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Old 06-06-2010, 01:12 AM   #1
gav800
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Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Does anyone think that people should start enforcing a code of etiquette to dealers who simply don't do their ****ing job?

It pisses me off heaps when at a table and the dealer joins in the conversation excessively (or becomes the centre of discussion) and will stop paying attention to who the action is on or whats happening because of the conversation.

Also when there is a novice player at the table.... should the dealer stop to explain to them the really minor/retarded intricacies that they are getting wrong? (Such as string betting, failing to verbal a raise etc..)

Should a dealer be embarrassed as **** to have to ask the players for rulings?

Dealer's slow rolling = puts me on tilt.
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Old 06-06-2010, 01:32 AM   #2
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Yeah I am guilty of talking to the dealer sometimes if there's a game on we are both interested in or something like that. But as soon as I see him/her getting too excited about the conversation to where they are missing action or otherwise impeding the game I try to act like I'm infatuated with the cocktail waitress or something. It's not often that this happens and they change every half hour or hour (seriously not sure, temporal distortion like a MF when I'm playing cards).
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Old 06-06-2010, 01:33 AM   #3
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

k
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Old 06-06-2010, 01:33 AM   #4
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

If it's a low limit table you should be happy if the dealer is explaining the basics to a player.
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Old 06-06-2010, 01:48 AM   #5
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

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Originally Posted by ReidDeCardes View Post
At any poker table you should be happy if the dealer is explaining the basics to a player.
FYP.

Unless the dealer is giving advice on playing hands, you should be happy that there are inexperienced players there and the +EV should be worth the time wasting.

As for chatting it up, meh, it does not bother me.

If you think the dealer is out of line, ask for a table change and mention something to the floor.
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Old 06-06-2010, 01:50 AM   #6
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

While I agree with much of what the OP is saying, I don't consider string betting "minor" and if the dealer doesn't call the string bet and explain to the player why he can't "Call AND raise", how will the player learn?

I'm also not sure what he means by a dealer "slowrolling". At least not the way I define slowrolling. Maybe he meant something else?

As for asking the players for rulings, if a dealer ever does this, the players should immediately call the floor.

Since the OP has had a bad experience with a dealer due to the things he described in his post, posting it here is not the answer. Yes, people here will agree with you but that does not solve the problem.

I would suggest that he bring it up to the floor person or shift supervisor. Be concise, be specific, don't call the dealer foul names, it won't help your position.

Something like "Dealer named XXX talked all during his down, didn't know a rule and lost track of where the action was twice."

If you approiach a floor person with a comment like that, it will be addressed properly if it is a well run card room. If it isn't well run, hopefully you have another choice of where to play.
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Old 06-06-2010, 02:12 AM   #7
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Half of the reg's that play at the local casino complain about this kinda BS every week.... the richer-half (fishes) complain about some things, but not all of them as they aren't really poker players, just retired old people looking for a fun relaxing time.

2-3 of us complain to the floor every week and the answer is pretty much "Look, they're under-trained and we're under resourced and don't care enough to improve it... If you wanna play, play, if you don't, don't" ... they're really stubborn about it.

They say that dealing poker is "Intimidating" to the dealers. It's a small Casino, all the roulette/blackjack tables are only $5-20 bets.. maybe occasional Asian playing $200/hand BJ..... so the $2/5 NL game is pretty much the high-rollers of the casino and the only place full of regulars who will speak up (rando's on $5 BJ don't really care much).


I'm about to write a letter and get >50% of the regular players to all sign it.... I think having designated poker dealers rather than dealers rotating with other games would be a good fix... the ones who enjoy the game are far better at it.
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Old 06-06-2010, 02:55 AM   #8
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Quote:
Originally Posted by gav800 View Post
dealer joins in the conversation excessively
Dealers needs to learn when to shut up and pay attention. (action hand, multi side pots)
Quote:
Originally Posted by gav800 View Post
Also when there is a novice player at the table.... should the dealer stop to explain
Some poker lessons (between hands) are ok but the dealer shouldn't over do it.
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Should a dealer be embarrassed as **** to have to ask the players for rulings?.
Better he ask than do it wrong.
I think you mean asking players about dealing procedures, not a ruling that the floor should give.
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Originally Posted by gav800 View Post
Dealer's slow rolling = puts me on tilt.
That's the worst.
Dealer peeks at the turn card and slowly turns it up so the players can finally see it... then the same with the river.
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Old 06-06-2010, 03:34 AM   #9
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Unless the dealer is explaining to someone that he shouldn't be limp calling 6bbs with 85o OOP I don't have a problem.

I think some dealers try to be entertaining and or informative in hope of getting better tips

If you don't want any interaction with the dealers stay home and play online.
A lot of people like talking to the dealers. I personally could care less as long as the dealer isn't misdealing
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Old 06-06-2010, 09:53 AM   #10
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

People talking to dealers if fine, even during play.

