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The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition
View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes
3,502 34.89%
No
5,607 55.86%
Undecided
929 9.25%

07-25-2011 , 01:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwilko_147
I, and others can predict what cards will come out and when 90% of the time.
I know you just made this up but perhaps you could give us some actual estimates, ignoring split pots? Or is there a more complicated system behind your predictions that you'd need to explain?

Hero AK
Villain QQ
All in preflop

Predict AK win = _______ %
Predict QQ win = ______ %
Actual AK win = _______ %


Hero QQ
Villain AK
All in preflop

Predict AK win = _______ %
Predict QQ win = ______ %
Actual AK win = _______ %
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 02:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turb0Licious
Now if you're talking about AGH (Action Generated Hands) well thats another story, but again I don't think this is on the PokerStars network.
For clarity's sake, would we consider AGHs a rig if there were such things?
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 02:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MR_UNOWEN
For clarity's sake, would we consider AGHs a rig if there were such things?
Yes.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 03:36 PM
It's interesting to note that some of the more famous whistleblower cases were reported 10-15 years after the events began and many of the people were subject to retaliation, criminal prosection and one was murdered by government officials.
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07-25-2011 , 04:00 PM
I admit there is no way to disprove a theory that all the sites collectively are in it with governments (which ones) to assassinate anyone who whistleblows about the rig that generates no extra money.

I can see why Party Gaming and other publicly traded companies leave that bit out of their annual report. I suppose that proves they are hiding it.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 04:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MR_UNOWEN
For clarity's sake, would we consider AGHs a rig if there were such things?
I would consider it rigging. But I'm still not convinced it would necessarily be illegal.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 04:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monteroy
I admit there is no way to disprove a theory that all the sites collectively are in it with governments (which ones) to assassinate anyone who whistleblows about the rig that generates no extra money.

I can see why Party Gaming and other publicly traded companies leave that bit out of their annual report. I suppose that proves they are hiding it.
This guy is truly one of a kind. (not in a good way).
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 04:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gothninja
I would consider it rigging. But I'm still not convinced it would necessarily be illegal.
I agree. If it happens, I would like to be sure to get it quashed if online poker were to become legal in the US. Your comment about it possibly not being illegal is what keeps me thinking about acceptable industry standards.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 04:36 PM
I think a business that promised a product (random cards) and knowingly failed to give that product (ie, by rigging the deck) would be illegal under standard anti-fraud laws.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812
Really? Your all-knowing, get riggies on the right path, here is the correct way to argue routine gets annoying. Who is talking about boomswitches or doomswitches? What freeroll do you refer to?

You asked for a rig that would be of benefit to the site, I gave you one. You are asked to explain how a player can would discover such a rig and, instead, you keep going into your "how does everyone keep the secret" routine or that the old programmers (circa 2002?) would have to go to their graves with their secrets.

How about simply compartmentalization of job duties and different levels of security clearances as a possible explanation that no one talks. Or even more simply, one department in the company doesn't know what the other departments do. Have you ever seen a standard confidentiality/trade secret agreement? Maybe people are willing to keep quiet rather than face a legal battle with an ex-employer when they are still trying to work in the same industry.

In my example, the guy that creates the rigged hands does not ever need to know that they were implemented in real play. The guy that implements the rig is a major shareholder. Does the shareholder ever realistically whistleblow on the company?

Is the next post about all the contractory riggie theories that in your mind are impossible to reconcile, therefore, none of them can be valid.
+1
Also, I think monteroy should be getting paid double time. Hes been in here lying his ass of for at least 18 hrs.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 04:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by otatop
PokerStars.net is pretty blatantly rigged. Why else would they not let you save or even look at HHs?

