Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > > >

Discussion of Poker Sites General discussion of online poker sites.

View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes 3,445 34.94%
No 5,522 56.00%
Undecided 893 9.06%
Voters: 9860. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 03-31-2009, 05:19 AM   #1076
Rek
HUZA 2008
 
Rek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 10,034
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by DMoogle View Post
The only person who has posted his database results with skewed statistics turned out to be correct - there was something wrong.



His PokerTracker was lacking a patch that prevented erroneous data from being presented.
PokerTracker is rigged. I think it is owned by the poker sites to give out rigged results that conform to statistical probability.
Rek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 05:21 AM   #1077
Bobo Fett
Carpe Diem
 
Bobo Fett's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Canada, eh!
Posts: 52,394
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rek View Post
PokerTracker is rigged. I think it is owned by the poker sites to give out rigged results that conform to statistical probability.
Hahahaha...

I'm amazed this is the first time I've seen anyone post this. Rek, you've given them a whole different angle to use now.
Bobo Fett is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 05:57 AM   #1078
Rek
HUZA 2008
 
Rek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 10,034
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobo Fett View Post
Hahahaha...

I'm amazed this is the first time I've seen anyone post this. Rek, you've given them a whole different angle to use now.
Can you prove it's not true, you shill? I mean any time it is proved beyond doubt, PT simply put in a patch to correct it.

The truth will out. All it takes is a genius to think outside the box and expose the online poker cartel. I am that man and the net is closing. Be afraid shill, you have little time left to carry on your rigged scam.

Who is with me? come on guys, cast off those silver hats and fight. The revolution is here.
Rek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 05:59 AM   #1079
jukofyork
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
jukofyork's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Trollstopia, UK
Posts: 11,610
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rek View Post
PokerTracker is rigged. I think it is owned by the poker sites to give out rigged results that conform to statistical probability.
nh

Juk
jukofyork is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 06:29 AM   #1080
qpw
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pulling the tails of rigtards
Posts: 4,019
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rek View Post
Can you prove it's not true, you shill? I mean any time it is proved beyond doubt, PT simply put in a patch to correct it.

The truth will out. All it takes is a genius to think outside the box and expose the online poker cartel. I am that man and the net is closing. Be afraid shill, you have little time left to carry on your rigged scam.

Who is with me? come on guys, cast off those silver hats and fight. The revolution is here.
I think you should consider the timing aspect very carefully.

And is it a real deal?
qpw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 07:45 AM   #1081
SooperFish24
adept
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,028
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by 307 View Post
To all who question site fairness @ ft-stars or wherever, and in turn are rebuffed by the following:

''hey that's poker''

''your just a bad player, learn to play''

'' do you really think that a multimilliuon dollar company would risk that''

or whatever the latest poker room shill on 2 plus 2 spews, no your not crazy for thinking that being 1-2-3 outed on a consitent basis is abnormal.


the sites of course are higly leveraged to ensuring that there are as many players a possible playing, if your bankroll is short there is a very strong chance that you will run good, that you will hit your 3 outer, that you will hit your gutshot....etc. If your fully bankrolled for that specific limit, then you can be sacrifcied. It's simply business, unfair yes, but....


The standard shill response to this will be '' it's all controlled by an RNG'' as if a legimtate RNG can't have something introduced to determine a favoured event ( I.E. skewing the randomness of the cards).


Anyway, to anyone that reads this and thinks, ''Is this all in mind'' no it's not all in your mind. There is a very strong posibility that this happens at low limits.


But to prove it yourself once and for all, get a Poker Database, and play hands, and looks at the results for yourself > I did this, and once I collected the necessary data, the statistics were skewed severly enough that I stopped playing on-line.

Having said that, the poker discussions on here are excellent, and the site is also first rate, but the Poker is Rigged area is too be avoided on this site, as their are numerous people on here who have a vested interest to berate posters of that opinion.
+1
SooperFish24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 07:47 AM   #1082
Rek
HUZA 2008
 
Rek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 10,034
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Hey SooperFish are you signing up to my revolution?
Rek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 07:53 AM   #1083
qpw
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pulling the tails of rigtards
Posts: 4,019
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
+1
Poor old Sooperfish.

Still in denial about the fact that he sucks at poker.

Still trying to blame it on the deal.

Still being a rigtard.

So sad.
qpw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 08:02 AM   #1084
Rek
HUZA 2008
 
Rek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 10,034
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by qpw View Post
Poor old Sooperfish.

Still in denial about the fact that he sucks at poker.

Still trying to blame it on the deal.

Still being a rigtard.

