This is why your "jokes" fail. You say literally the same thing when "joking" as you do when being "serious."

I am not the one spending hours wondering how the world is rigged against me. Keep us updated with your latest concerns of the moment (your superbot concern will change to something else) as to how the whole industry is rigged against you to keep you from winning what you think you deserve at the nano stakes.

After that step back and wonder who posts the most with the needing a hug theme.

After that - quit all forms of poker. Genuine advice, as it is by far your best +EV choice.

All the best.

Well sure, but that was 8 months ago - what have you done lately? tilter's been busy letting everyone know about his theories backed up by super compelling anecdotes, while you've been sitting on your hands.

My first question was how did you get information on the results? Because they always say that they can't share that because of privacy.

Now as far as the bots, I will go look through that thread and see what is there. But my initial thought is why contact the site? You must not even consider it a possibility that the site owns them if you contact them first. I only recently had this suspicion because I don't think anyone else would have the ability to do what these bots do. So if a site has bots that they own, then all they need to do is change the screen names. So if they say that they suspended the accounts then it gives a false impression to the players that they are concerned and taking action. Which is what you would do to avoid suspicion of one particular account that is crushing or building a database on. When they say they issued refunds, do you know anyone who received a refund?

I was told by their support that there is no such thing as super users and there never was. So when I hear things like that, it's a concern. Even the fact that if you leave a table and left with a profit, you get a message asking you if you want to play "double or nothing".

You said something about people in your group so I'm not sure what that is but I would like to be involved and see how can I help if possible.

If I want so potato I'd have provided the link.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/top...ink_source=app

Cannot really get into how it all came about but it was very serious.

Why did I contact sites? Simple. Believe it or not, not a single one of them wants cheaters or bots. One site is in perennial denial and you have not mentioned them nor probably could play there. Every single other site was very thankful. Keep in mind, I did not talk with CS reps. Either owners or heads of Game Integrity.

It was an awkward intro email for a couple I had no prior contact with. They naturally thought I was some phishing clown. I sent screenshots and other info to show how serious we were. Add on that my hand was not out for any fees and there was a lot of appreciation. There was 7 figures of funds seized overall, good news. There were several very serious threats and attempts at an early demise to those uncovering it, not so good news.

The point being that some of the people that reply to you, and others, have a very deep knowledge and experience with scumbaggery. Feelz will get your posts sent to the riggie thread. Real evidence will be standalone threads and get a LOT of interaction and support. Even the fishiest losing player wants to lose their money to another real player that isn't cheating.

When people find their posts moved here, there is an initial outrage of how dare you stuff. Then defensive replies. Usually ending up with them disappearing into ClubPenguin or something like that where it is safer.

I am no where near fluent in bot, cheating, collusion detection. I have a keen eye for the obvious. I do know some ridiculously smart and connected people. When there is something shady suggested, I just ask their input. I am a pro at asking those in the know.

Ugh, don't you have anything better to do than make fun of me? Your statement makes it sound as if adewd is someone who spends a lot of time and effort in this area. Is that true?

I haven't heard anything constructive from you, I have not heard anything constructive from anyone except adewd's last response. That was a refreshing change for once.

I don't know why you use the word "anecdotes". What the **** else would they be? I can only speak for what happened to me. I am sorry that I don't have everything wrapped in a bow and then spoon fed to you.

The serious threats made against and even attempts at an early demise and those trying to uncover it? Can you tell me in a pm or here an example? I would like to know if it was similar to mine.

It's a red flag that a statistical sample size needs to be large enough? Really?

This is seriously where you want to go after the PMs and replies you've made to my posts?

I thought you had read the thread he linked you to. Sounds to me like he has.

I know; listening doesn't seem to really be your thing. I sent you a number of constructive PMs, and got a fair bit of abuse in return.

Because that's what they were. As for "what the **** else would they be", well, I guess one might hope for something a little more credible. No need to wrap anything up for me, but if you'd like people to take you more seriously, you'll likely need to do a much better job of putting together whatever it is that you have.

People will never take him seriously, and he will never understand why. Riggies like that are incapable of grasping why their "I see spooky housebots" tales are not the same as actual work with proper evidence that others have done within this industry to uncover and expose bad behavior. He will never get it, and perhaps he will just build it into his riggie narrative as other riggies have done in similar situations.

As for giving constructive help to riggies - you of all people should remember the Spadebidder precedent where he did a ton of actual work (at no cost) for a riggie only to have it thrown back in his face with insults.

Genuine advice can be given to riggies, like mine to this person that he should quit, but it should always be given in the assumption that the riggie will ignore it and likely be hostile toward the advice. That is simply their nature, so they should be treated accordingly.

I went through my hands and saw hands that I forgot about where I coolered regulars that I thought always got the better of me. It’s true what they say about forgetting the ones you win and remembering only the losses. Poker is a game with cards. I used to deal blackjack and if I wasn’t the person dealing, I would have sworn that was rigged. With poker, the percentages aren’t 100% so it was really dumb to think AA should win every time.

I am not in the riggie group anymore and understand I just needed to learn more about poker. Simple as that.

Missing some blinds is the least the community should be concerned. There is a much better reason why a network that once was the most popular (dating way back from 2001-2003) barely has had any traffic for the past years.

The client surely has its issues, but that's not the main reason players come and leave. It's the fact that they're not earning the money they are supposed to and this has to do with two factors

1) Rakeback
2) Bad beats

Variance does exist, but when the majority are coming to a common conclusion to stop playing then there must be a good reason. In the past Party Poker has also done some shady things like trying to separate recreational from regular players (to protect their fish/weaker players) so they stay longer and generate rake.

Usually, it takes years before newer networks are flagged as the best, good or bad through many factors, which is why Party Poker despite being the oldest has lost the traffic to its competition.

It's in my interest and the interest of all online poker players to have more and better options for online poker, which is why I do hope Party Poker will learn through time that doing what's best for your customers/consumers/players will pay off in the long run.

This is exactly what I mean (hand I experienced minutes ago after writing that above) and it's far too frequent I experience similar things. Still, I'll continue playing for the time being due to the limited options for cash games, but yea I can understand why others are leaving this network.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLbeV8pqn6Y

Good for you.

So you truly think it is unusual for 2 pairs to NOT be the best hand at showdown in a 6 handed game? This isn't even a bad beat, it's just an ordinary beat.

Round of applause sir. Kudos for being able to change your mind. The riggies cannot. The cognitive dissonance is too great to overcome. Many such cases!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B9hGc_DlZBQ

Few things worth mentioning. Their house bots always run it once, and if it's not a house bot their software algorithm protects weak players for more traffic and overall rake,but through the years most who understand variance have quit, which is why this network struggles with traffic after two decades. In the past Party used to split pools between weak and good players. If most are leaving there must be a good reason, and I can overlook the software issues, but these type of bad beats happen way too frequently. At the end I'll post these things, because this is what these communities were meant for, not.

Most can make their own decisions, and I am just sharing my owns from personal experience. Losing AA vs AKos preflop most should know the odds, and as I mentioned I keep losing to" run it once" consistently full buy ins despite most good players would choose run it twice for these exact reasons.

Welcome, run it once riggie! We look forward to hearing your arguments.

I'll be adding more sample, but if I don't it's cause I'm no longer playing on this network.
Here's one more for now https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hwTOp1vGJc

These house bots always "run it once" win. Consistently through the years the outcome is same, but lately I've been committed to record more hands to help the community. There's a reason why after two decades this network is nearly dead, and despite the best rakeback I am still barely even, and this is exactly why. Finally, I would like to add that this year I played on the GG Network for around 4 months, and still managed to make more profit than at Party (that's with 4-5x less rakeback). I also ran way below EV at GGpoker, but the ggcare compensated some of the losses. The most important difference is I never saw any odd things, not once from the way how these accounts at Party play and get rewarded compared to GG.

The Winning Poker Network is left as the last option for cash games, but due to no player pool at 25 NL (which is considered low stakes) and where I am, that's not an option for me.

Monteroy still here years later shilling online poker for his employers. Some things never change.

So glad I quit, and I'd advise anyone else to do the same. It is undeniably rigged, anyone with a brain can see it, there's no point wasting hours a day grinding out peanuts at a rigged game. All the sites manufacture the flops, turns and rivers to put more rake into their pockets.

I like to add some additional info...

I've been playing exclusively at Party Poker in the past 3-4 years, but casually, as in specifically only when there's been great rakeback (promotions), so despite the way I'm losing hands in some of the hands above, playing a good poker is still very rewarding on this network, again thanks to having better promotions (rakeback) than elsewhere.

So, I am thankful to what Party Poker is doing to stay competitive. My only problem is I need to get used on experiencing this on their software, and for whatever reason it's happening I hope others can get past the frustration that comes from endless bad beats and witnessing odd plays being rewarded.

I would still recommend Party Poker over any other network because that's still my primary place for cash games.

I can't speak for Monteroy, but I've been shilling on behalf of the online poker sites for several years in this Forum. For each shill post I write, I get paid $24.99 (plus S&H).

All very well said, sir! A good friend of mine is a crack software engineer, and he actually wrote the code for the Flop Manufacture Algorithm (FMA).

If the average online poker player was as astute as you obviously are, I'd be out of a job.

Please don't post here again. The sites will lose MILLIONS of dollars annually if your post gets widely circulated.

Thanks in advance!

NEWSFLASH: Poker sites pay affiliates. Affiliates post on this thread/site about the trustworthiness of poker sites.

That isn't a difficult money trail to follow. The vast majority of the people you are responding to have no interest in a proper discussion about whether online poker is rigged or not. They simply want to bury the discussion in a sea of gibberish, whilst pretending everything is above board.

You're responding to his post of June 1.

Read his last post in this thread, and you will see he has realised his mistakes.

Or do you think he's been paid to post that one?

It's a crying shame that the shills around here are preventing the noble riggies from posting their evidence in this thread.


I've asked this question several times in this thread, so please forgive me for asking it again, since it has been awhile and I don't remember your answer:

Do you believe that a specific rig claim that was accompanied with evidence would find its way to its own thread in this Forum, and would be taken seriously by the 2+2 community?

Ever heard of a calling station? He had an overcard to the flop, so he called. Not an uncommon occurance.