Plus you can't even check your play money balance, so for all you know they're skimming it back.
You a funny doofus!
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812
Well done BB, you are so predickable. Can't satify a woman, but predickable.
Probably more of a man pleaser.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gothninja
I would consider it rigging. But I'm still not convinced it would necessarily be illegal.
I'm confident it would result in the site being hit with huge fines and possibly suspension by the licensing agent. (At least Alderney or IOM)
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josem
I think a business that promised a product (random cards) and knowingly failed to give that product (ie, by rigging the deck) would be illegal under standard anti-fraud laws.
Correct. And their day will come.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josem
I think a business that promised a product (random cards) and knowingly failed to give that product (ie, by rigging the deck) would be illegal under standard anti-fraud laws.
Agreed. Which is why it's so important they are clear about what they promise. Do they offer a random shuffle, or do they just use promise fairness and randomness?

Pokerstars passes the test.

FTP isn't so clear about it, but they're not very clear about segregating customer funds either...
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gothninja
Agreed. Which is why it's so important they are clear about what they promise. Do they offer a random shuffle, or do they just use promise fairness and randomness?

Pokerstars passes the test.

FTP isn't so clear about it, but they're not very clear about segregating customer funds either...
By the way, did you folks see that thread regarding PS getting back into the US market? Sorry to digress. Just wanted some quick comments, but maybe it shouldn't be here.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MR_UNOWEN
By the way, did you folks see that thread regarding PS getting back into the US market? Sorry to digress. Just wanted some quick comments, but maybe it shouldn't be here.
link please
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by J9Suited
This debate is all too grown up and intelligent.

I need to come in and spout some nonsense
Anything you say will do.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MR_UNOWEN
By the way, did you folks see that thread regarding PS getting back into the US market? Sorry to digress. Just wanted some quick comments, but maybe it shouldn't be here.
Well, since they locked that thread, comments can't go there. But this guy apparenlty is not that credible and was trying to get people to send him money. Guess we'll just have to wait and see.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:25 PM
I apologize if that OP was not trustworthy. The thread is now closed. Didn't have time to go through it all, but I will look later. Title is "BIG news about PokerStars" in case anyone is curious.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arouet
Well, since they locked that thread, comments can't go there. But this guy apparenlty is not that credible and was trying to get people to send him money. Guess we'll just have to wait and see.
Yes, sorry again. I should've checked a second time before posting.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwilko_147
I've never been a believer in pokerstars being rigged until recently. I have been playing there for about 2 years now, playing almost everyday and I'm now sick of being screwed over. Their RNG is so dodgy. On their site it says that the RNG creates a sequence of "APPARENTLY" unrelated numbers and the certificate they have to prove this claims that there is no predictability or bias in their RNG. I now do not believe this as I, and others can predict what cards will come out and when 90% of the time.
My other reason for believing it's rigged is- They are wanting to make maximum profits and they aren't going to do this with their VIP programme. They are giving so much away from small things (which still costs money) to cash and cars. There are a load of supernovas on there that can exchange 250,000 fpps for $4000 and they can make that in probably 2 weeks or less. Ok, so they spend more in rake to get that but I still think they create losers to make the profits they make each year. They also have alot of staff to pay and pro's that they sponsor.
I also think that since "Black Friday" it has got even worse. This is just my opinion though so don't be too harsh in your response.
Someone with some common sense, drowned out in a sea of shady b.s.ers.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwilko_147
HAHA, obviously this is just a rant and 90% is VERY unrealistic and I did mean to say it was in all-in situations after seeing all hole cards.

It was something I posted the other day on another thread after feeling like I'd just been robbed.
OOPS. Spoke to soon. Was mistaking you for someone with a brain. Sorry.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dwilko_147
...On their site it says that the RNG creates a sequence of "APPARENTLY" unrelated numbers and the certificate they have to prove this claims that there is no predictability or bias in their RNG...
apparent
1. Readily seen; visible.
2. Readily understood; clear or obvious.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
07-25-2011 , 05:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blatantlyrigged
OOPS. Spoke to soon. Was mistaking you for someone with a brain. Sorry.
It's interesting you were absent for a substantial discussion about a feasible rigging theory, but I suppose that's a bit out of your depth.

But now you're back to playground name calling, I guess normal service is resumed.
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