Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > > >

Discussion of Poker Sites General discussion of online poker sites.

View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes 3,445 34.94%
No 5,522 56.00%
Undecided 893 9.06%
Voters: 9860. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-20-2009, 10:06 PM   #7001
robski
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 50
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cherry MrMisty View Post
where did you find this "article"? On the web? link? until then, you are trying a level, and failing badly.
http://www.ask.com/bar?q=mike+smith+...s-big-hands%2F this is where it is and i think the guys name is bob smith not mike smith
robski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:10 PM   #7002
TheMaverick
newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 25
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

This is exactly the type of conclusions I came to through my own research on Pokerstars.

I'm not sure about the higher level tournaments but the lower levels around
$1.10 are a joke.

Before casting this aside, do yourself an unbiased favour and sit and watch a $1.10 or $2.20 MTT on stars and then wet yourself at the following:

a) Watch for small stack pre-flop all-ins and how many times they lose to
the big stack. Some of the beats are just comical.

b) Watch for how many hands there are players with a large piece of the flop.

Trips v trips, full house v better full house.

Further to the pre-flop all-ins situation my running total from 52 tournaments was 5 wins from 16 pf all-ins with a better hand. 3 wins from 18 with the worse hand.
TheMaverick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:11 PM   #7003
GrannyMae
Goon
 
GrannyMae's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 16,004
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monteroy View Post

If you need a roulette system, literally thousands are available for $50 or less over the internet as well.
my can't lose roulette system is $51, but it comes with a HUD. however, I would consider taking $50 if you pay me in cheese.
GrannyMae is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:15 PM   #7004
cds0699
LOSING
 
cds0699's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 9,028
Cool Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Pokerz is rigged

Poker Stars $6.00+$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t15/t30 Blinds - 9 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (BB): t1500 M = 33.33
UTG: t1430 M = 31.78
UTG+1: t1530 M = 34
UTG+2: t1400 M = 31.11
MP1: t1760 M = 39.11
MP2: t1700 M = 37.78
CO: t1500 M = 33.33
BTN: t1200 M = 26.67
SB: t1480 M = 32.89

Pre Flop: (t45) Hero is BB with 3 K
1 fold, UTG+1 calls t30, UTG+2 calls t30, 1 fold, MP2 calls t30, CO calls t30, 1 fold, SB calls t15, Hero checks

Flop: (t180) 5 4 2 (6 players)
SB checks, Hero bets t120, UTG+1 raises to t1500 all in, UTG+2 calls t1370 all in, MP2 folds, CO folds, SB folds, Hero calls t1350 all in

Turn: (t4490) 8 (3 players - 3 are all in)

River: (t4490) 6 (3 players - 3 are all in)

Final Pot: t4490
Hero shows 3 K (a flush, King high)
UTG+1 shows T 8 (a flush, Ten high)
UTG+2 shows 7 Q (a flush, Queen high)
Hero wins t200
Hero wins t4290
cds0699 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:18 PM   #7005
OldYoda
Mind Trick
 
OldYoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hey,let's be careful out there!
Posts: 859
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by robski View Post
http://www.ask.com/bar?q=mike+smith+...s-big-hands%2F this is where it is and i think the guys name is bob smith not mike smith
It would appear, robski, that I owe you an apology. This is not a stupidity of your own creation. It is a stupidity that you found on the Interweb and didn't have the common sense not to repeat. Consider yourself apologised.
OldYoda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:20 PM   #7006
salty7
grinder
 
salty7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 596
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldYoda View Post
It would appear, robski, that I owe you an apology. This is not a stupidity of your own creation. It is a stupidity that you found on the Interweb and didn't have the common sense not to repeat. Consider yourself apologised.
lol
salty7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:20 PM   #7007
GabeC
banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Biloxi MS
Posts: 17
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Everything this guy says is absoluety true, however I do not believe he is a programmer for the site, but rather just a player that knows whats going on. Full tilt is definately rigged along with all the other sites
GabeC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:23 PM   #7008
salty7
grinder
 