Dealer stopping dealing to listen to or explain a story = bad

Dealer giving players information about playing the game = I feel i'm being cheated.
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Old 06-06-2010, 10:07 AM   #11
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

The bottom line is that if dealers are substandard in any way, it's management's fault for allowing them to be that way. When the standard is nine miles below excellence, what do you expect? Unfortunately, crap is becoming the standard these days.
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Old 06-06-2010, 10:18 AM   #12
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

There's a really talkative female dealer at the room I play at. One time I was playing and she was shooting the **** as usual, not even paying attention to the action, talking to people in seats 1-3. Then she would reach over and grab seat 9's cards and muck them out of nowhere. Seat 9 would be like "wtf I didn't fold" and she would just kind of shrug, hardly even apologizing. She did that twice. Yes, Seat 9 is a moron for not protecting his hand, but still.. I've also seen her push pots to the wrong person. One time I was short stacked and I moved in for my last $17 and got like 3 callers and she built the side pot thinking I had $22. I didn't correct her of course. I still lost the pot, but I appreciate the free equity nonetheless.
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Old 06-06-2010, 10:46 AM   #13
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

One concern is that my getting pissed off at the dealer will give other players tells on what I'm doing... For example, if I'm drawing to a straight/flush and I hassle the dealer to get on with it. If I'd flopped a made hand, I wouldn't be so rushed/eager to see the card.
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Old 03-16-2019, 03:11 AM   #14
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Quote:
Originally Posted by steamraise View Post

That's the worst.
Dealer peeks at the turn card and slowly turns it up so the players can finally see it... then the same with the river.
You're not the only one. It drives me insane when dealers do this. I don't remember where I first heard the term and picked it up from, but i've always called it "sweating" IE the dealer's sweating the turn card. Whatever the actual terminology is, when a dealer peels the turn/river card and not only can see what the card is themselves, but takes enough time that they can probably figure out how that card changes the board before they even make the card visible to the players at the table; it really makes me want to reach over and grab the card out of their hand and put it on the table myself.
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Old 03-16-2019, 07:22 AM   #15
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

the worst is when they are watching the game
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Old 03-16-2019, 09:39 AM   #16
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

It’s March Madness, time for dealers to watch basketball and talk about it non-stop to anywhere from one to three players at the table.
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Old 03-16-2019, 10:38 AM   #17
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

There is absolutely nothing wrong with explaining rules of the game to a new player. Stopping a player from making a string bet and explaining what it means is part of a dealer's job.

No, he shouldn't be conversing too much with players if that affects the flow and accuracy of the game. Some dealers can walk and chew gum at the same time. Others can't. I've had to tell one of my dealers on several occasions to limit how much he talks to players about fantasy football. I tell him it's ok to respond if a player engages HIM, but not to join into conversations between 2 or more players on his own. Every player is different. Some want the dealer to shut up and deal, but there are others that are there for some entertainment value too. There's a considerable gray line when it comes to customer service when it comes to the poker room.

If you really think that this dealer can use some improvement, bring it up to the floor in a logical, calm, nice manner. If he made a mistake due to not paying attention, use specifics. As a floor, I welcome any way to help my dealers improve their skills. Sometimes hearing it from the players helps, but it's easier if the player is calm and rationale as opposed to raging.

OTOH, depending on the casino, some run a tighter ship than others. I'm very strict with what you call slow-rolling, or rabbit hunting, or making a demonstrative flair when putting the river out. I aim for professionalism as much as is possible, while at the same time being personable and delivering customer service. Obviously some are better than others at the balance.
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Old 03-16-2019, 02:30 PM   #18
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

You might be giving the dealer too much credit. Likely they would be at least 80% as bad as they are now if they weren't talking. The conversations are just the thing that is drawing attention to their suckiness.

Many players are there to be social and be entertained. The grinders are not providing this for them so they turn to the dealers. I'm pretty regularly criticized by casual players for not being entertaining and being too robotic. I don't do that stuff not because I think it's wrong, but because I suck at it. So I stick to cranking out as many clean hands as I can and fit in time now and then to try and let the regs know I'm glad they're there.
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Old 03-23-2019, 12:30 AM   #19
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Quote:
Originally Posted by madlex View Post
Itís March Madness, time for dealers to watch basketball and talk about it non-stop to anywhere from one to three players at the table.
Ugh... We have several NBA loving dealers at my local casino, and during the playoffs their hand count will get cut in half. Then if it's close at the end of a game you may as well shut the table down because they'll space out to the point that the players have to tell them when action is complete on every street. Just plain brutal.
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Old 03-23-2019, 08:13 AM   #20
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Speaking as a dealer of 10 years, you have to feel the table out whether a little chit chat is wanted or not.

At low limit games I tend to chat more. I’m not a sports guy, so incessantly talking about sports or “my picks” is not an issue for me. I also don’t watch the TVs ever.

I do say hello to the regs I like and have a rapport with, no matter the limits.

5/10 NL and up I really don’t talk much other than saying hello or making an occasional remark. Mixed games I don’t talk in, any Pot Limit game I won’t either as I take pride in being on point with the pot calculations. Maybe an occasional remark here and there.

Sometimes players will engage me and want me to tell stories from underground club days in New York so I’ll entertain them with one briefly to give them a topic of conversation which usually leads to them talking amongst themselves. But if I’m talking and I see a big pot developing I’ll just say “I’ll finish after the hand is over, one second.”

