness as opposed to evil conspiracy based). Frankly, I never complain when their badly thought out promos work for me too well.

In this case, assuming everything this fellow said is true (which is always iffy) then he had a reason to complain and he should email or call Party about it.

Instead he looked at this as an intentional action by Party to screw him and others in a freeroll. This is how a paranoid person will personify a situation in which he actually plays no significant role.

In his mind though he and Party Poker are the central characters, where he is the hero and Party Poker is the villain. Party Poker's perspective on this guy is "umm, who are you?" but in his mind it is "we have to screw that guy!"

So this person now is convinced he is the target of organized crime, and if he could be the target, then obviously Party Poker will do this to everyone all the time. After all, look at his case!

This is just a textbook case of paranoia and delusions of grandeur at work, nothing more, and the irony is that if guys like this instead approached the companies with their issues they would probably get compensation far more than they were "screwed," but instead they go this route. It's as if riggies need to always make the -EV play somehow.


poofguy is nothing more than the latest incarnation of that K guy who used this thread to post his unproven bad beat whines with all sorts of

KK<A4 - so rigged

posts. Like the K guy, this poofster is not a genuine riggie, just a guy who whines about bad beats a lot. Lots of those people like that in this game

BOP is a person who hates non-Americans who uses online poker as one of his many ways of expressing that. He is not a true riggie either, it just happens to work for his real agenda.

That's why they seem to make no sense. They really are not riggies. This pen guy if genuine (and I do suspect he may be) is more the classic case of a riggie who is paranoid and sees truths in his own mind. The other guys are just a whiner and a bigot - big difference.

Exactly. I really don't think think any RNG is "Rigged"
And I am known for coming to the rescue for the underdog and making them look inteligent by saying something really stupid.



Let's be honest, I can get flamed all day and made fun of and it probably wouldn't hurt my personal feelings(might piss me off) outside of this thread but to some it's different. This is it for some....

I usually apologize to people with in a few hours for being rude for that reason.(Unless you talk down to the PPA)

So think about that when somebody comes here(anywhere on 2+2) looking for a sense of belonging or a place in life.

Of course people like me deserved to get flamed sometimes, but it's easy to decipher between posters like me and the one's that I'm referencing.

See, this is why I quite like tk1133 most of the time, now.

Us eejits can't take ourselves too seriously.

I miss K13...

He's not a crusader for regulation. He's a crusader for US regulation because he doesn't trust the sites to be regulated outside of the US. Which i think leads back to... but whatever.

Why are you worried about what I want for my Country? It's a little deeper then that tho, but thanks for making a "TK1133 post."

Worry about your country and let Americans worry about theirs...

Alright Columbo nice try, but lets look at the facts, they pocket $3,000 of prize money which is funded by players rake. I have approached the company and they basically said f-off.

That's just not right.

Party Pokers role is to make as much profit as it can and it is not too fussy how it does it.
Anyway they screw me I screw them, I am entitled to relate the truth about how they operate, if it hits their bottom line that's their problem not mine.


Oddly enough I only think it us the Poker sites which have stolen my money/points directly (Will Hill, Party Poker) or sites which are proven to have been unsafe (AP & UB) which are 'out to get me'.
Is there a posh term for Psycological term that? A "Nevertrustcheatingbarstewardia" perhaps?

Tel me Monteroy, where did the $3,000 end up?

I have actually noticed problems with that freerol before but I never got into a prize position before.

Have they ever paid out - lol???

But you are right Monteroy, I have a deep pathalogical hatred of cheats, I wish you had too. you seem to have fallen in love with them

And pen15's little freeroll debacle has what to do with this thread? Or with anything actually. It's either a very bad level, or he is just plain stupid beyond repair. This same decision would have been made on every poker site in the world, and it has probably happened at one time or another on all of them.

Wel saying "They all cheat get over it" is not very reassuring, the connection is that if a site has a tendancy to cheat it is likely to do that in every area of it's operations.
It is an indicator, if you are fundamentally honest that will show up in everything you do, same goes for being dishonest, cheats don't care how they cheat all they care about is whether they can, and there are certainly plenty of otherways in which they could cheat without much fear of getting caught.