Jesus Christ of latter day ****ing saints.. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills....I want to crawl into a hole and come back to online poker when it is regulated and or someone smart takes over the sites... wuuuuuuuuuuuuuut in Jesus H is going on here

This doesn't make a whole helluva lot of sense either.
Those of you following the Politics forum here on 2+2 are aware
of Italy's economic probs... these are severe enuf that
even these little sites could not be sustained long term from these free-spending degens. I have no idea what these partners were thinking tbh.

On a more positive note, it is a good thing these sites are pulling all of these bull**** stunts now so that consumer protection against this type of behaviour can be hopefully worked into any legislation.

The sites do this because its a wild wild west right now and they simply make up the rules as they go along.

I would say this is pretty accurate. Ever since Everleaf finally convinced ITA and u-Poker subnetworks to merge into the main player base, (hardly coincidentally this happened around the time .it sites launched cash games) they have done things to heavily cater to the Italians. First they tried the silly star-rating system. Rake was already higher on the Euro tables, but when all those sportsbooks from Enet moved over 2 months ago, rake increased. While I am not defending any of their decisions, one must remember they are catering to Italian sportsbooks. As we see with other sportsbooks, they have become more and more concerned about good poker players cannibalizing the fish. The result is questionable decisions, not unlike the strange ones Bodog is making to save the fish from us evil winning players.

Much of that is likely related simply to the bottom line. Everleaf earns more money off the Italian skins, than the more well known skins we see all the time here on 2p2. Not only because of the higher rake, and lack of USD tables, but in direct revenue too. Most of the Italian fish don't earn rakeback, and many are just casual players playing in internet cafes. NoFx's line of thinking in a few of his posts are pretty solid and he is in line with their logic.

I do not agree this is "safe to assume" at all. I don't think it is in anyway an indication they are broke. People seem convinced Everleaf is a fly by night operation, but they have been operating solidly since 2006. Also their Malta LGA license is supposed to guarantee all player funds are in segregated bank accounts. But hey, don't let a little truth get in the way of some good fear mongering. That's what Americans are best at.

i am really sorry for you guys.you have the stand these idiots.
**** joke.
god bless you pokerstars.

This is the same thing I thought and even mentioned as frustrating from my point of view. Since the last Italian partners joined they've made even more questionable decisions even though it seemed apparent that a lot of the larger skins we are familiar with were against those changes. While your not going to make every partner happy in business, it seems you would want to make your loyal partners that have been with you longer happy before making multiple changes for a new partner, though I assume that was what it took to get those partners to join ELG in the first place.

Just an all around shame, IMO.

At the moment there are overall twelve 20 and 50 NL 6-max Euro tables running, with 3 italien players at them. (all shorties)

So this table ban only applies to us players but not Italian ones?

Fwiw I haven't seen the message notifying that I cannot sit at a table. I'll try to start tables but if it's doesn't work, I'm probably done with the site. if their goal is to take the winning players off the felts, im going to fall into their trap. I won 5k over the last two weeks of November and I'm down quite a bit over the last few days of this month. I don't see the point of playing if I can't get action on the site

I really hope this flops for these sites. Imagine what a terrible precedent this would set if it works out?

My gut feeling says it won't. It's a pipe-dream for the sites to think that every player on their network will be equally bad, thus creating a system where no one cashes out. Poker just doesn't work that way.

If they institute mandatory caps on the USD tables, i'll withdraw every cent.

Doubt anyone is gonna complain about more than 1 italian per table.

I'm not American and I'm not fear mongering. Keep playing there if you want. Do not request any sort of proof or investigation from their regulators. Hell, make a point of depositing all your money on there.

I think the compromise is giving us high rakeback and bonuses and showing us/allowing us to play the tables at all. I don't like this at all either, but I do understand their thinking and I do think overall we are better off than we could be. It's one thing people never mention when they complain of the rake, is the fact that we get high rakeback and bonuses to help compensate that and as GrindUnumb said, a lot of the players that populate those tables don't even have rakeback so again we just are kind of a drain on their tables. Add in the fact that the other skins players are winning a lot of the money too, and I can see how they don't really care for this and overall I think this compromise is better than being booted from them all together.

Also, thanks for posting, GrindUnumb.

This has been done. It's been posted in the thread. Apparently, Everleaf is audited, including their bank accounts, every month to make sure they are compliant with the segregation etc.

level?

I would be completely behind the network being able to prove the funds are segregated. I honestly would love to see this. The fear mongering I point out is the 60 or so posts in this thread claiming that this new rule automatically means Everleaf is going under and paying cashouts with deposits. That is a silly conclusion.

thread is slowly deterioration. Is it a time to scream
"HITLER HITLER WAR WAR "
to shut it down or would be better to see the resolution/progress on the actual issue that started the conversation?

The LGA license is a joke. There have been several scams run out of Malta. Betonbet and Stryyke instantly come to mind. LGA also refused to get involved with the Betfair casino scam. I am not saying that Everleaf has issues, but don't 100% trust them because of the LGA license.

Minted has lost a lot of my play this month.
Do they care??

It really boggles my mind that thousands of negative posts about Everleaf and Bodog have been made in only a few days from these networks' most profitable players and they're not totally panicking by now.

If I were in either of their shoes, I would put out a press release saying the April Fool's joke was launched early by mistake within half of day of seeing these kind of reactions.

I think many of you misunderstand online poker, the sites do not run the games so you can make money but so they can make money. They understand that if high volume grinders are given free range and can play for ½~2 BB/100 they will fish out the water and destroy the sites player base. This would be no problem if the grinders didn't leave the sites once they had fished out the waters; but as it is you would simply move on to another site and fish out that and continue doing this until there were no sites left to grind at or the competition became to hard.

If the limit is €750/week I really can't see a problem with this site. That would be about 3k/month (39k/year) which is more then you would need to be content. You would simply run up this in a few days, not play for the rest of the week (hopefully doing something else then poker these days) and then return next week to do the same.

I've told you this before, you are destroying your own source of income with the insane grinding and you will eventually destroy the poker economy if you are given total freedom to go about whatever you want to do. The sites simply protect themselves and you from your destructive behavior.

^ not sure if serious, but there are always sheep like yourself who see things like this as a good idea, so I'd lay odds you are serious and think you are really smart as well for being able to 'see the big picture'

Luckily the majority of players on 2+2 aren't life-fish and swallow what ever crap they are thrown.

Also I like your obnoxious line about how much is 'enough' for someone to be content with and how they should spend their week.

simply lol.

At least you live up to your forum name.

.. but still you find that most of the 2+2 player complain about a though competition, nits, etc. If they had it they would not care about issues like this and simply play on one more site to get money. The sites need to protect themselves to stay in business and if what they do don't suit you: find another site to play at!

This doesn't affect me in the slightest at the moment, I'm not from the US and play on many different sites of which stars is one of them.

The problem is a lot of the players complaining are from the US and are seeing the list of possible sites they can play on shrink because all the smaller sites especially US facing sites, are taking advantage of desperate US players and pulling similar sort of BS.

I'm pretty sure the majority of US players would dump half of these smaller sites in a blink of an eyelid if they were able to play on PokerStars again, irrespective of how many 'nits' there are.

For me I personally would like to see these bull**** measure by these sites fail because if something like this became widespread it could be detrimental for the game. I would like to see a few sites become large and compete with pokerstars as competition is good for players. Right now we are seeing smaller sites give up competing with pokerstars and instead trying to kick winners out and make poker a -EV casino game. Once pokerstars becomes the only site worth playing on, lack of competition and viable alternatives means they would be free to do whatever they wish, which, as much as i like pokerstars, as you said they are out to make money for themselves not the players and i'm sure they would use their monopoly to reap profits at the expense of players.