Many professional poker players prefer being coy about their skill level. A mentor once told me that people will play differently against you if they know you're a pro.

Is that really true? It doesn't make sense to me. Why would someone play worse than their best on purpose, but then only choose to reduce their errors when they play against a pro? Is this really something that commonly happens?

I'm not sure about playing worse...but a good solid player, who is not a pro, will avoid playing pots with pros. Why battle with the best, if there are 3 or 4 fish at the table.

Most recreational players are at the poker table to have some fun. As soon as someone announces, "hey, I take this game very seriously," even the casual player is going to want to avoid looking "stupid" to the expert. You make money from people who don't worry about looking stupid.

As a rec player I am going to assume that most folks who announce their "pro" status at 1-2 or 1-3 stakes games really are not pros at all. Or they are very bad ones. So I don't think it makes a lot of difference to me personally. I guess I would assume less silly mistakes maybe. Now at higher stakes (which I don't do much of) this would likely be a more important factor to consider.

It isn't a matter of playing worse. It is a matter of the strategy you take against a player, and how you read them. For example, I lead out in position in a MTT with AK and the BB calls, and the board comes up J72r. The BB donks. If he is a pure beginner, I think he is likely betting for value because his thinking is very linear (I have good hand, I make bet), so I fold. If he is a player just graduating from the ranks of the pure beginner, but still not seasoned, I think he is betting for information, and likely has a lower pocket pair, a weak jack, or a 7, and I go ahead and raise him. If he is a pro, I have no idea if he is pot building with a set, putting out a blocking bet, or bluffing. Depending on the player, he could have a pretty polarized range, and I have to be very careful.

Once you recognize a pro (and as noted above, one of the key tells on who is a pro is that the pro usually does not say 'I am a pro'), you often have to shift from being the exploiter to avoid being exploited. It isn't about playing worst against them, it is about playing appropriately against them.

Extremely well put. Plus, any regs who read strat threads and have a modicum of self-awareness will know they're the MAWG (me), and have read all the advice of how to play against MAWGs. If you're in comfey clothes and headphones and have a big water bottle and a high tier card at 2/5 on your 10th hour, I'll exploit the heck out of you until you catch on. You become the predictable one until you adjust.

This is something I see offen and discussed often but usually dismissed. Its about what being a live pro is all about and what skills are needed. To use a cliche analogy if your a pro and play in a hoodie and glasses your making a huge mistake. Live poker is all about making people feel comfterble, not thinking or worrying about mistakes, and generally having a good time and making losing money the last thing on anyones mind. Show a bad call and laugh at yourself , when you make a hero call don't draw attention to what a great call it is, but play it off as loose fun play. I can go on and on but I don't think this sinks in for most

It happens in sports, where teams sometimes try harder against the top teams. Why don't these professional athletes try hard in every game?

Maybe it's an ego thing where they want to beat the best, so take more care. Maybe they crave the respect of the better player.

I don't always play my best on purpose. For example, when I am playing seven card stud against bad players, I don't make as much of an effort to remember folded upcards because it is not worth it. I am not going to increase my expectation that much. I can play longer if I don't tire myself out mentally.

Not a pro but I think it's best for me and everybody really if the atmosphere is light so I always say we are all professionals because we are playing for money. No amateur status.

Interesting thread for sure. I was in a tournament the other day and didn't realize 'who' was on my left. I made a few plays that I wouldn't have made otherwise and ended up busting them out in a cooler. I found out later during a cash session who he was and this riled up lots of thoughts.

1) As above, you may want to 'earn' some respect from a good player.
2) As above, you may end up paying more attention to hands you play with this Player.

3) In my case I wouldn't have exposed myself/stack to a Player who may more easily see what I'm doing (stealing, bluffing, range missed Flop for sure, opening/playing too much) and make better adjustments to my play.
4) Did the fact that he knew me but also didn't know that I didn't recognize him end up earning me more respect for what I was doing?

It also gives me pause that I perhaps give too much respect to a 'better' Player when they sit down and that I should really just go about my game. It's very possible that I give tournament players way too much respect when it comes to how they expose their stack during play, not just 'Pros'. GL

all of this.

with few exceptions most bad players don't like losing to pros. there is zero benefit to them knowing you are one, and no good comes from making them take the game more seriously.

i've been invited to some great home games by some terrible players bc they thought i wasn't good either. one even declined when a few other players asked about playing in their game bc "we don't want anyone who doesn't have a day job"

the bolded is great advice.

I'm not sure that I see many pro players at the 1-2 tables, but I see a lot of regs that chat about different rooms, long hours and grinding. They tend to be either really nitty or taggy and I play accordingly. It seems to be an easy way to profile quicker than usual. I don't know if they think nobody notices and adjusts, or they don't really care. Nits gonna nit, Lags gonna lag.


