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View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes 3,449 34.95%
No 5,524 55.98%
Undecided 895 9.07%
Voters: 9868. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 07-29-2009, 11:06 AM   #7151
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by mfc View Post
Is it true that FTP uses a Real (hardware) RNG and Stars uses a Pseudo RNG?
No.
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Old 07-29-2009, 11:28 AM   #7152
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by qpw View Post
No.
Which RNG do both use.
Hardware or Psuedo?
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Old 07-29-2009, 11:34 AM   #7153
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Hardware.
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Old 07-29-2009, 11:35 AM   #7154
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by moomies View Post
um...i just read the OP. how the **** did this thread make 7000 replies???
masochism
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Old 07-29-2009, 02:17 PM   #7155
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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The game is not "rigged" it just so happens that bad players lose more than good players so if you think it is "rigged" it is probably because you just suck at poker lol

So....Just practice and get better instead of complaining about something that does not exist and won't help you get better
Ok when you get better and you are good at getting your money in 70-30 all the time and you lose 90% than what? Online poker is rigged, has been since the beginning and always will be until someone shuts them down or forces them on US soil where real gaming people can look at the software and give us a random shuffle. Not some software that rewards the idiot that reraises KK with AQ and wins it 9 out of 10 times. It's so obvious what is happening and they operate without fear since they hide the hardware on an Indian Reservatioin.
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Old 07-29-2009, 02:29 PM   #7156
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by banonlinepoker View Post
Ok when you get better and you are good at getting your money in 70-30 all the time and you lose 90% than what? Online poker is rigged, has been since the beginning and always will be until someone shuts them down or forces them on US soil where real gaming people can look at the software and give us a random shuffle. Not some software that rewards the idiot that reraises KK with AQ and wins it 9 out of 10 times. It's so obvious what is happening and they operate without fear since they hide the hardware on an Indian Reservatioin.

Dang, this fact-filled post is so full of goodness, where do you begin?
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Old 07-29-2009, 02:33 PM   #7157
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by PeaceFr0g View Post
I've thought of this and would actually love to do it. Ideally, I'd want someone to play like a total spewtard. Again, my hypothesis is that he/she would still get killed in the long run, but over many occurrences of say, flush draws, they would hit just slightly more than their fair share in significant pots and/or v. the better players. This would keep them playing a little longer than they'd have a right to.

Yes, I would really love to do this. But I don't think it would be legal with any of the sites. Obviously, no one is going to volunteer to be the spewtard and purposely lose their money and it can't be agreed upon beforehand that we split whatever money is leftover after the rake (actually, there wouldn't be any money left over, b/c of the huge sample size needed. Everyone would be a loser in this little test). But you're right. This would be the way to prove the "Great poker is rigged debate" once and for all.
It should be OK as long as you make sure to never sit with people outside of your group.
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Old 07-29-2009, 02:38 PM   #7158
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Dang, this fact-filled post is so full of goodness, where do you begin?
Hard to say but I really must go and vist that Indian reservation on the Isle of Man.
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:18 PM   #7159
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Here is you typical Miraclestars tournament hand. I've come to the conclusion after a yr solid of the same old horse****, something is up.

My best guess is Stars has to make certain people play the role of donkey supplier and have to have accounts that continually get the brakes beat off them for long term financial interests. You think these crooks care they already make millions, they want more just like everyone else.



Poker Stars 20FPP No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t100/t200 Blinds - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG+1: t5240 M = 17.47
UTG+2: t2500 M = 8.33
MP1: t1340 M = 4.47
MP2: t2140 M = 7.13
CO: t2600 M = 8.67
BTN: t4380 M = 14.60
SB: t720 M = 2.40
Hero (BB): t3340 M = 11.13
UTG: t1380 M = 4.60

Pre Flop: (t300) Hero is BB with Q Q
7 folds, SB raises to t720 all in, Hero calls t520

Flop: (t1440) 2 3 2 (2 players - 1 is all in)

Turn: (t1440) 9 (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: (t1440) 7 (2 players - 1 is all in)

Final Pot: t1440
SB shows 4 4 (a flush, Nine high)
Hero shows Q Q (two pair, Queens and Deuces)
SB wins t1440


Oh and when you have a ****ed acct, the cycle is usually the same, no matter if its a 20ffp buy or 20$. Its begins with an extreme suck-out like this and then they toss you another monster in a few hands..... The thing is when this monster comes they have already decided your fate..............
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:25 PM   #7160
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Poker Stars 20FPP No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t150/t300 Blinds + t25 - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

MP2: t4102 M = 6.31
CO: t6390 M = 9.83
BTN: t2515 M = 3.87
SB: t7819 M = 12.03
BB: t565 M = 0.87
UTG: t18840 M = 28.98
Hero (UTG+1): t1520 M = 2.34
MP1: t100 M = 0.15

Pre Flop: (t650) Hero is UTG+1 with K A
1 fold, Hero raises to t1495 all in, 2 folds, CO raises to t2690, 3 folds

