More often then not, (in HE) the delays are caused by TV. Tv like WPT, espn-WSOP, etc. Players tanking like every hand is a TV table and they are going to get their time!

My best, about 12 yrs ago, was 27 hands in 30 mins. HOWEVER, it was a tournament, and all the players at the table were 20-40 LHE (limit tournament) cash players with lots of experience. While I did my best to give them as many hands as possible per level, out of respect for lousy structure, they were the ones to make the difference.

In just an ok moving NLHE game this week I did 19 hands (30min). It wasn't a fast table, but it didnt have 6 "tankers" or even one constant "tanker" either.

That being said Land 'O Lakes, I am 100% sure, that at times, in some of the mix games you play in, the dealers will drop it into granny gear. Simply because for the most part, your game is full of stiffs. Don't believe me? Toss a redbird 5 or 10 mins into the down when the dealer is going slow and hasn't seen a $1. See if speed goes up even into 2nd gear.

I expect 17-18 hands per down as an average from my dealers and they all get it without problem and we deal almost all NLHE. You can expect 20+ hands per down in a LHE game easily.

Shuffle machines had 0 positive effect on our HPH. I think the only reason we got them was to add another thing to gripe about. 20+ a down isn't unreasonable in LHE but will definitely outpace the shuffle machine. I've seen (dumb) rooms that make every hand go through the shuffler, though, which would make it impossible.

Use the newer shuffle machines and they will keep up just fine.

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20+ in limit holdem is easy. There are times the dealer will deal a hand faster than the shuffler shuffles and will have to manually shuffle. Dealers in Vegas are much slower than dealers in atlantic city.

Ahaha, while it is true that some players tip sparingly in split games, the good dealers in my games eat well. For some reason people think I'm putting hands per down on the dealers. 90% of the reason for the number of hands per down is due to the players, of course.

Thank you. That is very efficient. Your games must be rock gardens, though, or pushy dealers, imo.


Really, zero? I would think maybe a few additional hands a down. Maybe not worth the fee to lease them, but they eliminate holdouts, so I like them.

I only mentioned it cause I might need a free "get out of jail" card down the road regarding other dealer/tipping issues.

Are you using Bravo to calculate hands-per-hour based on how often rake is dropped? You must have some amazingly fast dealers if 34-36 hph is the average. I think the top dealers at our place hit's 33-34 hph but we're expected to be around 30.

Someone in the thread suggested the newer machines are faster (and possibly more reliable?). Our room tried them in 2009-2010 if memory serves. They were money losers because of the downtime and damage to cards (which also caused downtime). Perhaps the technology has advanced enough that they'd be a benefit now - but I don't see them being added to the budget in the near future.

My experience as a player is limited to only a few rooms with machines, but I don't know how new they are. The pace seemed to be the same/similar as hand shuffled. If you guys really think they generate more rake I'll push for another trial. Always happy to get more hands out!

if the dealers doing a good job and you feel like tipping, tip... simple as that.

30 is pretty slow IMO. If a dealer is consistently only getting 15 per down we start looking into why. We also only count the full games since short handed plays faster.

No, we don't use bravo for HPH. We do audits regularly and hand count by watching video.

Our games are not rock gardens, but the dealers definitely keep the players moving if necessary. I've played in games where the dealers do nothing to push the games and those games are terrible to play in. The speed of the players along with the dealers ability to keep the players attention on the game is what decides how fast the game is. The last time I was in vegas I remember playing late one night and the players were mostly drunk and not paying attention and I'd be shocked if the dealers were getting 10 hands out in a down. I had to bail before I lost it. Told the floor guy on my way out that his dealers really need to learn to push the pace. Awful.

Dunno, but inattentive tipsy players sounds like a good game, and if it was NL, then 10 hands a down is a fine trade off. In any case, I don't think it would be rude to suggest to the dealer to try and move the game along better and if acknowledgment is positive, then toss the dealer $5 and thank him or her.

Sometimes, no matter how hard you try, Getting the game moving just doesn't work. Mostly on graveyard when there's more drunks.

As well, sometimes, you may notice the dealer try numerous times. And then get the smart arsed hate from a player having his own fun. I've even said things along the lines of "it's out of respect for the other players", and recieved plenty of rude ass mf'ers hate. Put's me on tilt a bit. Especially when there's 2-5 other players that DO want the game to speed up and do not speak out and back me up NOR even offer any respect or thanks for trying. And by "thanks for trying" I don't mean a toke. Hell just a nod or shrug of thanks anyways works.

