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The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition
View Poll Results: Is Online Poker Rigged?
Yes
3,508 34.88%
No
5,615 55.84%
Undecided
933 9.28%

04-27-2011 , 01:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cocopoco
You continue to work for a company that was federally indicted by the United States of America for serious crimes.

Most law abiding citizens would run like hell. Then again you have mouths to feed I'm sure.

My other points stand.

Indicted, not convicted. Or do you not believe in the innocent until proven guilty concept of justice? Our governor was indicted, should everyone quite their state jobs? Members of Congress get indicted, do we all move out of the U.S.? Give us the name of the company or organization you work for, I am sure we can find some dirt on them.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
04-27-2011 , 02:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812
Indicted, not convicted. Or do you not believe in the innocent until proven guilty concept of justice? Our governor was indicted, should everyone quite their state jobs? Members of Congress get indicted, do we all move out of the U.S.? Give us the name of the company or organization you work for, I am sure we can find some dirt on them.
Most twelve year olds aren't employed by companies.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
04-27-2011 , 02:28 PM
Three consecutive hands I witnessed this morning, all puked up by the famous handulator at Randomstars:

PokerStars Game #61363461472: Tournament #418010073, $3.00+$0.30 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (125/250) - 2011/04/27 7:37:18 WET [2011/04/27 2:37:18 ET]
Table '418010073 65' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: LynxMendes (3021 in chips)
Seat 2: Tiewire (4760 in chips)
Seat 3: ShipthemBBs (26346 in chips)
Seat 4: hero (4356 in chips)
Seat 5: Mingr69 (1900 in chips)
Seat 6: L.A. Vale 60 (2712 in chips)
Seat 7: krepkiiperec (3075 in chips)
Seat 8: been_pt (13154 in chips)
Seat 9: emma2342 (1975 in chips)
LynxMendes: posts the ante 25
Tiewire: posts the ante 25
ShipthemBBs: posts the ante 25
hero: posts the ante 25
Mingr69: posts the ante 25
L.A. Vale 60: posts the ante 25
krepkiiperec: posts the ante 25
been_pt: posts the ante 25
emma2342: posts the ante 25
Tiewire: posts small blind 125
ShipthemBBs: posts big blind 250
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to hero [5h 2h]
hero: folds
Mingr69: folds
L.A. Vale 60: folds
krepkiiperec: folds
been_pt: calls 250
emma2342: folds
LynxMendes: calls 250
Tiewire: folds
ShipthemBBs: checks
*** FLOP *** [8d Ad Kd]
ShipthemBBs: checks
been_pt: checks
LynxMendes: bets 750
ShipthemBBs: calls 750
been_pt: calls 750
*** TURN *** [8d Ad Kd] [Jd]
ShipthemBBs: checks
been_pt: checks
LynxMendes: bets 1996 and is all-in
ShipthemBBs: folds
been_pt: calls 1996
*** RIVER *** [8d Ad Kd Jd] [5c]
LynxMendes said, "wow"
*** SHOW DOWN ***
been_pt: shows [Td Qd] (a Royal Flush)
LynxMendes: shows [Tc Js] (a pair of Jacks)
LynxMendes said, "n1"
been_pt collected 7342 from pot
LynxMendes finished the tournament in 366th place
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 7342 | Rake 0
Board [8d Ad Kd Jd 5c]
Seat 1: LynxMendes (button) showed [Tc Js] and lost with a pair of Jacks
Seat 2: Tiewire (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: ShipthemBBs (big blind) folded on the Turn
Seat 4: hero folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: Mingr69 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: L.A. Vale 60 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: krepkiiperec folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: been_pt showed [Td Qd] and won (7342) with a Royal Flush
Seat 9: emma2342 folded before Flop (didn't bet)


PokerStars Game #61363479609: Tournament #418010073, $3.00+$0.30 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (125/250) - 2011/04/27 7:38:40 WET [2011/04/27 2:38:40 ET]
Table '418010073 65' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 2: Tiewire (4610 in chips)
Seat 3: ShipthemBBs (25321 in chips)
Seat 4: hero (4331 in chips)
Seat 5: Mingr69 (1875 in chips)
Seat 6: L.A. Vale 60 (2687 in chips)
Seat 7: krepkiiperec (3050 in chips)
Seat 8: been_pt (17475 in chips)
Seat 9: emma2342 (1950 in chips)
Tiewire: posts the ante 25
ShipthemBBs: posts the ante 25
hero: posts the ante 25
Mingr69: posts the ante 25
L.A. Vale 60: posts the ante 25
krepkiiperec: posts the ante 25
been_pt: posts the ante 25
emma2342: posts the ante 25
ShipthemBBs: posts small blind 125
hero: posts big blind 250
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to hero [Qc 8d]
Mingr69: folds
been_pt said, "ty"
L.A. Vale 60: folds
krepkiiperec: folds
been_pt: folds
emma2342: raises 1675 to 1925 and is all-in
Tiewire: folds
ShipthemBBs: calls 1800
hero: folds
*** FLOP *** [Js As Ks]
*** TURN *** [Js As Ks] [6d]
*** RIVER *** [Js As Ks 6d] [Qs]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
ShipthemBBs: shows [6h Qd] (two pair, Queens and Sixes)
emma2342: shows [Kc Ts] (a Royal Flush)
emma2342 collected 4300 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 4300 | Rake 0
Board [Js As Ks 6d Qs]
Seat 2: Tiewire (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: ShipthemBBs (small blind) showed [6h Qd] and lost with two pair, Queens and Sixes
Seat 4: hero (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Mingr69 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: L.A. Vale 60 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: krepkiiperec folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: been_pt folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: emma2342 showed [Kc Ts] and won (4300) with a Royal Flush


PokerStars Game #61363489263: Tournament #418010073, $3.00+$0.30 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (125/250) - 2011/04/27 7:39:25 WET [2011/04/27 2:39:25 ET]
Table '418010073 65' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 2: Tiewire (4585 in chips)
Seat 3: ShipthemBBs (23371 in chips)
Seat 4: hero (4056 in chips)
Seat 5: Mingr69 (1850 in chips)
Seat 6: L.A. Vale 60 (2662 in chips)
Seat 7: krepkiiperec (3025 in chips)
Seat 8: been_pt (17450 in chips)
Seat 9: emma2342 (4300 in chips)
Tiewire: posts the ante 25
ShipthemBBs: posts the ante 25
hero: posts the ante 25
Mingr69: posts the ante 25
L.A. Vale 60: posts the ante 25
krepkiiperec: posts the ante 25
been_pt: posts the ante 25
emma2342: posts the ante 25
hero: posts small blind 125
Mingr69: posts big blind 250
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to hero [4s 8h]
hero said, "yawn"
L.A. Vale 60: folds
krepkiiperec: folds
Tiewire said, "2 in a row wtf"
been_pt: calls 250
emma2342: raises 750 to 1000
Tiewire: folds
FLOWAZZZ is connected
ShipthemBBs: calls 1000
been_pt said, "ya dois seguidos"
hero: folds
Mingr69: folds
been_pt said, "mas este so faltava 1 carta"
been_pt: folds
*** FLOP *** [Jh 6h 6s]
emma2342: checks
ShipthemBBs: bets 847
emma2342: calls 847
*** TURN *** [Jh 6h 6s] [5d]
emma2342: checks
ShipthemBBs: bets 800
emma2342: calls 800
*** RIVER *** [Jh 6h 6s 5d] [2h]
emma2342: bets 1628 and is all-in
ShipthemBBs: calls 1628
*** SHOW DOWN ***
emma2342: shows [Jd Js] (a full house, Jacks full of Sixes)
ShipthemBBs: shows [2c Ts] (two pair, Sixes and Deuces)
emma2342 collected 9375 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 9375 | Rake 0
Board [Jh 6h 6s 5d 2h]
Seat 2: Tiewire folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: ShipthemBBs (button) showed [2c Ts] and lost with two pair, Sixes and Deuces
Seat 4: hero (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 5: Mingr69 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: L.A. Vale 60 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: krepkiiperec folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: been_pt folded before Flop
Seat 9: emma2342 showed [Jd Js] and won (9375) with a full house, Jacks full of Sixes


After two royal flushes in a row, it seems almost trivial that someone should flop a full house.

Random?

LOL
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
04-27-2011 , 02:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by raymears
Three consecutive hands I witnessed this morning, all puked up by the famous handulator at Randomstars:

...

After two royal flushes in a row, it seems almost trivial that someone should flop a full house.

Random?
If it was rigged, do you seriously think they would allow two royal flushes followed by a full house?
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
04-27-2011 , 02:51 PM
Pokerstars, rigging $3 MTTs since 2011.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
04-27-2011 , 02:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by joejeweler
Lost 29 of 33 poc AA hands over a month,.......such BS........
Are you ever going to produce evidence of this or should we assume it is just another rigtard lie?

Quote:
Originally Posted by joejeweler
When i got up i pushed, and some nights i played TWO hands of $2000 per hand.
On just a few occasions i got up to a $5000 hand with a split or double-down.
Play $10,000 on one hand and it was a bit tense there,......but at least i knew the deal was fair. I've had several $100K+ wins in blackjack over the years, and
lost more than a few sessions of $75K or less also. Best 2 trip win was in
2009 at Trump Taj,......over $122K on my only 2 times there.

For a guy making $39K a year at a regular job,......that's serious money. I retired
from both my job and that level of blackjack, and went to poker because the
risk/reward factor was easier to deal with. Days where i brought down $100K to a casino are past for me at age 54 now. Bringing $3000 down for a poker trip
much easier to stomach.

Now this IS my job. I payed off my $200K house in 3 years and have some assets to live on for the next 10 to 15 years,......but it's got to last me so i've
gravitated to poker at a modest level to work on the extra's i'd like out of life.
Nobody wants to hear your fabricated tall tales about what a degenerate you are Grandad.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
04-27-2011 , 03:41 PM
Never read this thread before today. LOL this reminds me of the random bits of gold I hear when playing live. I do not think many people realize how tough the online poker world is and that beating your local live game does not translate whatsoever. Poker is just like anything in the world, everyone thinks they are better than they are... It is quite funny to see the egos of these people so badly bruised that it must be someone else's fault. Thank you people for brightening my day.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
04-27-2011 , 03:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiki
If it was rigged, do you seriously think they would allow two royal flushes followed by a full house?
It's juiced for entertainment purposes. It just can't help doing what it does.

Quote:
Originally Posted by meekrab
Pokerstars, rigging $3 MTTs since 2011.
Crawl back under your rock noob.
The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
04-27-2011 , 03:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by raymears
    Poker Stars, $3 Buy-in (125/250 blinds, 25 ante) No Limit Hold'em Tournament, 8 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #9169902

    Tiewire (CO): 4,585 (18.3 bb)
    ShipthemBBs (BTN): 23,371 (93.5 bb)
    Hero (SB): 4,056 (16.2 bb)
    Mingr69 (BB): 1,850 (7.4 bb)
    L.A. Vale 60 (UTG+2): 2,662 (10.6 bb)
    krepkiiperec (MP1): 3,025 (12.1 bb)
    been_pt (MP2): 17,450 (69.8 bb)
    emma2342 (MP3): 4,300 (17.2 bb)

    Preflop: (200) Hero is SB with 4 8
    2 folds, been_pt calls 250, emma2342 raises to 1,000, Tiewire folds, ShipthemBBs calls 1,000, 3 folds

    Flop: (2,825) J 6 6 (2 players)
    emma2342 checks, ShipthemBBs bets 847, emma2342 calls 847

    Turn: (4,519) 5 (2 players)
    emma2342 checks, ShipthemBBs bets 800, emma2342 calls 800

    River: (6,119) 2 (2 players)
    emma2342 bets 1,628 and is all-in, ShipthemBBs calls 1,628

    Spoiler:
    Results: 9,375 pot
    Final Board: J 6 6 5 2
    ShipthemBBs showed 2 T and lost (-4,300 net)
    emma2342 showed J J and won 9,375 (5,075 net)



    Get the Flash Player to use the Hold'em Manager Replayer.
    God damn, Stars has gotten way softer since black friday.

    Also, I can't wait until later when I can look up your username and mock your results.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 03:52 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by otatop
    Lots of clever pretty pictures for people who can't read
    You forgot to convert the 2 CONSECUTIVE ROYAL FLUSHES. Surely they're worthy of a mention?
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 03:58 PM
    Just curious if there is ONE riggie in this thread that is a proven winning player at poker. Can anyone of you guys show you can beat NL25? Its so obvious that 99% of you guys are just sore losers. Grow up.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 03:58 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by otatop
    God damn, Stars has gotten way softer since black friday.
    You mean since the american people left? Ah yes, a race famous throughout the world for their pig-headed arrogance, but you're not here to disprove that are you?
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 03:59 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 5thStreetHog
    Just curious if there is ONE riggie in this thread that is a proven winning player at poker. Can anyone of you guys show you can beat NL25? Its so obvious that 99% of you guys are just sore losers. Grow up.
    This comment comes across as very arrogant. Are you a closet liberal?
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:04 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by raymears
    This comment comes across as very arrogant. Are you a closet liberal?
    Good comeback.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:07 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by NFuego20
    Josem you have more patience arguing with these lunatics than I ever will. Go back and forth once or twice but at a certain point you're just talking to a brick wall.

    There are a small handful of "riggies" who post with some level of intelligence in this thread and can carry on a reasonable discussion. None of them are contributing right now.

    FAIL!
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:08 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wiki
    But the problem is that the riggies do not have the maths/stats skills to analyse their hands.

    Presumably, anyone who is concerned that the deal is rigged will analyse their hands and discover that it isn't and never even venture into a thread like this.

    That leaves, on the riggie side, a large number of people who have zero understanding of the statistical principles involved and are completely incapable of performing the requisite analyses.

    i.e they believe that they can see the deal is rigged but have no way to either prove it or disabuse themselves of the idea.
    FAIL!
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:18 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by NFuego20
    um no, lol

    The fact that the intellectually void, along with sarcastic people and people with multiple gimmick accounts exist is not evidence of anything whatsoever. Most serious poker players don't even bother with the stupidity of this thread, and as each day goes by I understand why all the more.

    What would be pretty damning, is actual evidence of wrongdoing. Should be pretty easy to find too since so many people are sure they're seeing something wrong.
    Intellectually void would be a good way to describe someone who is looking right at the manipulated deal while playing, but still saying its not rigged.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:25 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Wiki
    If it was rigged, do you seriously think they would allow two royal flushes followed by a full house?
    I MUST know the answer after your response here. Completely ignorant dreamer, or site shill, please tell.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:35 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by blatantlyrigged
    I MUST know the answer after your response here. Completely ignorant dreamer, or site shill, please tell.
    It looks to me like he is using the turn of events I posted to actually prove the legitimacy of the deal in some perverse way!

    I said it before and I'll say it again... LOL
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:46 PM
    Thought I'd have some fun. Good ol' fashioned withdrawal or ask for a withdrawal and then watch your bankroll disappear.

    Haven't had a losing session on Sportsbook Poker since I signed up. Tried to withdrawal. I'm told it will have to wait. Next time I get on, I lose $200+ on a total of three hands. One where I have KK, other has AA. Next where I have J,J and other guy has K,K. After I build back up, I have Q,Q and guy calls a $40 raise with Q,9 pre-flop, then calls a re-re-raise on the flop for over $200 on a draw. Of course he hits it.

    I lose money twice as often after a cash out than any other time.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:54 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by itwassooted!
    Thought I'd have some fun. Good ol' fashioned withdrawal or ask for a withdrawal and then watch your bankroll disappear.

    Haven't had a losing session on Sportsbook Poker since I signed up. Tried to withdrawal. I'm told it will have to wait. Next time I get on, I lose $200+ on a total of three hands. One where I have KK, other has AA. Next where I have J,J and other guy has K,K. After I build back up, I have Q,Q and guy calls a $40 raise with Q,9 pre-flop, then calls a re-re-raise on the flop for over $200 on a draw. Of course he hits it.

    I lose money twice as often after a cash out than any other time.
    This happens to everyone. Only a poker employee, shill, or ignorant dreamer will tell you otherwise. Problem is, this thread is infested with about 90% of them who well try to tell you otherwise. The answer will be variance or some crap like that.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:54 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by 5thStreetHog
    Just curious if there is ONE riggie in this thread that is a proven winning player at poker. Can anyone of you guys show you can beat NL25? Its so obvious that 99% of you guys are just sore losers. Grow up.
    you sir are an idiot...yes im a winner & i cant believe im back in this joke shill thread defending my play...again sir grow up & go back to shilling !
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 04:58 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by joker15801
    you sir are an idiot...yes im a winner & i cant believe im back in this joke shill thread defending my play...again sir grow up & go back to shilling !
    I got a better idea back me on the site of your choice proven winner! US player ( i will send hand histories) & ill split profits with any shill ...if i win u win but if i lose u guys gotta post HH here
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 05:05 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by joker15801
    you sir are an idiot...yes im a winner & i cant believe im back in this joke shill thread defending my play...again sir grow up & go back to shilling !
    Post stats please. I dont believe you will because I dont believe you are a winning player. I believe you are a horrible losing player that has no concept of how to play the game. Prove me wrong.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote
    04-27-2011 , 05:05 PM
    Blatantly Rigged: you still haven't replied to my post. An oversight I'm sure. Here, I'll repost it for you:

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Arouet
    It is not the same. Any rig that would be detectable just by watching would show up in bright lights on an analysis of a significant sample. No one has been able to demonstrate this.

    Human beings have evolved to notice patterns. But we do it far from perfectly. There is a logical fallacy called the confirmation bias which applies very strongly here. Essentially, it is that we tend to recall the hits, and forget about the misses. Add to that that this type of study requires statistical analysis to determine whether the odds are off, and you have a situation that makes casual observing a very poor measure of accuracy.

    You can test this yourself. Play a 1000 hands and pick something to observe. Do it normally, as you have been doing, don't change your habits now. then load your hands into a tracker and see how your casual observations measured up. I'll bet that you missed a lot.

    If you disagree, I'd like to hear why.
    The great "Poker is rigged" debate - Collected threads edition Quote

          
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