You mean like the analysis Spadebidder did with the data from 1 billion hands? Yes, we saw that wasn't enough for the tards but surprisingly those with an understanding of maths found it quite as expected.

One side of the argument has provided evidence that it isn't rigged and you're right the other refuse to believe it while not bringing any proof whatsoever to the table to try to convince those of us that believe it likely isn't rigged that it is...and no, anecdote's from a friend of a friend don't count.

I also note that you totally ignored my response about what things like HEM and PT3 can do but I assume you read it as you have stopped babbling on about "the programmes"

It must have been this impressive promo they put together

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AMLst_Brvz4&NR=1


Site> http://www.realdealpoker.com/

I wonder why they hated this.......

Most of the "hate" for Real Deal came from the fact that they weren't, in fact, using a "Real Deal" like they claimed, and they used a bunch of actual, honest to God shills on 2+2 to pimp their stillborn site. This may alarm you, but some of us are capable of both posting and playing at the same time. Because the whole point of these forums is to help others improve their games?

Riggies can't improve their game while believing it's rigged, because instead of being able to be honest with themselves and admit they have huge, obvious leaks, they just write it off with a "I'm the best player that ever lived, it's just these God damned sites out to rob me of my $2 holding me back!"

If you think in a way that doesn't allow you to plug leaks, there's no hope for your improvement as a player.

lol and some of us don't play 24/7.... I mean seriously what kind of "logic" is being thrown around here? If you're a poker player you should only be playing poker and nothing else? And people wonder why they're not taken seriously.

No. There is more than one way to achieve rigging. I think not paying is a sufficient condition. There are others.

By the way has anyone in this entire thread ever bothered to define "rigging". Might want to get on that you scholars.

So Full Tilt's genius scheme to rig their games was to operate for ~7 years, then get their assets frozen by the DOJ? Good point, no one in the 3 years this thread has existed has even bothered to define rigging. Thank God you showed up to set us straight!

Its generally accepted that rigged in this thread means the RNG is crooked.

Why do you not present you Evidence that the deal is rigged.

Then, if it is credible and implies what you think it implies, all the shills and site promoters will be out of a job.

BTW, making post after post after post saying : "It's rigged" does not constitute evidence.

It's drama poker. Completely unrealistic.

Again, please present your Evidence to back up that remark.

Lest everyone thinks you are just throwing a tantrum because you cannot win.

Lol.

Funny how you can 'LOL' a statement made that is supported by actual evidence and yet when you perpetrate wild and irresponsible libels you ridicule anyone who asks you to provide evidence to back up your accusations.

Basically, you are behaving like a complete douche.

I 100% agree.

Now that I have been playing live poker I see for sure that it is rigged. I can't see these shuffle machines. tHEY PuT cards in them and clsoe the top.

And like I said before I've seen way more sets, full houses and such then what should be happening. And I've seen way many more sets over sets and such. (Off topic but the players generally play them so ridiculously terribly that every couple hours I see a full house vs. set checked down and result in a 25 big blind pot or so.)

I have no data. But I seen it.

I did at least ask the dealers and floor persons for hand histories. They will give me none. I took it to the Poker Room Manager. He gave me the same stupid story about not keeping track. How can a legitimate poker operator not keep track of the hands? It doesn't make sense.

How am I supposed to check the fairness when they won't give me the statistics? They're obviously covering something up.

Oh ... how I yearn for the days of fair poker .... when I could play online, and I could track any hand history I wanted and use them all to check for statistical fairness.

These live American casinos are obviously crooked. Hidden shuffle machines, won't give me hand histories, and C'MON, YOU CAN JUST SEE, I CAN SEE ... IT'S CLEARLY RIGGED, YOU CAN TELL FROM LOOKING.



And just so no one gets the wrong idea .... I'm a winning player. So I know what I'm talking about. But even though I'm winning I can still tell it is rigged.

Since I had to start playing live I'm up like $650. I've played mostly 2/5 but a little 1/2 also. I've played like 30 hours or so. So I guess I've played somewhere from like 600 to 900 hands. Pretty solid amount, right? I think my real winrate i a little higher though. I'm a good player and I've seen people say good players get a little higher than that.


But I guess that proves it. My winrate is obviously a little lower because the casinos are rigging it.


I don't know what more I can say. If you EVER play At One OF theser Places You'LL Know. You can TELL.

^^^ ROFLMAO! ^^^

+1
Don't bElieVe the dreamers and shilLs for the B&m casinos. Yeah its regulated but meeningless becase their is no tracibility. All crooks
(Hope I got enouf typos in as well)

How can you have a FH vs. a set? I think you mean an overfull vs underfull or trips vs. FH?
Real Deal, live shuffle with the capability to order HH, that solves your problem!

That's an assumption of a poor definition of rigging. It doesn't encompass all the ways a player can be cheated. Maybe a focused question of whether or a not a particular software feature of a particular site conforms to a defined standard could have it's own thread in the probability section. But if the debate of this thread is supposed to decide whether or not online poker is rigged then that needs to be defined clearly.

It has been defined very clearly, for some reason you just have not been able to see it. The rigging discussion here is always about whether the RnG is fair at the online sites.

You could be cheated if you download a virus that allows someone to access your computer, so is that a form of rigging?

If you have a theory then by all means post it in the probability section (I like to hurl riggies there whenever possible), but if it has something to do with the fairness of the deal then this is the thread.

Feel free to post your "focused question" here and in that forum and see how it goes. Appreciate that most beliefs have been posted as well as the opposite beliefs (ie: short stacks win too much / big stacks win too much), so the odds are high that whatever take you have on your observations and lack of an actual hand history database has already been said here many times before.

All the best.

P.S. Now if only Arouet could follow Lego to the dark side...

Real Deal shuffle capatility with HH's?

I don't know what u r talkinmg about


The casino has shuffle machines that rigs the deck ... you cant see the cards. Then they all gets sets and 2 pairs .. .ad they rake 10% .... you cat win. Tey wont let you.

How about you taking the lead on this?

But please don't include statements such as this,

I propose that if FTP keeps the player's money then this debate is definitively settled that online poker is rigged. It proves that under the conditions presupposed in this debate (specifically the legal parameters under which the major sites operate) that skill does not correlate with with winning money. The system was obviously inherently corrupt, or rigged, if FTP does not pay out.

We don't know what FTP is going to do and PS has already paid so you're generalization doesn't make sense. I don't think that because PS paid proves anything one way or the other with regards to "rigging" but It certainly says something about their integrity. (Not that I ever questioned it in the first place)

I would be interested to hear how you would better define "rigging"; perhaps you may be able to bring some better focus to the discussion.

I was winning in the casino wed night and got asked to cash out and leave. Apprently I had been abusing the dealers the night before. Would be some achievement as I was 200 miles away. Took an hour to sort out and get myself unbanned, guess they were rigging it to protect the short stacks

There are a lot of caps in there so it must be true.

AND, my dear shill, you are so full of ****!

Ive said this before but it was lost many pages back.
Since this thread is overrun with shills, affiliates, etc. anybody with enough common sense to realize to deal is manipulated in OLP really should stop posting. Dont ask questions or provide any insight! You, as you see, will just get bombarded with foolishness and anger. Its better to let the shills have at it. How about it?
Try someplace else(real players that is). How about covers.com, poker forum. Not a lot of traffic, but will save some frustration. Ratio of players to shills is about the opposite of here.

LOL, you'd last about 20 minutes