At those times, I absolutely have no problem putting it into the absolute lowest gear I can find. I'll let you guys tilt off and not say a word.

30 HPH in our place means 30 raked hands. Hands where blinds are chopped, a preflop raise wins the blinds/limps don't count as hands dealt. And -since most of our games are 1/2 NL - hands where 3-4 players all limp for $2 and check it down to the river aren't counted as hands dealt either since no rake drops. Also, whether a game is full or short has no bearing either. The only thing that counts is rake being dropped on a hand.

I personally don't like the criteria that is used at my place, there are too many variables that affect your rating that are beyond your control.

Of course. To be clear, I meant if you ask the dealer to try and move it along better and are met with something like, "Sure, I'll do what I can" over a, "I'm doing the best I can already" then toss a toke for the former response, even if the dealer has a nearly impossible tow ahead. I think it would make some difference.

Well, if guys are nitty enough to want the game to speed up rather than letting hammered players spew off and widening their ranges to capitalize, then yeah, they shouldn't let you shoulder the brunt of hate from the guys trying to "have fun." I disagree that dropping it into 1st gear is a good response, but I can't really fault you for taking a passive/aggressive, "If you guys don't give a ****, then I don't give a ****" line, particularly after being berated by a drunk and none of those players calls him out.

I think non-dealers don't understand that going from "I'm doing a really good job (first gear)" to "This is as fast as I can go (top gear)" takes like double the fuel for really not much of a gain in speed in relation to the effort being applied.

So you told the floor guy that his dealers needed to some how make a table full of drunk people on vacation pay attention and play poker.

Look man i hate slow games and might have left and found a more serious game myself but i just cant see putting that on the dealers. Talk about herding cats.

40 hours a week pushing 5 and 6 ballers. Its a ....... marathon. Just find a nice pace and don't kill yourself.

To be clear Land O' Lakes, I'll also get a read on the drunks and the rest of the table rapidly upon starting my down. If they are also spewing I'm going to make every effort to make them my buddy before trying to push them along. This is for the benefit of the other players pocketbook.

I know where the spots are in a game within 5 hands usually. And Obviously I'll know our regs.

Pushing pace is always a touchy subject ... See another post from me today in a "I want to see your hand" post.

If you have drunks or whales at the table I can never really understand the desire for a reg to 'poke the bear'. Sure you want to read the table dynamic as a dealer and adjust your attention to specific players. But for a reg to ask for the dealer to step in and possibly risk having that player 'step out' is something that I try to avoid. Certainly if you are card dead or got coolered you want to push the pace to try and get the chips back before they decide to leave but I try to not make it a focal point.

I was in a late PLO game and a (drunk) guy sat down and told us that he drove 2 hours just to try out this casino. He 'forgot' to buy in at the cage and pulled out what looked like $15K or so in bills. He ended up being very slow on all decisions for a couple of orbits and won a few hands, but it was pretty obvious that variance would catch up to him. Three regs got upset at the pace and racked up .. REALLY!! A guy shows you $15K to blow at 'your' place and you treat him like this? Luckily he agreed to play shorthanded for an hour and we got some chips off him and he walked away mumbling about not coming back since they can't keep a game going. Now I was from out of town so I didn't care, but really ... GL

proving once again lots of regs have zero common sense.

if a drunk or a spewtard takes a little longer than he should who cares.

what's infuriating is nits who when they finally play a hand want to act like they're on espn for every decision.

That's is outrageous and ridiculous

Total live casino noob here, I play tournaments at the local pubs and do well, and am going tomorrow night to play a $100 buyin tournament at the local casino.

If I go out early in the tournament I'm thinking of bringing another $200 to sit down at the 1/2 cash game.

I'm fine with the playing (I hope) but I am a little nervous about the tipping aspect.

So far I look at it like going out to eat, I'm planning to tip ~10% of my winning pots... Sound about right? Win $30, tip $3, win $10 preflop, flip $1, etc... Maybe to a max of $5 ?

Thoughts?

toss a buck on most small pots, $2 on pots with a bit more in them. how you define "most" and "a bit more" is completely up to you.

This is absurd lol.

After rake you'll literally never beat the game.

But if you're not there to make money and just want to have some fun, then by all means do what you wanna do, the dealers will love you for it.