So sad.
Why don't you bog off you shill. Who is paying you? Can you prove you don't work for RiverStars or FullRiggedPoker? No thought not.
Rek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 08:05 AM   #1085
qpw
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pulling the tails of rigtards
Posts: 4,019
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

I thought it would be profitable to take the Partystar's shilling.
qpw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 11:56 AM   #1086
SooperFish24
adept
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,028
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rek View Post
Hey SooperFish are you signing up to my revolution?
Whats this about a revolution Rek?

I m already never depositing on an online poker site ever again. I just play with the little I have left after cashing out in january.
SooperFish24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 12:02 PM   #1087
SooperFish24
adept
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,028
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by qpw View Post
Poor old Sooperfish.

Still in denial about the fact that he sucks at poker.

Still trying to blame it on the deal.

Still being a rigtard.

So sad.
[ ] poor

[ ] old

[ ] suck at poker

[x] blaming it on the deal

[x] rigtard

[ ] sad

[x] qpw is a paid shill/troll acting in defence of online poker no matter what argument/evidence is presented

[x] qpw needs new 2+2 account as its become very obvious what he s here for. Get a new name your too obvious shill.

Get out of the forum/threads shill.
SooperFish24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 12:13 PM   #1088
Markusgc
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Markusgc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Noodles, Hockey & Punk Rock!
Posts: 8,788
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rek View Post
PokerTracker is rigged. I think it is owned by the poker sites to give out rigged results that conform to statistical probability.
I can't tell you how I know this, but there are links between the software developers of Golden Tee Golf and PokerTracker.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 307 View Post
To all who question site fairness @ ft-stars or wherever, and in turn are rebuffed by the following:

''hey that's poker''
Just recently I posted an example of a hand where my opponent (vastly inferior, imo) had made a series of horrible decisions but made his hand on the river after putting all his money in WAY behind on the turn. I pointed out that since it was a tournament, the "rigged for action" theory couldn't apply. Also, that player didn't go on to cash either, so the idea it's "rigged for fish" didn't pan out either.

I was then told by a known rigtard...

"That's poker."

Oh, so that's poker. Gotchya.

Last edited by Markusgc; 03-31-2009 at 12:18 PM.
Markusgc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 12:15 PM   #1089
Rek
HUZA 2008
 
Rek's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: London
Posts: 10,034
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
[x] qpw is a paid shill/troll acting in defence of online poker no matter what argument/evidence is presented.
+1

qpw ignores all the evidence and always has done. I'm going to list it all below and see what he has to say about it:




































Ok, that's all the evidence I can think of. Just wait till I get some more together.
Rek is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 12:17 PM   #1090
qpw
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pulling the tails of rigtards
Posts: 4,019
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
[ ] poor

[ ] old

[ ] suck at poker

[x] blaming it on the deal

[x] rigtard

[ ] sad

[x] qpw is a paid shill/troll acting in defence of online poker no matter what argument/evidence is presented

[x] qpw needs new 2+2 account as its become very obvious what he s here for. Get a new name your too obvious shill.

Get out of the forum/threads shill.
qpw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 12:18 PM   #1091
qpw
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pulling the tails of rigtards
Posts: 4,019
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rek View Post
I'm going to list it all below and see what he has to say about it:




































Ok, that's all the evidence I can think of.
That's poker, ldo.
qpw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 01:43 PM   #1092
strops
stranger
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 9
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

So, I'm the original poster and I was not trying to further some acrimonious debate about whether online poker is fixed. Especially for a site as large as Full Tilt, it would make absolutely no business sense for them to rig it, as someone would eventually find out and they would be ruined when that happened.

Acknowledging that, I do find it bizarre that by ratios that seem reversed, hands that are dominating lose all-ins pre-flop with such frequency, and this tourney was a great example. AQ beats AK, AK beats KK, A2 beats KK within the space of six hands total. This is not a one time occurrence, or it wouldn't have been worth posting. No I don't have a statistically valid database sample to back it up, as I don't go all-in pre-flop very often.

I also didn't intend this to be a debate about my playing skills, but just out of curiosity which of the all-in calls should I have folded, first AK, second AK, or KK, or all three?
strops is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 01:56 PM   #1093
vilemerchant
old hand
 
vilemerchant's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Victoria, Australia.
Posts: 1,759
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by strops View Post
I also didn't intend this to be a debate about my playing skills, but just out of curiosity which of the all-in calls should I have folded, first AK, second AK, or KK, or all three?
Always fold KK pf as A flops like 70% of the time obv
vilemerchant is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 02:09 PM   #1094
qpw
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pulling the tails of rigtards
Posts: 4,019
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by strops View Post
So, I'm the original poster and I was not trying to further some acrimonious debate about whether online poker is fixed. Especially for a site as large as Full Tilt, it would make absolutely no business sense for them to rig it, as someone would eventually find out and they would be ruined when that happened.