LOL. Yet to hear that declaration verbatim, but I'm 100% on board to people not wanting to look stupid. Agree that it's easier to look casual and not put anyone on alert.

I think there area at least a bunch of people that are regular enough, keep costs of living low and don't work a traditional full time job that think they are pros. Agreed that there are less "silly" mistakes, but that means they can be exploited as well.

im from canada so i just tell them im a NHL sports bettor. never mention "pro poker" status lmao i try to stay so far away from that.

it helps that i mostly play thur/fri/sat so i dont get too reggy and cant lie about it

I play high enough to occasionally have a few millionaires in the game and some of them very clearly enjoy busting a pro, especially if it is someone who is clearly playing above his bankroll.

Once you play high enough so that every player knows every other player in the player pool, there's no point pretending.

I think it's good for your action if you can preserve in your opponent's mind the possibility that they might be better than you are.

Im not a pro, but as a dude who has a spazzy seeming (but winning) playstyle, i have on several occasions heard afew of the (extremely rude) local pros discuss how I have gotten lucky and suck (not in so many words) are actively trying to get me moved off the must move into the main game (which is bad for me), and also i think they play extra pots with me trying to stack me.

I certainly think its a good thing for you for good players to think youre good, because good players tend to mutually avoid one another which helps both players isolate fish, and helps both players avoid high variance/low EV regwar situations against one another.

However actual pros saying they are pros at midstakes is funny. Like, its really obvious who is a pro to anyone paying attention, yall all look and act like overgrown 9th graders, so you arent changing anything with the good players, you are just scaring away the fish. 99% of the time its a dick measuring contest.

Any discussion of playing poker for a living is toxic to the games. Recreational players want to have a good time and be there with others that are there to have a good time. It makes me cringe anytime a player discusses being a pro at the table.

Probably better not to talk about it so it will be better for the game. If people ask me I'll tell them. I also remind them that poker pro is a self given title. Everyone at the table can be a poker pro if they so desire

I play 2/3 so if anyone is a pro there that's not really indicative of a good skill level. Also, someone who says they're a pro, that doesn't mean that they're any good at poker. Lots of deluded people at the table.

Now if you put in full time hours and win often, other players who are there a lot are going to assume you're living off your winnings. It's probably silly to pretend otherwise.

At the end of the day I don't think it matters a great deal. The more important thing to avoid is being some kind of dead-eyed hoodie wearer who refuses to talk to anyone, or one of those douchebags who sits there and dissects every hand with as much poker lingo as possible.

Reading this thread, it seems like there are actually two issues being discussed

1. Playing with pros-Usually, I enjoy this. They are very comfortable around the table, willing to talk about poker and strat but not too obnoxious about it. Some are, of course, nicer and more pleasant than others. They don't posture a lot or brag a lot. On the rare occasion I get to play with a well known player, they often have interesting stories or insight into the poker life. I like playing with the guys who I know make their living off of poker, who also have usually 500K+ in career tournament winnings, because it is a chance to expand my game.

2. Playing with guys who like to talk about being a pro-These guys are obnoxious. They are never as good as they think they are, will bore the table to tears with claims of all the tournaments they play and win (which never seems verifiable on Hendon), and will use a ton of poker terms (often wrong). These guys are usually midlevel players trying to break into the ranks of the good players, and want to look and act the role. These guys usually earn a pretty quick insertion of the ear buds, as I wait patiently for them to FPS themselves out of the tournament.

So, while playing tournaments with actual Pro's can be interesting and fun, playing at a table with wannabe pro's who talk about their pro status can be an absolute beating.

I don’t think recreational players care that much if you’re a pro and I think some might even enjoy playing against one. There is probably also some curiosity on their part about how a pro plays and how they would do against a pro.

It’s not that they play worse on purpose. They might just focus better and try harder against a pro. I think that’s more likely to happen if the pro looks like Mr. Serious and doesn’t want to talk to anyone.

TBH I've never heard anyone at the table discuss their "pro status". I do hear people mention to a neighbor or friend next to them that they play every day but I've never heard anyone announce to the table they're status is a pro poker player.

What is your definition of a "pro"? I know some "recreational" players who are better than a lot of "pros". Just keep trying to get better and better since most pros out there will be your bread and butter anyway (you will be facing them more than the recs if your a pro).

When I played 1/2, i had by far the highest win rate in my player pool and yet everyone thought I was harmless because I wasn't involved in many pots.

Everyone who has ever mentioned being a pro or talked strategy at that level was certifiably terrible. It never fails.

Played with a pro at 1/2 once. I think I was only person at table who knew he was a professional. He was very quiet and honestly it benefited him cause i don't think anyone knew. I think it can be a detriment to announce yourself. Also, if there is a pro/good reg I will avoid them or make adjustments.