Flop: (t3640) 8 T A (2 players - 1 is all in)

Turn: (t3640) K (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: (t3640) 6 (2 players - 1 is all in)

Final Pot: t3640
CO shows Q J (a straight, Ten to Ace)
Hero shows K A (two pair, Aces and Kings)
CO wins t3640


This was a tourney i played a few mins ago. Im just now getting the courage to go back through a yr of mtts and im seeing this and other patterns emerging. Things you all tell ppl are in their minds. Basically ive been fked out of everything that was ever anything. You telling me the best math minds in the world cant tell somethig is up with these ppl. hahahahaha . Your not looking in the right places.
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:28 PM   #7161
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlisterXists View Post
CO shows Qd Jd (a straight, Ten to Ace)
Hero shows Kc Ah (two pair, Aces and Kings)

This was a tourney i played a few mins ago. Im just now getting the courage to go back through a yr of mtts and im seeing this and other patterns emerging. Things you all tell ppl are in their minds. Basically ive been fked out of everything that was ever anything. You telling me the best math minds in the world cant tell somethig is up with these ppl. hahahahaha . Your not looking in the right places.
Good grief, you use a 60/40 hand as your example? The QJ here wins 40% of the time in a fair game.

In case you didn't make it to fractions Jethro, that's pretty close to half.

Last edited by spadebidder; 07-29-2009 at 03:50 PM.
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:40 PM   #7162
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlisterXists View Post
Poker Stars 20FPP No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t150/t300 Blinds + t25 - 8 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

MP2: t4102 M = 6.31
CO: t6390 M = 9.83
BTN: t2515 M = 3.87
SB: t7819 M = 12.03
BB: t565 M = 0.87
UTG: t18840 M = 28.98
Hero (UTG+1): t1520 M = 2.34
MP1: t100 M = 0.15

Pre Flop: (t650) Hero is UTG+1 with K A
1 fold, Hero raises to t1495 all in, 2 folds, CO raises to t2690, 3 folds

Flop: (t3640) 8 T A (2 players - 1 is all in)

Turn: (t3640) K (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: (t3640) 6 (2 players - 1 is all in)

Final Pot: t3640
CO shows Q J (a straight, Ten to Ace)
Hero shows K A (two pair, Aces and Kings)
CO wins t3640
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlisterXists View Post
Poker Stars 20FPP No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t100/t200 Blinds - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG+1: t5240 M = 17.47
UTG+2: t2500 M = 8.33
MP1: t1340 M = 4.47
MP2: t2140 M = 7.13
CO: t2600 M = 8.67
BTN: t4380 M = 14.60
SB: t720 M = 2.40
Hero (BB): t3340 M = 11.13
UTG: t1380 M = 4.60

Pre Flop: (t300) Hero is BB with Q Q
7 folds, SB raises to t720 all in, Hero calls t520

Flop: (t1440) 2 3 2 (2 players - 1 is all in)

Turn: (t1440) 9 (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: (t1440) 7 (2 players - 1 is all in)

Final Pot: t1440
SB shows 4 4 (a flush, Nine high)
Hero shows Q Q (two pair, Queens and Deuces)
SB wins t1440
Really, I mean 20fpp tourneys with 6bb & 4bb beats.. You guys are not even trying anymore. Whats next play money, or did I already miss that?
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:45 PM   #7163
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

I'm pretty sure there has been at least one person or thread that talks about play money being rigged.
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:47 PM   #7164
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by DMoogle View Post
I'm pretty sure there has been at least one person or thread that talks about play money being rigged.
On play money tables everyone wins, didn't you know? That's how they get you to deposit. Not sure how they pull it off, the no loser part....
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:48 PM   #7165
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by BlisterXists View Post
Poker Stars 20FPP No Limit Hold'em Tournament

You telling me the best math minds in the world cant tell somethig is up with these ppl. hahahahaha . Your not looking in the right places.
Anyone else want to stop making money with me and move down the the 20fpp tourneys to prove its rigged?
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:52 PM   #7166
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by spadebidder View Post
On play money tables everyone wins, didn't you know? That's how they get you to deposit. Not sure how they pull it off, the no loser part....
Isn't it obvious they use bots that are designed to take bad beats in the play money games. Every time the bot gets it in good it takes a horrible river suckout and then you start thinking you're the next phil ivey and deposit and play real money for a bit and then those foreigners screw you out of your 20 fpps.

And the finest mathematical minds in the world haven't noticed how they do it because they use TIMING, but me having no statistical knowledge whatsoever I noticed it straight away - it happened twice in two years of MTTs! Anybody who doesn't agree is a shill, and of questionable parentage (probably a foreigner as well).
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:53 PM   #7167
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by DMoogle View Post
I'm pretty sure there has been at least one person or thread that talks about play money being rigged.
Quote:
Originally Posted by spadebidder View Post
On play money tables everyone wins, didn't you know? That's how they get you to deposit. Not sure how they pull it off, the no loser part....
I found some glitch that gives me play chips for free, so they are prob right.
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:56 PM   #7168
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

I just used that as an example of how its a DAY IN DAY OUT PROCESS. You think i ***** care about the money?? Or that it's only 20fpp? The chips are still in the middle aren't they?????????????????????