salty7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cincinnati, OH
Posts: 596
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by GabeC View Post
Everything this guy says is absoluety true, however I do not believe he is a programmer for the site, but rather just a player that knows whats going on. Full tilt is definately rigged along with all the other sites
lol will you guys please stop this. i am on my last pair of clean underwear and you are going to make me pee myself because i am laughing so hard.
salty7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:29 PM   #7009
eersfan
journeyman
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 389
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by GabeC View Post
Everything this guy says is absoluety true, however I do not believe he is a programmer for the site, but rather just a player that knows whats going on. Full tilt is definately rigged along with all the other sites
Good point. I now officially believe it is rigged because you said so. Thank you.
eersfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:35 PM   #7010
nicheditch
journeyman
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 333
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Was it this Mike Smith?

nicheditch is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:48 PM   #7011
Mr Q
grinder
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: On the brink of insanity
Posts: 674
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

only thing in here worth a read is GMs responses. good to see ya back calling it like you see em. Hope you are felling better irl.
Mr Q is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 10:56 PM   #7012
otatop
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: unstuckpolitics.com
Posts: 12,727
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheMaverick View Post
This is exactly the type of conclusions I came to through my own research on Pokerstars.

I'm not sure about the higher level tournaments but the lower levels around
$1.10 are a joke.
The perfect scam, rigging themselves a few extra dimes. No one would ever suspect it!
Quote:

Before casting this aside, do yourself an unbiased favour and sit and watch a $1.10 or $2.20 MTT on stars and then wet yourself at the following:

a) Watch for small stack pre-flop all-ins and how many times they lose to
the big stack. Some of the beats are just comical.

b) Watch for how many hands there are players with a large piece of the flop.

Trips v trips, full house v better full house.
Kind of tough to be unbiased when specifically looking for certain situations.
Quote:

Further to the pre-flop all-ins situation my running total from 52 tournaments was 5 wins from 16 pf all-ins with a better hand. 3 wins from 18 with the worse hand.
52 tournaments isn't exactly a huge sample. What's odd is somehow you were only all in 34 times in 52 tournaments. You wouldn't happen to know what happened to you in the other 18, would you?
otatop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 11:13 PM   #7013
OldYoda
Mind Trick
 
OldYoda's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hey,let's be careful out there!
Posts: 859
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrannyMae View Post
my can't lose roulette system is $51, but it comes with a HUD. however, I would consider taking $50 if you pay me in cheese.

I get the best cheese in the world from the Amish at the local Farmer's Market. Strange little people, the Amish. But they can do two things - build barns and make cheese. Make it three things - they also make tons of little Amish. When you're better I'll send you Amish cheese. But keep your roulette - I get hypnotized by the little ball going round and round.
OldYoda is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 11:16 PM   #7014
subs
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
subs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 6,732
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

this is prob the same guy who got banned for making the stuff up about cake poker last night
subs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-20-2009, 11:38 PM   #7015
NFuego20
Pooh-Bah
 
NFuego20's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Cleveland
Posts: 4,295
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

lol omg how has this not been merged yet
NFuego20 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 10:28 AM   #7016
ben6killer
stranger
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 7
Re: Is Full Tilt rigged?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexd10 View Post
lol just remember this quote, " If there weren't bad players making bad calls, then we would never make any money"
Do you really think companies the size or stars and FTP woud rig there cards? ^^
How do you think they got so big? (full tilt and poker stars)
the biggest factor in how much money a poker site makes is its customer base
and its not hard to rig the software to retain the maximum amount of players by tracking accounts. then u get some celeberties to endorse your site throw in a few robots. this is their business model. who cares if its exposed, make as much money now because the goverment can decide to shut u down anyday unless online poker is legalized. if it ever is ,which won't be anytime soon the publicly traded companies and companies that did not break U.S. laws while online poker was illegal will easily get licenses and pokerstars and full tilt might find themselves out in the cold.
ben6killer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 10:52 AM   #7017
banonlinepoker
banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,338
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Their are many folk out there arguing about if online poker is rigged or not…I would like to help put this to rest by stating that it is rigged in many different ways. i helped write some of the software for tiltware LLC…while working on the fulltilt site some of the other programmers and i were asked to install programming into the software that would recognize certain players and provide them with unbeatable hands.

