He’s saying that the question of whether they have a responsibility is separate from whether they should stfu, which is what you were arguing originally.

Then to be clear on my opinion

I believe that those not seated at the table should not speak about what is going on at the table in any fashion that can influence the outcome of any hand in the game.

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No way! Railbirds should speak up, too. We all have a shared interest in keeping poker games fair, including games we're not playing in.

If you witness a robbery would you do nothing because it's none of your business?

An obligation? No.
Can they speak up? Yes.
Should they speak up? Yes.

I meant people on the rail.

They are not. They are pointing out a correctable error. This is not yelling foul. The diff is cards speak and winner is a observable fact not a judgement.

All hell would break loose if someone watching the game made any comment at all. I've maybe seen it once and I'm hazy on that. You've got to draw a line somewhere. What if surveillance saw a mistake, are they supposed to call a floor?

BUT, if you just HAVE to do it at least do it at the highest stakes game in the room. That ought to cause a full on riot.

If it's some guys buddy who's railing I think it's okay. If it's some stranger who's railing the game I don't think they have any business commenting on action.

That's even worse. If this became a thing you'd here 'clear the rail' a lot more often.

Yes if surveillance sees an error AND can correct it in time before next hand starts they should also do so.

If some guy in India is streaming Live at the Bike and sees an error and he can and does catch it in time it is fine.

the PGA stopped listening to people reporting rules violation. I remember one tour player who was DQ'd for 'building a stance' by placing a towel down next to a water hazard to kneel on after an audience member called in.

Some will speak up some won't. I've been on the receiving and giving end of railbirds and players speaking up. Couple weeks ago the dealer called the low wrong in a 6/12 O8 game, saved me about $80. Later I caught a players winning full house about to be mucked.

It all balances out somehow.

Here's something mild that you can try and report back: Rail a game and simply say 'that card flashed.'

One of the reasons the PGA ended the practice was because only players who were subject to TV cameras came under increased scrutiny. Not analogous to this situation. Rail bird making sure the hands are read properly is fine, IMO.

Have any of you ppl ever seen someone observing the game say anything?

Card flashing is more like a fan calling for a foul. It is not a correctable factual event. Do I expect this to happen frequently? No. In fact I have not personally seen it happen. But if it does I am fine with it even if it cost me a lot.

Ofc it's a correctable event which is why a flashed card gets replaced. Go on and do it, come on, DO IT!

Not sure about the purposeful intellectual disconnect between talking about awarding the winning hand the pot because "cards speak at showdown"and pointing out minor technicalities that don't actually affect anything.

Correctable yes. Factual error. No. That is difference. We can factually confirm if rai l is right on who is winner. We can’t do so for a flash. If your can’t see that clear doc you are interested entionally choosing a fantasy.

I give in. You've convinced me! From now on everyone railing a game should speak up if they see something wrong. That ought to increase the number of people that do it from basically none to one or two and to those I say: 'Please report back!'

While standing behind a game waiting to push into the box I have corrected an error taking place, and would do so again 100% of the time.

Though I don't think that's exactly the situation OP was asking about. (railbirds)

We aren't talking about ppl whose job it is to say something.

Yes I think I said that.

If hands are tabled then yes, absolutely.

Let's broaden it ... Part of LC's point is that the rail doesn't have any 'skin' in the matter. What if they have a piece? What if they are in the same car? ... et

Per the rules, I believe, players are 'obligated' to speak up if they see errors before it's too late to correct. Railbirds have no such stipulation.

So whereas a player who potentially doesn't speak up if he figures the mistake is in his favor can create an issue, a Railbird that does or doesn't speak up is facing no recourse. (Not that a player at the table is facing much recourse to begin with, but it is in the rules.)

When faced with something that is 'part time' or choice of a 3rd party I would prefer to limit their options, but I don't see anything wrong with a 'fan' interjecting ... AFTER THE HAND IS TABLED. GL

Some tiny percent of poker players read this forum and therefor don't discuss poker ethics on here. Every now and then a player in the game will correct what would be a wrong at the table sometimes w/ a 'it's what we're supposed to do' explanation which is correct. Yet somehow NO ONE EVER says anything if they're railing the game. Why is that? Because even they know to keep their mouths shut. jfc.