For waitresses it might be difficult, but for dealers a no tip pay scale is easy. Just pay them minimum wage with set bonuses for hitting a certain number of hands per hour hour with deductions from that bonus for mistakes like misdeals, premature burn and turn, etc. Can also have comment cards available for customers to comment on their experience and give additional bonuses to dealers that get higher ratings. That way they are incentivized to be good dealers and no tips are necessary.

[QUOTE=wilson1560;45236135]For waitresses it might be difficult, but for dealers a no tip pay scale is easy. QUOTE]

Who would that system be "easy" for? No possible easy way to run such a system.

I don't think it would be difficult for waitstaff either. More people complain about their food service than subpar dealers. Restaurant cooks do not receive customer tips, but they certainly have incentive to not bring out ****ty food.

No possible easy way to run such a system for dealers? Why not elaborate instead of us taking your word for it?

Bigworm, this is really insanely simple to do, what do you think the problem would be? Just have the dealer push a button on the table or click a counter at the start of every hand. Floor manager can make a notation every time he is called over due to a dealer error which I am pretty sure they probably already do anyway. For sophisticated systems, hands per hour can probably just be auto tracked by camera like they do for betting patterns in blackjack.

Elaborating....keep in mind my comment was no EASY way to run such a system.

Maybe the auto shuffler could keep track of hands dealt. There would need to be some new tracking integration to keep track of dealer changes. Also every live player has experienced shuffler's breaking. Seems like a mess when tied to someone's compensation.

Also this system must have some sort of higher rake. What system are you going to use for short handed games? You are dealing more hands, but players are use to getting reduced rake.

Deductions for mistakes and misdeals. How is this ever going to be tracked? They would need to hire twice as many floor people to judge what is dealer error. Would also slow the game down while being ruled on, instead of just re-dealing the hand.

The mistakes also put the dealer against the house, and on opposite sides of the floor. That just seems like a mess to me.

Comment cards for a bonus? So if you are a dealer players you are friends with can get you a raise by writing something nice? Can you get someone that dealt you a 1 out cooler fired too? Who tracks all these comments?

The system is possible, but hardly seems EASY in my opinion. Giving $1 per pot you win seems easier. Feel free to not tip if you feel underserved on your winning hand, or feel free to tip extra. No tracking. No additional duties for the staff to make sure comp system is fair.

Can be done, but hardly easy when compared to current system.

Easy?: New tracking system via camera? Just look at the comp system for player points at casinos. They are constantly going down or losing track of time. Just seems like something that can only adversely affect players via time spent correcting or tracking. I don't see adding all these elements benefiting the player in anyway. Keep in mind higher rake would now be automatic, with no option of not paying if you feel like you had bad service.

I'm aware you used the word easy, which is why I used the word easy.

Yes, auto shufflers can keep track of how many decks it shuffled in a down. Dealer changes are already tracked in many rooms by the dealer swiping his card at the start of his or her down.

The stuff about things breaking etc. being tied to someone's compensation is making it seem like every single down is tied to someone's weekly paycheck. Performance reviews are just that. Overall performance. Little things like a jackpot taking 10 minutes will be negligible with a year's worth of cumulative downs being reviewed for a raise.

Well, all games should be time charge, but yes, the rake would be higher than it is now overall, and the rake would be higher for short games than it is now for short games.

Deductions for mistakes and misdeals? Again, management does not need to micro-manage every thing a dealer does. The game would proceed as it does now; if the floor needs to be called, the floor is called. If the dealer is able to fix the issue without a floor being called, per house rules, then the dealer fixes the issue.

Who tracks comment cards at the hospital after your stay? No one is getting fired or a bonus for a single card, but there doesn't need to be comment cards. As is, the floor already knows who the good and bad dealers are. They'll figure it out when people complain about a particular dealer over and over.

I see stellar dealers getting a buck just because most feel a buck is standard. These dealers are being affected by the industry standard, so their only way of making more money is to put more hands out. The guys who do that and hardly make mistakes deserve more than a buck a hand.

Yet another dealer refusing to say "Thank you" after I tip them.

Sorry if the $1 wasn't what you expected from me, but I didn't expect you to stare into space opposed to waking up and announcing who the bring in was.

Funny how some dealers think, that, if they get all pissy and refuse to acknowledge the $1 tip, that you're actually going to feel pressured into tipping more the next time they push you a pot. Just the opposite---next time you get $0.

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You got it backwards, buddy.

Wow, so you're basing the "Thank you's" on the actual size of the tip? $1 tip, no "Thank you". $2 tip and above, I get a "Thank you"?


I'm "full of myself" because I expect a "Thank you" after handing someone money? Since when has a "Thank you" become an obnoxious thought? It's common courtesy. I don't demand it, but I expect it; just like the dealer- they don't demand the tips but they do expect them.

I think any dealer who doesn't say "Thank you" is more likely to be full of themselves. And, for every time a dealer doesnt say "Thank you"? I'm actually saying "Thank you" to myself. Know why?

