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Old 05-02-2019, 06:51 PM   #1
dellerrrr
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Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

This happened last night at my local casino card room.

Player A is a reg who plays a large amount.
Player B is this new guy who has been showing up within the past couple months and still really does not have that much exp. based on my observations.
Player C I have seen occasionally.

Player B raises and Player A 3bets him, Player B calls. Player B check calls every street and then Player A jams for roughly pot on river.

Board reads A42K2

Player B starts talking out loud saying he can't be good cause "his kicker is not good"

Player C then makes a comment about the board paired and a King on the board. He did not say it loudly or anything but audible enough for Player A to hear then re look at the board again.

Of course he now ends up calling and Player A is bluffing. Player A immediately starts yelling at Player C and saying the extra info influenced the decision. Floor is called over and bring Player C aside for like 10 minutes. He then sits back down and continues playing so I assume he got a warning or just a stern talking to. Player A said he should not be allowed back and all this. Is a warning standard here, and then repeat offenders kicked out?
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Old 05-02-2019, 07:10 PM   #2
madlex
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

What exactly should the floor do about it? Crucify the guy after beheading him, Saudi-Arabia style?

Player C is obviously not supposed to do that and based on your description, it looks like the floor made sure that message was heard loud and clear. If everyone was banned from the poker room after their first transgression, we would soon run out of players. I think the floor handled the situation well.

On a side note, after talking to player C, the floor should have a chat with player A about yelling at the table.
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Old 05-02-2019, 08:03 PM   #3
dinesh
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

Yes, warning first, then escalating penalties if it continues.
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Old 05-02-2019, 10:04 PM   #4
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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What exactly should the floor do about it? Crucify the guy after beheading him, Saudi-Arabia style?

Player C is obviously not supposed to do that and based on your description, it looks like the floor made sure that message was heard loud and clear. If everyone was banned from the poker room after their first transgression, we would soon run out of players. I think the floor handled the situation well.

On a side note, after talking to player C, the floor should have a chat with player A about yelling at the table.
It's amazing you think what player A did was worse

Player c is an idiot who was talking about the hand abd board during the hand

Player A was rightly pissed bc player C's stupidity and big mouth may have cost him money
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Old 05-02-2019, 10:54 PM   #5
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

This was handled excellently.
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Old 05-03-2019, 03:49 AM   #6
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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It's amazing you think what player A did was worse

Player c is an idiot who was talking about the hand abd board during the hand

Player A was rightly pissed bc player C's stupidity and big mouth may have cost him money

Nobody said A did something worse. Borg said, quite rightly, that A should be spoken to about his reaction.
Without new players the game will die. If new players are berated for their mistakes they are unlikely to become regulars.
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Old 05-03-2019, 08:00 AM   #7
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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It's amazing you think what player A did was worse
Are we to believe that this is your honest interpretation of what he wrote? You're not selling it.
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Old 05-03-2019, 10:55 AM   #8
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

Re read this .. OP states that it was 'loud enough for Player A to hear it', but did Player B hear it as well? If so, then Player B could've used the information to figure out that his kicker was on the Board ... A very typical mistake for a newer Player.

Obv Player C shouldn't be saying anything during the hand ... and then this leads to Player A taking issue, thinking that Player B was influenced by the comments. Player A has a right to be upset and ask the Floor to come in. I'm not sure what Player A is doing wrong in this spot, but I've scanned this pretty quickly. GL
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Old 05-03-2019, 11:15 AM   #9
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

Yeah to clarify Player B afterwards half admitted he did not see that his A6 played the kicker on board. I could be wrong but I think he would have folded if he did not realize all aces chop
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Old 05-03-2019, 11:19 AM   #10
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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Re read this .. OP states that it was 'loud enough for Player A to hear it', but did Player B hear it as well?
It shouldn’t matter at all if player B or the janitor heard it. Player C said it out loud, that’s not OK. The floor should handle it the same way no matter if player B has perfect hearing or is deaf on his left ear.

It also shouldn’t matter if it influenced B’s decision or not. C violated the rules and the floor did address him for doing that.
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I'm not sure what Player A is doing wrong in this spot
What about that one?
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Player A immediately starts yelling at Player C
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Old 05-03-2019, 11:27 AM   #11
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

What is the threshhold for ruling a comment is influencing and therefore out of bounds. Player C could argue that he was simply stating publically available information.

I had a situation once where three friends who had come together sat at the 1-2 table I was playing at. I end up bluffing three streets at one of them, getting all in with around a pot sized bet on the river. He tanks for a couple of minutes while his two friends stare at him(normally, when someone is tanking a big decision, and I am not in the hand, I act like that player doesn't exist). Finally one says 'We are ready to go if you bust', and the other one says something like 'You have him covered'. He eventually calls. I calmly tell them that their comments were inappropriate and likely influenced action, but they didn't see it that way. I didn't get the floor involved.

Obviously, the behavior by player C is out of bounds, but how overt does a comment have to be before it is considered worthy of a warning?
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Old 05-03-2019, 11:41 AM   #12
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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Re read this .. OP states that it was 'loud enough for Player A to hear it', but did Player B hear it as well?
If he said it and one person heard it, then I will assume that everyone heard it. I don't care how loud anyone tries to tell me it was said. Sounds like the floor handled this very well. Warning followed by worse if it happens again is standard.
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Old 05-03-2019, 11:44 AM   #13
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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Player C could argue that he was simply stating publically available information.
So is saying that if you have a heart you have a flush on a 4-heart board. That argument would be very poor.
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Old 05-03-2019, 12:17 PM   #14
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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... but I've scanned this pretty quickly. GL
No, you can't yell or even politely berate your fellow players.

Last night I played a PLO hand KxKy2x5y and flopped 257, so I get it in with a short stack and get berated by a Player who folded AAxx on the Flop do my 'pot'. He never saw my KK cards. Less than two orbits later he shows down KK35 prouder than a peacock ... GL
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Old 05-03-2019, 02:23 PM   #15
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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Originally Posted by borg23 View Post
It's amazing you think what player A did was worse

Player c is an idiot who was talking about the hand abd board during the hand

Player A was rightly pissed bc player C's stupidity and big mouth may have cost him money
what player C did may or may not have cost player A this pot

what player A did most likely cost himself and every other player in the room far more money because player C is unlikely to return

I hope player A also got a warning
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Old 05-03-2019, 04:39 PM   #16
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

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Originally Posted by answer20 View Post
No, you can't yell or even politely berate your fellow players.

Last night I played a PLO hand KxKy2x5y and flopped 257, so I get it in with a short stack and get berated by a Player who folded AAxx on the Flop do my 'pot'. He never saw my KK cards. Less than two orbits later he shows down KK35 prouder than a peacock ... GL
you might as well have just told us the weather in china. it's just as relevant to the original post in this thread as what you just posted.
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Old 05-03-2019, 07:06 PM   #17
dellerrrr
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

Not sure if Player A got an official warning but he did talk briefly with some floor people after the game broke.

I also felt bad for Player B cause it seemed he was a bit uncomfortable after that whole sequence being a new player and everything
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Old 05-04-2019, 01:44 AM   #18
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

Warning for player C for first offence.

Player A should be told not to yell at people.
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Old 05-04-2019, 03:40 AM   #19
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Re: Player not in hand gives information to player in hand

Not really much floor can do beyond what it did.. its amazing how many players routinely turn and say things like i folded the nuts while there is action on the river

If its really egregious floor can ask someone to pick up for the day
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