Local $200 ($100 bounty) satellite into a $500 multi-day tournament. 10 players will get a $500 seat, one player will get the leftover $$ (about $350). We have already agreed to make #11 full by donating $15 each. We're 6 handed at two tables, and hand for hand, when this occurs.

I don't remember the exact order of business, but on the flop, two players are all-in with a 3rd player covering. I think it went AI, re-jam for barely any more, call by covering player, but I'm not sure that's correct, or important. It may have gone All In by shorty, call by 2nd player, re-jam (1 BB or less) by 3rd player, call by #2.

3rd player scoops both the main pot and the very small side pot. 2 players are eliminated, both from our table.

The question then becomes "who gets nothing, and who gets 11th place?".
The answer may surprise you, hence the posting.



I assume 'local rules' may apply, so this may be in fact the correct decision by the floor.

Thoughts?

My thoughts are this is a horrible ruling. Because its at the same table the shortest stack should finish out of the money and the player with more chips who also got knocked out finishes in 11th place. This would be the assumed rule and completely alters how people would play the hand if it wasn't the rule.

If the house has this as their standard then that is the way it is. This happens really infrequently so it may be they don't have a house rule and they just made this up on the spot.

It would be different if the players both got eliminated from different tables at the same time where they would share 11th place regardless of their stack size. This could be why the house ruled this way thinking it applies even at the same table...

Not sure what happens in the extreme case where during hand for hand one person gets eliminated from one table and two people get eliminated from a different table. I think all 3 share the prize because the stack sizes at different tables wouldn't count but I could be wrong here and shorty at the table with 2 could not cash...

As long as this is some kind of house rule that gets applied to any situation this comes up, I’m fine with it. Nonstandard for sure.

Agreed. It's definitely a non-standard way of handling the situation but if that's the house rule it's far away from the worst one I've heard of.

You could ask to see the written rules. If they don't have any and say they've always done it that way there's a good chance they actually do it the other way next time the situation comes up with a different TD.

Well .. technically .. the larger stack was eliminated first since they had to show their hand first .. right? .. LOL

I see no issue with the House deciding to split the prize. I'm not sure how the WSOP does it for the ME.


What you need to look at is that HFH was in effect .. so by default you could have 'ties' .. so I look at it differently. If this had happened outside HFH, then yes, the short stack is out of luck.

Show me a Poker Room that looks at the stack sizes of the Players who are eliminated during HFH to determine what place a Player gets .. I don't think there's any, but I could be very wrong. GL

WSOP looks at stacks if the players busted are on the same table, even in hand for hand.

https://www.wsop.com/2022/2023-WSOP-...ment-Rules.pdf

Dang, right there in black and white. I'm going to write an e-mail to the TD/poker room mgmt with this link. Thanks for posting! I'll post if they respond.

I got a response fairly quickly. I did quote the WSOP rule (126b) in my e-mail to Tia...

For what it's worth...

The WSOP ruleset is specific for them. I don't think any room uses it themselves.

Pokertda. com is where you'll find the TDA rules. Most rooms use that as a basis for their own rules, or just use tda with no changes.

Confirmed to me via Matt Savage on Twitter .. If the Players are at the same table then the stack sizes are considered but not so if at different tables. So WPT is on board with TDA also .. no surprise. GL

TDA (in the H4H section) does not specify this. Tia quoted the relevant section (only part I could find that mentions H4H), and it doesn't say anything about same table or different tables.

It doesn't matter if we're H4H or not in this case since it's a ruling where we have 2+ eliminations IN the same hand.

RP-8.A refers to the hand during which the initial H4H announcement is made. It's a special case. All regular all-in and payout rules apply.

TDA doesn’t have other rules re: payouts

We had played at least 2-3 hands at H4H when the last hand went down. Sorry if that wasn't clear in the OP.