I posted earlier I dealt for just about 10 years and not once did I never say thank you. If I was out playing and saw a dealer not say thank you I always stiffed them. You make your living off that dollar, acknowledge it. Tilts me so hard people can't say ty

When someone gives me a gift I always say thank you.

It's as simple as that.

You said that you actually told a dealer "you have to say thank you or I'm not tipping you."

Yes. And that was my (for a lack of a better word) warning. And if they chose not to say thank you, that's ok, too. I won't get all huffy about it and I won't challenge or even demand the "thank you", but yes, I do expect it. Expecting and demanding are two different things all together.

Lol. So when you tell the dealer you won't tip unless they say thank you how does it work? Do you hold the tip out like a doggie bisquit waiting to release it when they say it?

And fines for players who take more than 10 seconds to act?

Edit: Because It's not completely on the dealer how many hands get dealt so they shouldn't be punished if it isn't their fault.

I don't think you're understanding the situation at all, but hopefully Rush will correct you.

This is an EXCELLENT idea.

Sure, but it all comes out in the wash; at the end of the year each dealer has their share of fast and slow games, just as the players do.

I understand just fine. I'm poking fun at someone that actually gives a warning that he won't tip. As I said before it is good etiquette and +ev for a dealer to say thank you. I just find it hilarious that someone would let it bother them if a dealer didn't thank him. Just don't tip. Why let it bug you.

Actually the fact that he issues no tip warnings probably explains why he isn't being thanked. He is probably a pain in the ass to deal with at table. One of those people that feel when he walks into a room the casino and dealers owe him something. My guess is in a home/private game his attitude wouldn't be so smug. Much like the tough guys at the table that say they want to fight when security is nearby.

Refusing to tip unless you get a "thank you" is not merely expecting a thank you, it's demanding it. Claiming otherwise might be correct according to strict definitions of the terminology, but it would definitely make one a grammar nit (as opposed to someone willing to engage in actual conversation) to draw that distinction.

Who cares? The point is if he doesn't get a "thank you," he's not tipping again. That's the only information that matters to the person who asked about what others do when dealers don't say "thank you."

It doesn't bother me to the point where I'm going to let it ruin my day, and as I said before, it's just more money in my pocket when they don't acknowledge the tip. But that doesn't change the fact that they SHOULD be saying "Thank you" to all their paying customers. Casino management would be floored if they knew that their employees weren't saying "Thank you" after every tip. Yes, EVERY tip.

Your second paragraph is, again, backwards. You said that the reason why I'm not being thanked is because I "hand out the no tip warnings?" Why don't you think about what you just said and see if maybe, just maybe, you're brain isn't working in reverse.

I've only told a dealer 1 time that "If he doesn't say thank you, I'm not going to tip him anymore". And I chose to say that because he was an horrendous dealer to begin with, and I was pretty much saying: "Hey bud, if you wanna have one thing going for you, you might wanna try to at least be personable." That's all it was. But hey, like I said, if you don't wanna be professional and courteous to your customers? Ok, I can live with that but it's your loss.

When a good dealer forgets to say thank you(which is very rare) I'll usually just chalk it up to them having a bad day or too many things going on in their head at the moment...whatever. But if I notice it becoming a trend, then I'll either say "You're welcome"(just to hint to them that they've been slacking in this area) or I just won't tip them the next time and that usually reminds them that next time, they better give their customers a "Thank you." Feeling this way does not make me a bully or someone that dealers hate to deal to. For the most part, dealers love me! And I know that because I'm respectful, I go out of my way to defend most dealers, and I'm also very friendly with a lot of them on and off the felt.

The bottom line really comes down to: If you're going to do a job, whatever the job may be, do it to the fullest.

You're right, however I was not addressing the person who asked what others do, I was addressing the person who insists he "expects but does not demand".

Hey, at least he gives the dealer a chance to get more dollars, rather than just ceasing from tipping, possibly leaving the dealer not knowing why. Now the dealer has a choice to make, and there's dignity in either option, IMO. That's more than someone deserves when they don't thank you for handing them free money.

Heck, I thank dealers for tossing my change back and swiping my card in. Was this guy raised in a barn?

This is one of those rare times in this thread when I'll take a hard line stance against the dealer in question.

Saying "thank you" is not negotiable here and if the dealer consistently neglects this obligation then he should be written up, reprimanded, suspended and/or fired. The OP is doing the dealer a great service by voicing his request.

My own tipping is above average to excessive, but if I witness a dealer making a habit of silently taking tips without acknowledging the player who voluntarily gave them, that dealer won't get a nickel from me. Furthermore I have mentioned this to floor supervisors whom I know, as I think they'd want their room to run better.

If a dealer forgets to say their thanks once in a while it's not a big deal to me. I've probably forgotten myself when I've been dealing, but a pattern of this is completely unacceptable.