See Poe's law

http://rationalwiki.com/wiki/Poe's_Law

It's pretty brazen for you to be called out on your last post being proven to be a manufactured lie, and to then come out with new lies. It's totally shameless for you to ignore that issue and not even address it.

Sites do not release hands for investigation in "sample sizes" of around 20,000. That's simply just another lie from a lying liar that lies. I don't know if you have some sort of disease that forces you to keep lying, or whether you even realise that you keep lying. This sort of behaviour might be acceptable at whatever rigged forum you operate (and is probably reflective of the intellectual bankruptcy there) but it doesn't pass here.

PokerStars, for example, provides however many hands the individual player has played, on request.

Guys like that have no idea they lie as much as they do. They genuinely believe every word they say. Best to ignore them or have fun with them, but why take them actually seriously by getting upset? That kind of validates their behavior in their minds because they assume the reaction proves you are hiding something.

It's not like anyone takes anything he has said seriously, even the other riggedologists have given him a fairly wide berth, and they believe first time posters posting a bad beat as proof.

I'm not particularly upset?

Hate to see you when you are upset then...

Why did I give in to the urge to click that link? And then of course I couldn't help posting a pithy comment. omfg I must look away, unsubscribe, unsubscribe...

I looked. You distracted one or two for about 2 seconds before they took a breath and started talking about thermite devices and anti-conspiracy conspiracies again.

We are not ready for that thread yet, stick to this one where it is safe.

I'm not an experienced board user. In fact I only started to uses boards, about two months ago. I played play poker on Full Tilt for the longest time. Then I decided to try the cash games. This is when I started to smell the rotten odour of foul play. Hence, I quit playing for cash and started to write and post to several boards regarding my opinion on the matter of using software which is the cause of the foul play.

On my travel and posting on the Internet, I never found any posting from Full Tilt itself. You would think they would want to protect themselves. But, they have nothing to fear. The company is an offshore company for sure, the servers working on some offshore island which needs employment. The licences from the native people in Canada. Who I think is a separate body from the government.

To make software, the source code has to be written by humans. Then the source code is compiled into object code. Then this code can be run on the computer. I know back a few years, once the source code was compiled, it could not be reversed and making it unreadable by humans. There maybe some system available today, that can reverse it. What so important, Full Tilt has the building blocks to commit perfect crimes.

What is amazing is, if you post anything that darkens Full Tilt public images. There is always a group who will try to slaughter you. I always wonder, "what interest has these people got in Full Tilt?" I think they get paid by Full Tilt to put us rigtards (rigtards, I hope this is the name for the people who believe the sites are rigged) down. I myself nicknamed these non-believers to be "protectors." These protectors, never write anything to prove or explain, "why the sites are not rigged."

I offer you the "protectors" this challenge, write, "why you believe these sites are not rigged." I love playing poker just as much as anyone and being very flexible. If Internet closes down sites because of using software, there is nothing else they can use. Hence end of poker and other games. This is why it is important to hear from the other side of the fence. Maybe a solution can be obtained.

It's admittable to write it in programming language. I have played with programming from the days of DOS and in Basic. Using programming as a hobby, it sure is entertaining and interesting.

By the way, I know I am a ******, I know am crazy, dumb, pathetic cheating scumbag, and all the other things. So nobody has to tell me this, save you writing it.

I offer you, the "rigtard", the challenge to actually read this thread, which is filled with arguments about why the major online poker sites are most likely not rigged.

If only there was a site that used real cards instead of software, amirite? Some sort of "Real Deal" maybe?

Why would Full Tilt or any site care enough to rig it specifically against you? We all know if you share your screen names we will likely find you are a microstakes player anyway.

You became a riggedologist and good for you that you actually stopped playing a game you lack the ability to beat. Many do not do that.

Why would any company in any industry respond to every paranoid nut that sees mystical forces at work? All that would do is bring out even more looking for an answer to why they lost in a $1 tournament.

Email their customer service if you like, they probably enjoy the crazier emails.



Maybe they get a kickback of the 20 bucks you feel they stole from you.

Except humans babble. Maybe if it was all written by superbots it would be the perfect crime. Or Lizard People.

Not a single riggedologist including yourself has ever proven it was rigged in any way shape or form.

All of the data has shown that the deals are fair in every way possible (except for magical superbot type stuff).

You show me conclusive proof of rigging and I will join your bandwagon. Until then, what are you exactly but another loud voice?

P.S. I can't stand Full Tilt since the account I created 5 years ago and never logged into prevents me from getting rakeback, so show me Tilt is rigged I will be quite happy.



I am not a programmer nor do I play one on TV but my gut feeling is that DOS and Basic are not really computer skills that are very current.

How would you write that in Basic or Pascal?

Decompiling the code of the client could maybe, maaaaaaybe let you find out when it receives information from the full tilt servers, but can't possibly help you figure out what's going in in their server code. This is a fairly obvious thing, really. Protectors, shills, none of you morans who proclaim that anyone who doesn't see such obvious rigging is paid off by the sites has ever explained why the "protectors" give EVERY site the benefit of the doubt until there is evidence otherwise. If there were people on the internet being paid by FTP to shout down anyone who claimed FTP was rigged, wouldn't those people say something more like "FTP's 100% legit, Stars though is a total joke." instead of "I've looked over 400,000 hands and nothing seemed odd."?

You know who does do the "Site X feels kinda fair, but Site Y is definitely rigged" bull****? Rigtards. Hmmmmmmm. There are over 9,000 posts in this thread. Perhaps, just perhaps, a few of those cover this. Nah, I'm sure it's just 9,000 people going "ZOMG rogged!" and "nuh uh!".
Since I'm not all "zomg rogged!" I'm obviously a "protector".