Acknowledging that, I do find it bizarre that by ratios that seem reversed, hands that are dominating lose all-ins pre-flop with such frequency, and this tourney was a great example. AQ beats AK, AK beats KK, A2 beats KK within the space of six hands total. This is not a one time occurrence, or it wouldn't have been worth posting. No I don't have a statistically valid database sample to back it up, as I don't go all-in pre-flop very often.

I also didn't intend this to be a debate about my playing skills, but just out of curiosity which of the all-in calls should I have folded, first AK, second AK, or KK, or all three?
Sorry if you got jumped on and you are NOT a rigtard.

You do, nontheless, have a problem with probability and it is this:

You do not appreciate that when billions of a certain even happen every year there will be a great many VERY unusual occurances.

For example, suppose you said to everyone playing on-line poker at a certain moment: "Please find a fair coin and throw it sixteen times".

There is a very good chance that at least one person woul throw 16 heads or 16 tails.

It's extremely unlikely that there would NOT be several people who threw a series of a dozen heads or tails.

If you see a 1 in 20 hand event, followed immediately and contiguously by 4 similarly unlikely events you need to realise that that is a 1 in 3.2 million probability and if there are 100,000 people playing poker at a time (a conservative estimate, I think) at a rate of 60 hands per hour, then a couple of tables will see an event like this every single hour. If you play 10k hands per month you will see typically see something similarly improbable around every three years.
qpw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 02:29 PM   #1095
SooperFish24
adept
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 1,028
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by qpw View Post
Sorry if you got jumped on and you are NOT a rigtard.

You do, nontheless, have a problem with probability and it is this:

You do not appreciate that when billions of a certain even happen every year there will be a great many VERY unusual occurances.

For example, suppose you said to everyone playing on-line poker at a certain moment: "Please find a fair coin and throw it sixteen times".

There is a very good chance that at least one person woul throw 16 heads or 16 tails.

It's extremely unlikely that there would NOT be several people who threw a series of a dozen heads or tails.

If you see a 1 in 20 hand event, followed immediately and contiguously by 4 similarly unlikely events you need to realise that that is a 1 in 3.2 million probability and if there are 100,000 people playing poker at a time (a conservative estimate, I think) at a rate of 60 hands per hour, then a couple of tables will see an event like this every single hour. If you play 10k hands per month you will see typically see something similarly improbable around every three years.
Talk about stating the obvious.

Seriously how much do you get for being a shill, I could use the extra cash myself. How do you apply etc. Im 100% serious.
SooperFish24 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 02:36 PM   #1096
qpw
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pulling the tails of rigtards
Posts: 4,019
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
Seriously how much do you get for being a shill, I could use the extra cash myself. How do you apply etc. Im 100% serious.
About £250 a day.

If you have a maths PhD you stand a good chance of being accepted.

You'll need to get a licence from the KGC first, though and you'll need to invest £750 of your own money on the shilling course as there is no on the job training.

Apply in writing to:

Rigging and Shilling Department
Pokerstars Ltd
27 Rigtard Way
IOM


Good luck.
qpw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 02:40 PM   #1097
DMoogle
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
DMoogle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Northern VA, USA
Posts: 7,140
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

I want to be a shill too. So I can get paid for stating the obvious too. Like I already do.

EDIT: Thanks for the info qpw!
DMoogle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 02:41 PM   #1098
qpw
banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Pulling the tails of rigtards
Posts: 4,019
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
Talk about stating the obvious.
SooperFish, if it were obvious to you you would not be an idiot rigtard but would use your energy to learn more about and make money at POKER.

As it is you waste time and effort and, potentially, money hanging around here getting your panties in a bunch worrying about sites being rigged.
qpw is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 02:45 PM   #1099
otatop
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: unstuckpolitics.com
Posts: 12,727
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by strops View Post
Acknowledging that, I do find it bizarre that by ratios that seem reversed, hands that are dominating lose all-ins pre-flop with such frequency, and this tourney was a great example. AQ beats AK, AK beats KK, A2 beats KK within the space of six hands total.
Yeah, how crazy that 3 70/30s would go to the hand with 30%. You're also conveniently leaving out the 82 vs JT hand, which was also a 70/30 but the 70% held up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SooperFish24 View Post
Seriously how much do you get for being a shill, I could use the extra cash myself. How do you apply etc. Im 100% serious.
wat
otatop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2009, 02:45 PM   #1100
DMoogle
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
DMoogle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Northern VA, USA
Posts: 7,140
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate"

Quote:
Originally Posted by qpw View Post
If you have a maths PhD you stand a good chance of being accepted.
Can you substitute common sense for a math PhD? I would think it would work in this particular case.
DMoogle is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive