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View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes 3,444 34.94%
No 5,522 56.02%
Undecided 892 9.05%
Voters: 9858. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-03-2009, 05:52 AM   #10751
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
FTP is so damn rigged.
Rags win every hand.
I can't remember a single legit hand that I lost to.
Every time it's the same pattern.

1) Idiot limps with rags.
2) Action flop and the money goes in.
3) Idiot scoops, as his rags have somehow turned into the nuts.

Good, solid play simply does not win at FTP.
You have to be willing to play trash if you want to win.
If this is true then why is it that whenever I limp with rags and play like an idiot I always tend to lose...and whenever I play tight with good cards I do a whole lot better.

Why don't you play trash for 10,000 hands on Full Tilt and tell us how you got on...from what you're saying you're odds on to be a big winner...I think not!!
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Old 12-03-2009, 06:05 AM   #10752
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Is this thread as dumb and addicting as it was when I left it?
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Old 12-03-2009, 06:27 AM   #10753
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by DMoogle View Post
Is this thread as dumb and addicting as it was when I left it?
actually I miss the old stuff with entropy effects and mafia and all that stuff.
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Old 12-03-2009, 06:56 AM   #10754
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by DMoogle View Post
Is this thread as dumb and addicting as it was when I left it?
Dunno - today's the first time I've looked in ages.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SwedishMedusa View Post
actually I miss the old stuff with entropy effects and mafia and all that stuff.
It's all in the timing, I tells yer.

That and the patterns that you can see with your mind but are not susceptible to computer analysis.
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Old 12-03-2009, 08:20 AM   #10755
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
I can't remember a single legit hand that I lost to. Every time it's the same pattern.

1) Idiot limps with rags.
2) Action flop and the money goes in.
3) Idiot scoops, as his rags have somehow turned into the nuts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
Good, solid play simply does not win at FTP.
You have to be willing to play trash if you want to win.
You have firmly established that only idiots who play badly at O8 win at Full Tilt in your mind.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
If being up 15K over the last half year at PLO8 $100 and above is a losing microstakes player, I would love to see your numbers.
Hmm, you claim to be a winning player at O8 at Full Tilt.

A+B=?

Interesting.

P.S. Nobody actually believes you are a winning player. My SNG,MTT and recent cash stats on Stars are easy to check (excluding all the VIP tourney stuff), though my crypto and ipoker stats are not. General Full Tilt stats should be very easy to confirm, just include your screen name and a couple complete hand histories showing this name as the hero in the hand. I have posted a number in this thread at various times.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
Bookies in Vegas don't make most of their money off the juice. They make money by setting and maintaining a line, in which most of the bets will be on the losing side.
You should post your innovative theories like this in the Sports Betting forum. Hardly fair that we are the only ones that get to laugh at your version of reality.
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Old 12-03-2009, 12:34 PM   #10756
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online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

hi
this is my first ever post after doing research online about AP, UB, full tilt and the others. I have now cancelled my membership at Ultimate bet and a couple of others because something is not right and i cannot cope with it anymore.
Are we destined to lose or is there an helping hand?

it is so worrying at the amount of players, there are, that are saying that it is rigged.
i am so beat up about the possible collusion, internal/external stories being true.
i have HH which is more supernatural than just plain old bad beats, where every hand i have no matter if its aces or if i flop a straight or a boat i end the hand a loser! it is so crazy
this can happen every day for 6 months then for no reason i win 6 out of 7 SnG's then it goes back to normal bad beats, my play does not change 1 bit in this time, apart from my confidence gets up for those hands then i get knocked back down to lose every hand which seems set up.

I used to play the slots and won big in the beginning on a couple of occasions and i got sucked in, only for it to take it all back with interest no matter what.
i am convinced that it is internal, especially with slots that they can see how much is lost where and when, so i called them and asked them that question, her reply was yes we can see all this info but we are too honest to let this info out!!!!!
I asked is it possible that a worker could be watching this and for them to ring a mate and tell them, hey! 20k - 50k has just been put in so and so machine play it.
millions are lost daily, is that because the machine we are playing is empty?

her reply was that could happen but we are honest and would not do that!
and we dont know when a machine is going to payout.

thats all well and good but we all know that if you are in a pub and play a machine after someone has topped it up that of course your chances are good for a jackpot payout, which it normally does.
And forgive me for saying this but support workers in bombay who are paid monthly what most get in an hour could have an incentive to ring a friend or 2!
we know that credit card details are sold!!!!
so you are playing to lose.

my question is, and i ask this after reading stories and spoken to online poker support rooms where i know they monitor all games 24/7.
for whatever reason they have i.e. you speak out a lot about losing your hard earned money and question this.

1.
could the manager or the security operator tag you so that you are programmed to lose no matter what cards you are dealt?

any thoughts?
D.
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Old 12-03-2009, 12:38 PM   #10757
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

This will help you out.

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...dition-255990/
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Old 12-03-2009, 12:46 PM   #10758
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

Quote:
Originally Posted by programmed2lose View Post
...
could the manager or the security operator tag you so that you are programmed to lose no matter what cards you are dealt?
Maybe they reward smart people and punish stupid people.
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Old 12-03-2009, 01:08 PM   #10759
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

the only thing that is "real" that is bad in online poker is bots, collusion, ghosting, and multi accounting.
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Old 12-03-2009, 01:12 PM   #10760
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

I am sure you naive shills think that bookies want 50% of the action on each side, but that is a common misconception.
They would much rather have 60% of the action on the losing side, as hard as that may be believe, and they set lines to trick the public into betting on the wrong side.
Have you ever heard of the expression Vegas wasn't built on the juice it was built off the suckers?
Generally when you see 90% of the public on one side of a big game, that team will lose, and Vegas will make much more money than just the juice.
Big public plays very rarely turn out good for anyone but the bookies.

And do I really need to post my SN's again Monteroy?
Look up Fedrosilva on FTP or Olajuwon on Cake, if you need proof I'm a winning player.
However over 95% of my play is PLO8 and NLO8 cash games, which aren't tracked.
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Old 12-03-2009, 01:39 PM   #10761
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

Quote:
Originally Posted by two2brains View Post
the only thing that is "real" that is bad in online poker is bots, collusion, ghosting, and multi accounting.
And outright fraud like UB/Absolute did is considered OK, isn't it?
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Old 12-03-2009, 01:40 PM   #10762
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

VP$IP

That was a very unintellectual response, where people (millions of them) are using their hard earned money to play or gamble online with so many question marks left unnanswered. especially in a world where greed seems to the colour of money and king.

two2brains
I agree to that being real after reading the archives from this site.
perhaps these online control centres should have 24 hour cctv monitoring them monitoring us.
maybe these surveillance procedures could be monitored by a seperate body funded by the online casinos, so that they could instantly tap into and watch poker/casino employees as well as players and to report findings in line with data protection and allow access to financial information to be published on an accessible website.
because i would feel so much more at ease if i could know and see what was going on behind closed doors.

I know that is taking it to the extreme but does anyone know what goes on in the online security and support rooms?
i doubt it because it is SECRET.
something is not right and we know it.
P.S
call me stupid call me paranoid but these people have every concievable bit of data about us, yet we know nothing about them. when we deposit it takes less than 30 seconds, but if you are lucky enough to withdraw a small amout then expect to wait for thousands of them.

Right now thats the end of my rant and i now have it off of my chest.
D

Last edited by programmed2lose; 12-03-2009 at 01:46 PM. Reason: add
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Old 12-03-2009, 01:54 PM   #10763
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
I am sure you naive shills think that bookies want 50% of the action on each side, but that is a common misconception.
They would much rather have 60% of the action on the losing side, as hard as that may be believe, and they set lines to trick the public into betting on the wrong side.
Have you ever heard of the expression Vegas wasn't built on the juice it was built off the suckers?
Generally when you see 90% of the public on one side of a big game, that team will lose, and Vegas will make much more money than just the juice.
Big public plays very rarely turn out good for anyone but the bookies.

And do I really need to post my SN's again Monteroy?
Look up Fedrosilva on FTP or Olajuwon on Cake, if you need proof I'm a winning player.
However over 95% of my play is PLO8 and NLO8 cash games, which aren't tracked.
Not a microstakes player and not a losing player. But Bucket, now the shills have your screen names and are going to flip the Doomswitch on you.
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Old 12-03-2009, 01:56 PM   #10764
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

I think you have been programmed to lose, by god
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Old 12-03-2009, 02:00 PM   #10765
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by peetar69 View Post
The biggest problem I see with this debate is how the sites react to public opinion.
The non-scientific poll on this internet poker site has 37% of people responding saying they think it might be rigged. This is a poll among people that hang out on a internet poker forum. I would have to guess if a pro pollster ran a survey of people who have played poker over the last 12 months for actual money, and have yet to play online,
50+% would say they don't play online because of fear of being cheated. That is a pretty massive potential customer pool if you ask me.

To try to tap into this market, I would propose the following to management:

Hire a respected, third party firm to write a program that Replaces player screen names with a newly assigned player ID number. Replace existing HH # W/ new number, and remove or change (whichever easier) table name to the hand histories, replacing dates with some kind of sequince number. This should pretty much keep 99% of players screen names private. Where stakes are high enough that the player pool is small, or the player could be Identified by shear volume, remove those accounts from the study.

Have a third party (separate from the company that wrote the HH converstion) to audit the player accounts.

Allow public access to whole account HHs.

If the RNG is random, no one could create workable predictive software.

If there is a new account boomswitch, it could be determined.

If there is a winning player doomswitch, it would be uncovered.

If there were a way to put in deposit/withdraw/bonus markers into the account history folder all other rigologist theories could be proven/ disproven.

This could probably only be done for cash and SNG ( players could get ID'd by MTT scores), but by not having dates on the account origin or the HH's, removing high stakes from public access, as well as the few true volume sicko's, Whole account histories could be reveiwed with the players remaing anonymous.

It would probably cost a couple of million bucks to basically prove your legitimacy to tens of millions of potential customers.
Transparency? It is not allowed! How dare you suggest this!
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Old 12-03-2009, 02:03 PM   #10766
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
I am sure you naive shills think that bookies want 50% of the action on each side, but that is a common misconception.
They would much rather have 60% of the action on the losing side, as hard as that may be believe, and they set lines to trick the public into betting on the wrong side.
Have you ever heard of the expression Vegas wasn't built on the juice it was built off the suckers?


Generally when you see 90% of the public on one side of a big game, that team will lose, and Vegas will make much more money than just the juice.
Big public plays very rarely turn out good for anyone but the bookies.
Seriously, go to the sports betting forum and post your manifesto on this. The reaction will be fun to watch.

Since sports books in your creative world know which side is the losing side in advance, wouldn't they make a ton more betting the winning side at other books?

Why is it that riggedologists can never think of better ways to use super powers like predicting the future.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
IAnd do I really need to post my SN's again Monteroy?
Look up Fedrosilva on FTP or Olajuwon on Cake, if you need proof I'm a winning player.
However over 95% of my play is PLO8 and NLO8 cash games, which aren't tracked.
I assume your recent downswing is why you are whining in the way you are. Just play bad hands like 9994 and Tilt will reward you in future. That is your theory after all. Whine less - use super powered pattern recognition skills more.
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Old 12-03-2009, 02:09 PM   #10767
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by BucketFoot View Post
I am sure you naive shills think that bookies want 50% of the action on each side, but that is a common misconception.
They would much rather have 60% of the action on the losing side, as hard as that may be believe, and they set lines to trick the public into betting on the wrong side.
Have you ever heard of the expression Vegas wasn't built on the juice it was built off the suckers?
Bookies aren't in the business of risking their own money, they balance things so the bettors pay each other (and the lines change according to the demand on each side). They overround the odds to make their profit, so the lines add up to over 100%, and the overround is their profit. The "juice" in bookmaking is the overround, that is the cost you pay for them to provide you the betting service. It isn't parimutual betting, where an actual vig is added on the top. It's a totally honest way to run a business and there is nothing hidden about it. Crooked bookies, or bookies who overround more than the competition, will see their customers going to other vendors. Your worldview of crookedness in business seems to extend to everything.