I believe the sites aren't rigged for the same reason I don't believe Lizard People exist: despite literally millions of people having an opportunity to, no one has come forward with any sort of reliable evidence that the sites aren't dealing a fair game.

The closest that anyone has come is the super user scandal at Cereus, and whatever crooked **** was going down at Pitbull poker, and you'll notice that a lot of the "protectors" were involved in researching those incidents. I have no idea what this is supposed to mean.

Haven't done Pascal in maybe 25 years, but something like this:

I don't know why you called me a pathetic cheating scumbag. Is it because I used some software in a game? If so, do you also call Full Tilt a pathetic cheating scumbag because they use software also.

I can not find the thread you spoke about, setup a link. Sure I would love the see and read other peoples views.

I totally agree with you. Boy this would sure stop some of the feeling regarding this topic.

This has to be a level. I really hope you're just being sarcastic here. In the off chance that you are not, I mean THIS thread. The one you are posting in! This is post 9549. Start at post 1. Happy reading..

I'm being levelled, right?

Sorry I didn't quite understand you. Oh I'm slowly drifting through them

Where did I say it was rigged for me? I got shocked once I started reading the posting on boards about big hands being busted by junk cards. This started me wondering about the software used by Full Tilt. Because some of the hands I saw, had a very bad smell attached to the hands. Yes I'm not playing in any heavy games, I was still in practise, when I woke up.


Not only me, who wondering about Full Tilt. You can go to
http://www.petitionspot.com/petitions/FullTilt
and see the petition on Full Tilt and rigged software.

I did question support(Full Tilt ) regarding the software.





The only real support I have is the posting of Bob Smith and the fact. It not the first time software has ben altered to cheat people from their money.

Here it is, and I double thank spadebidder for the help THANKS.

(*pascal*)
var
old_moose: array[1..4] of string;

begin
old_moose[1] := 'crazy';
old_moose[2] := 'dumb';
old_moose[3] := 'pathetic cheating scumbag';
old_moose[4] := 'all the other things';

FOR num := 1 TO 4 DO
writeln('old_moose is ' + old_moose[num]);
end

thanks to otatop, Monteroy, and Arouet for the info...

sounds a bit like the older concept of trolls and trolling... feeding the trolls would be being levelled?

You seeing and smelling a few hands is not really proof of much. If you show real verifiable proof of something being rigged I will support you.

Come on though, you are just a low level player who is not really good who has no idea what you are talking about in terms of statistical analysis. Something just smells bad to you then you woke up. That's perhaps proof you live in a barn, but not much else.


This is called a belief. Proof you need to document your claims. You can believe whatever you like, whether it be superbots, Lizard People, magical voodoo software changes, fish smells etc. however you need to prove your beliefs for them to be taken as more than the random ramblings of a paranoid guy.

For what it is worth, nobody expects you to actually prove anything.


I had not heard of Poe's law till today, but I do believe in it.

It does not matter if this guy is a "level" or not. Plenty are just as bright as he is that have the exact beliefs he does, so if he is committing a fraud by pretending to be someone who would behave just like that anyway - good for him. It's a totally pointless level if it even is a level, hence best to just assume it is not as it does not matter if it is.

Edit to add: If one really wanted to troll this thread the better way to do it would be to go with an approach that you do not think it is rigged but you have a lot of data that seems off, then talk about it while intentionally missing a couple of concepts on the math and ignore those as they correct it by adding further layers of errors in how you interpret your data. Build on people's corrections to form more errors that frustrate them. Add relatively polite comments that you doubt their expertise along the way when they are clearly correct, and then correct some new made up errors.

That will drive some people properly insane. Saying it's rigged because cards are dealt funny online, I knows becuz I sees it? Who cares if that's a level. Those people do exist in large numbers anyway.

It kind of appears, that you did not understand me, the software I was refering too, is the software on the server. I think you made reference to the Full Tilt software on my computer. The software on my computer just prints what the software on the server tells it too.


What about the scandel at Absolute Poker Scandal http://www.absolutepokerscandal.com/

and at UltimateBet also there are some rumors about Full Tilt at
http://www.pokerlistings.com/possibl...lt-poker-21428

This is kind of a vast statement. Which means, if the Internet governing body decide, yes it to easy to cheat with software and forbids the use of software. This would be a sad day for poker and other games. Because what would they use to shuffle cards, deliver cards to a table and so on. That is why, the sooner this poker gets regulated the better it will be. One day somebody will make hardware to do the job, but this is not really invented yet.

LOL at reffering to a bot as "some software".
Absolute Poker and Ultimate Bet are one company, now known as Cereus. They were exactly what I was talking about, and their scandals were uncovered by people on this very message board. It still makes no sense. Everything on the internet is run through software. Most poker sites are already regulated. There are 190+ countries on Earth, the one you feel is best is not necessarily the be all end all of regulation. This also makes no sense. How will hardware be able to take over the role of software?

Yes I did read about 2+2 and the people who put the axe on Ultimate and their buddies. That wonderful, just shows what can happen if people roll together.
If you can understand where I'm coming from. I feel no excitement when cards are dealt online. It not the same as sitting in somebody home with a group playing poker at the dinner table. You see the person dealing, and not one person knows what the top card is or whats coming next. This is not the same with a RNG, somebody has to put in the seed number and if has the math formula, can calculate what cards coming out. This alone takes the magic or mystery from it being a real deck of cards.

You ask about hardware, it will come. Do you know the RNG Full Tilt uses, is 3 computers, 2, I understand uses hardware and the 3rd uses software. I never feel there is any wrong doing within the RNG, but the software used to move the cards to the table is the culprit.

I also agree with you, yes they will never completely eliminate software, rather it will be like the BIOS or firmware. Something that can not be altered.
Take care

Modern RNGs don't use seed numbers. This was most recently discussed within the last few pages.