When I first started out, I was a silent dealer. When I asked the dealer who makes the most money what his secret was, he told me I needed to talk a little more and develop some type of relationship with the players. Not too long later I was then one of the dealers making the most money on my shift.

I see too many dealers who frankly just don’t give a damn about their skills in the box nor care about the integrity of the game. If I have a bad down, it will bother me. I take pride in being an “A” Dealer. It’s something I’ve worked on for a long time and continue to do so to keep my skills honed and sharp. I’m not the best there is and I do make mistakes but am always looking to correct it if I do. My roommate is probably the best dealer I’ve seen and I’ve learned a lot from him.

My first time dealing the big game at a room in Vegas I just got hired in (I work for multiple rooms), it was a rotation game of 100/200/400 NLHE and 200/400 PLO, which is a time rake game and includes a pre-tip of $25. I still got tipped in between hands and I made a funny joke to a well known pro, the whole table got a kick out of it and they each threw me another green bird for “the most entertaining thing that’s happened all night”. I wasn’t even trying to make a joke, I didn’t think it was funny, I was just trying to state a fact. Other than that I didn’t make conversation, just called the game.

There are too many dealers that only give it 50% or just don’t care about providing a good experience to the players. This is usually reflected in their tips and in turn it creates a cycle that goes something like “well I don’t make that much so why am I gonna go out of my way”.

Last edited by CupOfSalt; 03-23-2019 at 08:30 AM.
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Old 03-24-2019, 02:11 PM   #21
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

if you successfully dealt in underground New York games you're way ahead of the pack, I'm not surprised at all you're doing well
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Old 03-24-2019, 03:05 PM   #22
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

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if you successfully dealt in underground New York games you're way ahead of the pack, I'm not surprised at all you're doing well
I dealt all over New York in dozens of different clubs and private games --Manhattan, Queens, Long Island, The Hamptons, etc.

I basically grew up in poker, my grandmother was an underground player/dealer in her boyfriend's large club in Queens way before my Mother was even old enough to leave the house. My whole family plays poker.

I went to my first underground club when I was 16 and started to deal $75 buy in NL tournaments for that club (different location at that point) about 2 years later. I was playing and dealing and did so through college to get myself through without having to get a "normal" job.

Eventually, when I was in my mid-late 20's, I was working for a software company but was also dealing for several different games/clubs at night. I was making more money from poker than I was from my job... so, I decided to move to Vegas and pursue a different path.

I thought the money would be similar or even better... I was certainly wrong, lol. But I did enjoy the fact that I was now in the gambling capital of the world.

Also, I had run my own club a few years prior with 2 partners who had invested in the game. It was a sh*tshow, but I have a ton of great stories from those days. Eventually, the game's end started to begin when one of my partners booked action with one of our regs on a sports bet for $10k, lost it, then hit the road and ghosted me. This player who had booked the action was not someone you wanted to mess around with. He was a gangster and when I rolled back the security footage to confirm that one of my partners did indeed book action with him, I sure enough found the conversation on the system's hard drive. It had occurred after the game had ended a few days prior, and the conversation concluded with the player brandishing a pistol to reinforce the fact that this debt had better be paid should my partner lose, since it was such a large bet.

To make a long story short, I of course took responsibility for the debt and basically paid the player out every night after the game, which included me putting him into the game to speed up paying off the debt. Even though this debt on the book was a serious problem, having the player around gave me somewhat of a sense of security. I knew no one was going to try and make a move on us, given the player's reputation. I'm not a "tough guy", nor was it legal to carry a gun in New York. We were not in the best part of town either.

There's a lot more to that story, but essentially having that debt on the book pop up out of nowhere was what killed the club. I never did cross paths again with the partner who took off.
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Old 03-25-2019, 02:57 PM   #23
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

We used to have a dealer at TS about 10-15 years ago that we had to wake up to deal the next street some nights. Constantly fell asleep.
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Old 03-26-2019, 04:43 AM   #24
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

Quote:
Originally Posted by CupOfSalt View Post
Speaking as a dealer of 10 years, you have to feel the table out whether a little chit chat is wanted or not.

At low limit games I tend to chat more. Iím not a sports guy, so incessantly talking about sports or ďmy picksĒ is not an issue for me. I also donít watch the TVs ever.

I do say hello to the regs I like and have a rapport with, no matter the limits.
...

I love your work ethic and attitude. But what is the best way to ask a dealer NOT to say hello to me? It identifies me as a reg, and that is information I don't want the whole table to know.
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Old 03-26-2019, 10:40 AM   #25
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Re: Dealer Etiquette - Slow/Talkative/Uneducated....

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I love your work ethic and attitude. But what is the best way to ask a dealer NOT to say hello to me? It identifies me as a reg, and that is information I don't want the whole table to know.
It doesnít. It identifies the dealer as a person with at least a basic set of manners. You say hello while sitting down at the table, the dealer welcomes you and other players at least nod or smile to acknowledge your presence. That should be mandatory in any kind of social setting and isnít a very hard ask.
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