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Originally Posted by Blue Pig
They play enough limit in CA; I don't think you can rule out CA since the dealers do go from table to table.
While it might help if the casino this person worked for was made aware of his particular attitude, there's not much point in trying to "find the guy". He's angry, it may be in a small casino where the locals don't tip at all, he feels that "bribing him to deal better" is acceptable, maybe everyone at that casino thinks that. Maybe it wouldn't make a difference if his bosses knew. Who cares? If you find someone like this, make a big show of "not tipping" them and explain to them "why" you're not tipping them.
At what point did I say I was angry? Seems to me the anger is stemming from people who don't like hearing that we do get annoyed by people too cheap to tip. I make an above average living at a job where I sit on my butt, be a part of a game that I like playing, socialize with a very diverse group of people. The heaviest thing I have to lift is a deck of cards. I break a sweat only when the a/c isn't on high enough. I do typically wonder what's wrong with someone who thinks they can afford to play poker, but that extra dollar for the deal is just too much. But to say I'm angry? That's just stupid.
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There's so much "tip me" mentality in CA (not just the dealers) that it was an influence in why I left the scene there, that and the absurd rake and... just mass corruption, overall. "Some" dealers flashing my cards to their buddies even when I overtip in hopes they will stop it (did I really think they would?); the floor not caring because they get "tipped" not to care. I'm not going to list it all. Go to Commerce and play there regularly (not just tournament time, when they're all on "good behavior") and tell me that nothing sleazy is going on. I'm not saying every table, I'm not, but enough to make you sick. Find out yourself. And this is what "tipping" allows to happen. I moved to Atlantic City. It's much, much better, since floorpeople can't be tipped, yet; and the dealers don't want to risk going to jail because there are people watching them who also oversee the huge table games they have there, so cheating (like flashing cards) is a pretty big no-no there (though AC itself is a dump the casinos care little about).
You know, I won about $425 bucks in some promotion in a cardroom in CA and everyone, from the floor to the people running the boards to some dealers I knew for some time, is giving me that "but why aren't you tipping me?" look (even days later after they find out). The sad faces. Oh, please, I don't live to feed you. I mean, mother of pearl! I win a small promotion (yay) and they want me to give 3/4 of it away in tips and q/q is talking about not liking communism? You know what? I don't like it either when I have to share my money with you as you make "a great effort and show" of shoving 10 one dollar chips to me in several "sweeping" movements to imply, "Hey, what a huge pot I'm pushing you; how about a tip? No man, I'm not going to tip you 10% everytime I win. How can "I" win other than oatmeal money if I do that?
I also love when a dealer pushes you a small pot, and witholds a few chips that he throws you a few seconds later. Hey, thank you for not stealing those chips; here's a tip, right? That's the idea, right? Man, I do not need that sort of BS from a dealer during the game.
Now, can you imagine the corruption you enable when you allow floor people to be tipped? CA is a great example. An ambitious prosecutor could make a name for himself there, and it would be good to shake up the industry over there.
Tipping a person that gives you "one on one service", a cabbie, a waiter/waitress, heck, a doctor, "that" I can see and understand. But allowing tipping where there is competition for tips leads to the types of attitudes and general WTFness that we all see. Dealers come into a game all friendly (which is okay) but then they overdo it to the degree (by blabbing, or selling themselves, to the table for 15 minutes straight) that everyone in the game is now uncomfortable and knows they are "expected to tip". Do you know how that can tighten up what was a really good game. That really messes up some good games. Thank you!
There's a reason for the saying "Shut up and deal". Not that it's meant in a bad way, I never say that anyway, just that you should realize how you are negatively impacting the game by becoming the star of the show while begging for tips. People come to play poker and they get "immersed" in it. I don't need you taking them out of that frame of mind by constantly annoying them with reminders to tip you.
Here's a tip for all casinos. Pay your dealers a good wage (40-60k a year), give them good benefits and health insurance, and outlaw tipping because it's ruining your cardroom (and that impacts your table games as well--if you don't know how, then you shouldn't be running a casino--I mean, I left a state for it, and because of the ramifications--corruption--so figure it out).
I'm sure they miss you.
I'd love to make a 60k a year, guaranteed. That way, all I have to do is the absolute minimum required. I can drop it down to 22-27 hands an hour (typically the lowest a cardroom will let someone go). I won't have to remember the regulars' first names. I don't have to provide one ounce of customer service above what the casino requires. The incentive to just do a good job for the sake of doing a good job isn't that enticing. If it was, I would've picked another line of work.
See how this could end up a problem? You have dealers who do that now, with no guarantee, other than their minimum wage. You know the ones you have to wake up and tell them, "we've all acted" because he/she is staring off into space. We work to get faster and more efficient at running a game so that we can potentially earn more money. I'd rather provide 40 chances an hour to get tipped than 20, obviously.
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Tipping creates more problems than it solves. It leads to a "gimme society", at least in the casinos, and the look in some dealers' eyes is nauseating me and disturbing the other players. I mean, they don't want a dollar tip; they're trying to influence you and other players to give more, much more; hey, just shove them your stack. And some players, in the long run, do just that. And I don't need that added BS in my game.
Of course we're going to try to get as much of a tip as possible. If it upsets you to see other players tip, go play in a home game where the deal is passed around. But, if you do happen to play at my table at some point in life, please, by all means, speak up when someone throws me a red bird on a $30 pot. Tell them you don't want to see their money go to the person who's working. Tell them leave it on the table so you can take it. Normally, when someone does that, it garners sympathy towards me (most normal people don't like seeing one person try to hinder another person making a living) and I end up with an exceptional down. It's win win. You'd look stupid and I'd make more money.
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Casinos take whatever rake they think they can get away with - whatever the market will bear or whatever they're legally able to take. If you think the current rake taken is somehow only allowing the casino to break even on floor space, I've got a bridge to sell you.
If tipping poker dealers were outlawed (for whatever reason), the house would STILL take as much rake as they could per hand -- just like they do now.
Right. And they'd have to find alot of extra money to pay us. They're not going to cut someone else's salary to raise our income. Where do you think that money would come from..
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Sorry must be contagious or something. like how you said bringing this up to your superiors would be the joke of the day and get lols all around. Still, you will not tell us because we would be "stalking" you by trying to have your superiors read it..
No I said trying to find out where I work would be stalking. I'm not having some creepy weirdo trying to track me down.
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When anything slightly controversial pops up they get the pit boss every time
Uh, that's because we have to, kid.