I have enough money just in inheritance to last a lifetime. It's about these ***** crooks that don't deal a 100% random game, like each and every person deserves.

After a full analysis i will post if anything arises that may help someone out there looking for answers, or if any other rigtard theories arise.

THE END
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Old 07-29-2009, 03:59 PM   #7169
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by Pyromantha View Post
Isn't it obvious they use bots that are designed to take bad beats in the play money games. Every time the bot gets it in good it takes a horrible river suckout and then you start thinking you're the next phil ivey and deposit and play real money for a bit and then those foreigners screw you out of your 20 fpps.

And the finest mathematical minds in the world haven't noticed how they do it because they use TIMING, but me having no statistical knowledge whatsoever I noticed it straight away - it happened twice in two years of MTTs! Anybody who doesn't agree is a shill, and of questionable parentage (probably a foreigner as well).
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:00 PM   #7170
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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I just used that as an example of how its a DAY IN DAY OUT PROCESS. You think i ***** care about the money?? Or that it's only 20fpp? The chips are still in the middle aren't they?????????????????????

I have enough money just in inheritance to last a lifetime. It's about these ***** crooks that don't deal a 100% random game, like each and every person deserves.

After a full analysis i will post if anything arises that may help someone out there looking for answers, or if any other rigtard theories arise.

THE END
THE END

lmao (people at the office heard me crack up)
are you 12?
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:09 PM   #7171
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by BlisterXists View Post

After a full analysis i will post if anything arises that may help someone out there looking for answers, or if any other rigtard theories arise.
Just in case you think I'm a mean and sarcastic person, if you actually *did* an analysis I (and many other people in this thread) would be delighted to look at it and tell you where you went wrong with the math, or start reviewing more data if your analysis does indicate there is something that is wrong.

The problem is, no-one ever posts any decent data. The last time I can remember it happening in this thread was a russian chap who managed to find a cherry-picked sample where he was 1.4 s.ds below EV.

The other problem is, you call them 'rigtard theories', but they are not theories. A 'theory' is falsifiable - it makes predictions about what would be observed and then the data can be tested to see if it matches the prediction. Saying something like 'it's timing', which is a common riggedologist expression, is not a theory, it falls into the 'not even wrong' category:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Not_even_wrong

End rant
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:17 PM   #7172
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by BlisterXists View Post
I just used that as an example of how its a DAY IN DAY OUT PROCESS. You think i ***** care about the money?? Or that it's only 20fpp? The chips are still in the middle aren't they?????????????????????

I have enough money just in inheritance to last a lifetime. It's about these ***** crooks that don't deal a 100% random game, like each and every person deserves.

After a full analysis i will post if anything arises that may help someone out there looking for answers, or if any other rigtard theories arise.

THE END
I commend you for having a theory, and instead of just whining about it over and over, like K13, you're acting looking deeper into it.

But don't just tell us if something comes up, if things look alright, tell us that too!

I wish you the best, and hope that you actually follow through. Many have said they would and so far few have.
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:23 PM   #7173
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

No problem guys. I will be involved with analyzing some of my stuff but not the brains behind it all. I'm basically coming up with tests through my memory of patterns i feel are applicable in testing for theories. I also kinda trained myself along the way to be aware of patterns i see emerging in other players, based on position, history, whether or not they went all in the hand before, bubbles, time frames, stack sizes, buy in amounts, etc. etc. etc. And not in the healthy sense one should be analyzing opponents. But rather trying to prove to myself im imagining patterns based on outside and unauthorized intervention.

I honestly think i can come up with information that would be of great use to the debacle. And shed light on some new things. My motivation would be in the end getting to see them suffer, because i know the 2+2ers would have none of it....

You can giggle about 20fpps and **** like that but i have played a lot of mtts in the last 8 months or so and pretty well dedicated my life to it. I have A LOT of data from 1 to 10 dollar buy in. And no im not giving personal info but can tell you i do not have a -roi.

Last edited by BlisterXists; 07-29-2009 at 04:33 PM. Reason: Added
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:28 PM   #7174
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

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Originally Posted by BlisterXists View Post
I have enough money just in inheritance to last a lifetime. It's about these ***** crooks that don't deal a 100% random game, like each and every person deserves.
Shouldn't you use some of that money to visit your girlfriend in, ahem, Canada?
Quote:
After a full analysis i will post if anything arises that may help someone out there looking for answers, or if any other rigtard theories arise.
we look forward to reading your complete report. when can we expect that, about 1hr after you lose your virginity?
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Old 07-29-2009, 04:56 PM   #7175
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Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

What exactly are you looking for, because I see it going something like this:

AA beats KK, next hand.
QQ beats TT, skip it.
99 beats 66, whatever
AA LOSES TO JJ, wtf rigged.. post reply..
KK beats 22, normal skip it.
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