Last edited by spadebidder; 12-03-2009 at 02:22 PM.
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Old 12-03-2009, 02:19 PM   #10768
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monteroy View Post
Since sports books in your creative world know which side is the losing side in advance, wouldn't they make a ton more betting the winning side at other books?
Because its a big conspiracy that they are all in on. There is no point in bookie A placing a bet with bookie B on the winning side because bookie B would just take that money and place the same bet with bookie A. Its kind of a détente

Last edited by obviously.bogus; 12-03-2009 at 02:20 PM. Reason: ldo
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Old 12-03-2009, 03:01 PM   #10769
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

Well yes maybe i have but not the real god, but maybe a crook in disguise!

i have my thoughts and i just needed to air them and because deep inside i would like to believe that i am just plain unlucky without any influences..
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Old 12-03-2009, 03:01 PM   #10770
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by spadebidder View Post
Your worldview of crookedness in business seems to extend to everything.
It is a truth generally accepted that dishonest people are the first to suspect dishonesty in others.

It is the way their minds work.

I suspect that a good proportion of the rigtards here are crooks or would be crooks who just cannot believe that anyone in the position of a poker room could possibly resist the chance to run a crooked game.
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Old 12-03-2009, 03:02 PM   #10771
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

in before meeeeeeeeeeeerge
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Old 12-03-2009, 03:03 PM   #10772
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by spadebidder View Post
Bookies aren't in the business of risking their own money, they balance things so the bettors pay each other (and the lines change according to the demand on each side). They overround the odds to make their profit, so the lines add up to over 100%, and the overround is their profit. The "juice" in bookmaking is the overround, that is the cost you pay for them to provide you the betting service. It isn't parimutual betting, where an actual vig is added on the top. It's a totally honest way to run a business and there is nothing hidden about it. Crooked bookies, or bookies who overround more than the competition, will see their customers going to other vendors. Your worldview of crookedness in business seems to extend to everything.
He's a standard paranoid guy. I don't care if someone wants to believe everything is a massive crooked conspiracy, all I ask is that these mastermind criminals in his world do things that are much easier to make a ton of money based on his beliefs.

Bucketfoot Bookie A: Hmm, the Bills are going to win this week, so lets just make the lines more favorable on the Jets to get more Jets action.

Bucketfoot Bookie Apprentice: Wouldn't we just make more if we bet a lot on the Bills with other bookies and sports books? We would get better odds as well, right?

Bucketfoot Bookie A: Son, that aint how we do things around here. We need to do it my way since that is how we can screw customers. All the bookies do it.

Bucketfoot Bookie Apprentice: Gee, I have a lot to learn on how to make money in a criminal way.
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Old 12-03-2009, 03:19 PM   #10773
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

Quote:
Originally Posted by programmed2lose View Post
I agree to that being real after reading the archives from this site.
perhaps these online control centres should have 24 hour cctv monitoring them monitoring us.

But then who will monitor the monitors monitoring the CCTV monitors showing the online poker monitors monitoring us?
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Old 12-03-2009, 03:42 PM   #10774
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Re: online poker/ casinos destined to lose?

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Originally Posted by programmed2lose View Post
Well yes maybe i have but not the real god, but maybe a crook in disguise!

i have my thoughts and i just needed to air them and because deep inside i would like to believe that i am just plain unlucky without any influences..
That's just completely ****ep up in my opinion.

You would rather believe that people are cheating than accept that you're not very good at a game that requires skill.

Why?

If you accept that you are being cheated you will surely feel some animosity towards the cheaters and perhaps some degree of self loathing for having fallen for it.

If you accept that you aren't very good then you may feel a bit stupid for a bit but if you haven't made any attempt to get good then why the hell would you expect to be good?

More to the point, you can *get* good.
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Old 12-03-2009, 04:44 PM   #10775
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re: The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by qpw View Post
It is a truth generally accepted that dishonest people are the first to suspect dishonesty in others.

It is the way their minds work.

I suspect that a good proportion of the rigtards here are crooks or would be crooks who just cannot believe that anyone in the position of a poker room could possibly resist the chance to run a crooked game.
That's where your wrong. However, I will tell you that there are many good people out there, brought up surrounded by honest human beings. Then by the time they grow up and get mixed up w/ these parasites, it's too late b/c they already milked you for everything you had. This goes for all consumer abuse and fraud, not just "poker."

There is so much fraud and ubuse via the internet, over the phone, or through our postal services that there is a higher and greater risk of fraud and outright theft.

Gorwing up as kids we're taught: "Do not talk to strangers!" Why? All adults are perverts and serial killers?

"PRE-EMTPIVE MEASURES."
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