we were also asked to develope software that would provide what they called the”maximum oppurtunity to bet” which meant that the deals are rigged to deal out alot of good starting hands to alot of players so that the most betting possible would take place on every deal. The deal would then provide a monster flop in which atleast two players would be all in before the river.(ever wonder why nobody ever misses the flop online…because then no one would bet and that is not what fulltilt wants) This keeps the tourneys fast paced and exciting which players love. Fulltilt loves this too, the faster you lose the faster they can make more money off you by having enter another tourney.

There is also another way fulltilt cheats you out of cash with their own personal players. These players are called house players and are fulltime employees of the Fulltilt compnay. If you check some names and their online wins vs. loss records you will often find them with records that are simply unreal. I have seen some of these folks who win over 50 straight sessions without a loss…how can this be possible unless they are working on the inside. They come and go and change their names often but they play in the site with the full adavantage of being able to see all the cards in play and in the deck.

Another programming trick we wrote into the software at fulltilt is the levels trick…this trick takes place when a tournament has been running after the first break. The computer recognizes the different size of each players chip stack and begins to deal out hands in which a small stack will shove all in and a large stack will have a better hand to call with.

Have you ever wondered why you get pocekt QQs with 1500 chips and the guy next to you gets pockets KKs and he has 10,000 chips? The answer is simple the site is programmed to get you to play as much as possible. So we programmed the site to eliminate the small stack as quickly as possible so that they can go enter another tourney asap. The site is even prgrammed to adjust the flop for big stacks so that even if the big stack calls your hand with nothing he will end up beating your good made hand by the river. Often times the site will deal you back to back hands with the same cards but maybe different colors or suits..this “glitch” is a sign that the computer is adjusting the shuffle to start elimnting small stacks and allow the tourney to finish quicker.

The sooner a tournament is done the faster fulltilt can have you back at another table spending more money…it is to this sites best interested to eliminate you from tables as fast as possbile. There is no one to regulate how the company manipulates the software to thier own advantage.

There is no one to monitor how the company pays out its players and employees. Simply put, giving some offshore account your hard earned cash is simply insane. Thinking that these people arent cheating you out of your money is crazy, the site has many layers of hidden programming all set up to take full adavantage of all types of players from novice to expert.

the main reason i wrote this blog is to expose the fraud that takes place at online gaming site known as Fulltilt poker i was fired three months ago from the company that helped write the software..yes i am bitter and mad but i do fell everyone so know how bad fulltilt is and that is a site built by THIEVES!!

Howard Lederer should go hang out with Russ Hamilton , ps they kind of look like twins
Amen and for those of you with the motive BS, of course they have motive. They hide offshore, can't be touched by anyone and can manipulate the computer to do whatever it wants. So your going to tell me they are not going fix it so they make more money? Give me a break. It's easy to see the game is far different from live play and it has nothing to do with how many hands you see that is such BS
banonlinepoker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 10:58 AM   #7018
Josem
human chemical weapon
 
Josem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Getting Trolled
Posts: 17,957
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

The xenophobic racism in this thread that implies that anyone who is not American is a thief is pretty offensive.
Josem is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 11:10 AM   #7019
LetsGambool
banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 26,578
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josem View Post
The xenophobic racism in this thread that implies that anyone who is not American is a thief is pretty offensive.
Even more amazing given the recent track record of American regulation.
LetsGambool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 11:10 AM   #7020
robski
enthusiast
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 50
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by OldYoda View Post
It would appear, robski, that I owe you an apology. This is not a stupidity of your own creation. It is a stupidity that you found on the Interweb and didn't have the common sense not to repeat. Consider yourself apologised.
I apologize oldyoda, it appears that you think your smarter than you really are cause you talk like and ******* from marthas vineyard or something.
robski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 11:27 AM   #7021
Arouet
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Arouet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,433
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

When you have a business that can be located literally anywhere in the world, how can you blame a company for choosing jurisdictions that offer incentives, low taxes, etc.

The question is not whether they would do something dishonest if they thought it was undetectable, the question is why they would defraud the players in a way that is bound to be detected?

Rigging the deal is at best a long term profit type scam. We're talking incremental increases that will only show a substantial benefit over time. Rigging the deal is not going to produce an immediate windfall that will let them make a sudden big score. The longer they rig, the higher the chance that it will be found out, especially given this thread which cannot be beyond the attention of every online site out there. We must assume that they are aware they are being watched.

So the real question is: why would they engage in a manner for cheating their customers which can only produce any decent return for them on a long term basis and that is bound to be discovered over time?
Arouet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 01:54 PM   #7022
Bingo_Boy
old hand
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 1,872
Re: Is Full Tilt rigged?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ben6killer View Post
How do you think they got so big? (full tilt and poker stars)
the biggest factor in how much money a poker site makes is its customer base
and its not hard to rig the software to retain the maximum amount of players by tracking accounts. then u get some celeberties to endorse your site throw in a few robots. this is their business model. who cares if its exposed, make as much money now because the goverment can decide to shut u down anyday unless online poker is legalized. if it ever is ,which won't be anytime soon the publicly traded companies and companies that did not break U.S. laws while online poker was illegal will easily get licenses and pokerstars and full tilt might find themselves out in the cold.
Epic first post, well done. For some reason I particularly enjoyed the phrase "throw in a few robots".
Bingo_Boy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 02:41 PM   #7023
Arouet
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Arouet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 6,433
Re: Is Full Tilt rigged?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bingo_Boy View Post
Epic first post, well done. For some reason I particularly enjoyed the phrase "throw in a few robots".
Philosophical Question: if a first post is from a gimmick account from an existing user who is clearly embarassed to post under their existing account, is it really a "first" post?
Arouet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 02:46 PM   #7024
otatop
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: unstuckpolitics.com
Posts: 12,727
Re: The great "Poker is rigged debate" - Collected threads edition

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josem View Post
The xenophobic racism in this thread that implies that anyone who is not American is a thief is pretty offensive.
I also like the "theories" that the sites rig it specifically against Americans, so if it's an American and a German playing, the site will favor the German for whatever reason.
otatop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009, 03:25 PM   #7025
suzzer99
Save the Cheerleader, Save the World
 
suzzer99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: givin' 'em the business
Posts: 98,575
Re: programmer for FTP software tells all

Quote:
Originally Posted by robski View Post
What kind of ****ed up link is this? Why on earth would you provide a link to a search engine result in the first place?

Edit: ok I found the real link you pasted later. So what does this mean to the people who say PS is rigged, but then they go to FTP and get a fair deal. Oh yeah, new player rigging. Dammit.

Also from a programming perspective, it's 100% obvious "Bob Smith" has no idea how to program a large system or how a rigged system would truly be developed. I don't want to list all the ways, lest they show up in the next fake "I programmed the site to be rigged" post somewhere, but for example:

Quote:
Often times the site will deal you back to back hands with the same cards but maybe different colors or suits..this “glitch” is a sign that the computer is adjusting the shuffle to start elimnting small stacks and allow the tourney to finish quicker.
There is just absolutely no conceivable way a computer program would screw up in this manner while "adjusting the shuffle". Think about it for a second. Ok, I'm adjusting the shuffle, but I'm not quite ready yet - better just give player A the same cards but with different suits. Computer programs just don't work that way. He's purposely keying on that memory trick where you notice the 1 time in 169 chances you get dealt the same cards back to back.

Last edited by suzzer99; 07-21-2009 at 03:39 PM.
suzzer99 is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:16 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive