TL,DR: Is there an easy to access list of commonly misinterpreted or confused rules that I can pull up on my phone when an insane ruling / argument occurs?

To set the stage, this takes place at a private members only cardroom:

1/2 game,

I am on the button with Black Aces,

Pre-flop action:
UTG opens to $15,
UTG+1 raises to $20,
UTG+2 says "dead raise.." before calling the $20,
Another player calls the $20 as well before it gets to me,

I put out a raise to $120 and am immediately besieged by players saying that I cannot raise because it's a dead raise. I look to the dealer for help and he sort of nods with the rest of the chorus and says "well it's a dead raise..."

I am sort of awestruck by this, but after a fair amount of discussion, and trying not to make a huge scene, the players around me relent and my raise stands.

I didn't want to call the floor because at that point I think I'm basically turning my hand face up with how intent I am to get a raise through in this spot. I basically tried to mimic a rules nit and lean on a behavior or argument that I didn't care about the hand anymore I just wanted to prove that I was right to win the argument. Obviously I call the floor if the dealer takes a stand that I can't raise here, but he was so ambivalent that I figured he was just trying to keep the table happy instead of making a ruling. Or maybe he was just new and didn't know / understand / care.

To finish the story, we still go 6 ways to the flop, and by the river end up with 3 side pots, and somehow my aces hold up and I win a massive pot.

So is there an easy to access website somewhere that I can just say "go here and look at that and it'll explain how you're wrong" instead of being forced to rules nit or call the floor?

Thanks!

Was UTG+2 all in for the $20?

Did you ask the other players what exactly they meant by "dead raise"?

Why didn't you object as soon as the $20 "raise" and subsequent call happened?

And rules in a "private members only cardroom" often are like rules in a knife fight.

Anything goes in a home game, so good luck with that. If you want to pull something up, pull up Robert's rules of poker v11.

http://www.homepokergames.com/roberts-rules-poker.php

When the player made the $20 dead raise, this should have limited everyone else to calling $20 or folding. Your raise to $120 should not have been allowed.

They were just confused with another situation.

Player A makes it say $20. Later Player B goes all in for $35. Any player between Player B and Player A can still raise because they are facing a raise, but Player A and any player in between Player A and Player B can only call.

Ya they were mistaken. It’s a dead raise for utg but not anyone acting before him

What is a dead raise?

Yes, my mistake, I could have been more clear.

UTG+2 goes all-in with his last $20.

I didn't think to say anything when the players said "dead raise" because it was a dead raise to the UTG+1 opener.

It made sense until they tried to apply the dead raise rule to my action.

I've never even heard the terminology "dead raise". Is there anyone else who has actually heard of this?

Many years ago I played in a low-stakes, spread-limit home game in which there was a limit of three raises per betting round (but each player was allowed one "personal" raise). Players had the option of making a raise of $0 to reach this limit faster and thereby avoid having to call an additional raise.

However, sometimes this backfired. A raise of $0 reopened the betting for the initial raiser. You needed two players to make a raise of $0 to end all raising on that round (other than personal raises by those yet to act).

I forget what we called this raise of $0, but it might have been a dead raise.

So when UTG+2 said "dead raise," was he referring to UTG+1's action or to his own action? I ask only because you say this was a private, members-only card room, so they might have some home game-style rules.

The mistake you are making is that you are assuming that there is a set of poker rules that is universal and all games have to follow. Poker rules are room based. While many rules are common to many rooms, they don't have to be. If a room decides that an all-in freezes the betting action, then that is the rule.

Very few rooms actually publish their rules, so you are often at the whim of the floor, guided by what the other players feel are the standards.

That's poker, folks.

But it doesn't seem to be the case that an all-in freezes the betting action in this room. It was simply a number of players and the dealer misapplying a rule. It is likely this room didn't have any specific rule but were just trying to apply generally used rules. So if OP could easily refer to generally accepted rules, it may have really helped them see that they were mistaken in how they were viewing this rule.

Typical home game argument. There's no cheat sheet list of commonly misapplied rules. You just need to know how to find the rule quickly in Roberts rules somewhere online.

None of this makes any sense at all, but if you're in a "private cardroom" they can make any house rules they want. I have never heard of the term either.

As for a universal set of rules to have for quick reference, that's not going to be helpful because of the house rules that can trump just about anything.

It is about 500 times more likely that the room was misapplying a common rule rather than having a house rule that no one else can raise if someone is all-in.

I have heard the term "dead raise" before for a raise like this one, that doesn't re-open the action to people who have already acted on the original bet. So, A checks, B bets $15, C calls $15, D all in for $20. The raise is "dead" in that it doesn't allow B or C to "re-raise", since it wasn't a full raise. I have seen people not understand that players after D, including A, can absolutely raise.

Exactly this. The fact that a room can have their own rules doesn't mean that they do (at least not for all rules) and that being able to refer to the most generally accepted rules wouldn't be helpful. OP had a valid question, and the best answer is to point him to Robert's Rules of Poker.

WTF does that mean?

That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

Thanks.

RROP does seem like the best quick reference available.

Also, many years ago, I played with some people who had the same thing, but they called it a "madge" raise (I'm making up the spelling, so you'll see how they pronounced it). It was short for "imaginary", and worked exactly as your "personal" raise. It really is kind of lame - it basically is for people who want to get to the next card (or showdown) without risking very much. I didn't know anyone else did that.

I downloaded TDA onto my phone but haven't quite mastered the search function that works wonders on a tower and bigger screen. Search for a key word and it will scan the whole document for that word. (Sometimes called 'Find')

Never heard of a dead raise .. but did hear of the 'no check-raise' and '3 per round' rules that have gone by the way side.

Your raise should stand in almost every room world wide these days. GL

FYP

Even acknowledging that every room can have its own set of rules, I can't imagine any poker room anywhere that would limit a player who has not yet acted to calling or folding to whatever bet represents the current action when it gets to him. The basic rules of poker are that a player who hasn't acted can call, raise or fold. RRoP shouldn't be necessary.