Err, 2+2 forums were sold and has new owners. There are threads in ATF and NVG.

I don't mind mods instructing people not stray too far off topic. I do mind when they simply purge a line of posts that we thought hard about. Readers should know about what people were actually thinking and saying.

Cliffs: this is a feature, not a bug.

Hi DMW, thanks for asking here. Here is the reasoning:

* For reference, here were the topics covered/argued about in the posts which were removed, from one of our Venues threads: whether and how masking yourself prevents catching CV, what it means for one's body to have "contained" the CV, whether people who are not vaccinated are fools, whether anyone is "vaccinated in reality". (Then there were a few posts which got into personal attacks and trolling too.) None of these topics have anything to do with the Venue in question, they are just straight up arguments about CV and the science around it.

* Posts on CV and its related (but non poker) ilk have been restricted to the containment thread for over a year, and probably closer to 18 months already now, in CCP and Venues. Everyone who had posts moderated has been on the forums for at least that long. All are regulars in this forum. Some are repeat offenders of this rule. Some seem to be general forum trolls. All are most likely well aware of this forum rule (and if not, now they hopefully are).

* For reference, here is an excerpt from our rule on what happens when you break a forum rule:
On containment threads:
On other contentious topic posts:
* If you wish to discuss (which unfortunately generally means argue) CV, masking, CV science, or any of the other related topics, you may do so in the containment thread. Or in numerous other fora here on 2+2. Or in literally millions of other places on the internet.

* You mentioned specifically losing posts you spent time creating. This is one of the (though not necessarily the primary) reasons we just delete these posts - the pain of wasted time. It is a negative reinforcement. Having learned that knowing and ignoring forum rules leads to your posts just getting deleted outright, how likely are you to continue to do it? Our hope is that posters will quickly (or eventually) learn not to violate these rules. Other moderators in other 2+2 fora pair post deletion or editing with infractions or other incremental penalties. We try to avoid that here in CCP, though we will occasionally go that route for flagrant violations or repeat offenders.

* Note that there are exceptions:
** Early on, we moved posts to the containment thread rather than deleting them, because it was a new rule and there were lots of violations and it was a topic of large import, but we stopped doing that a year ago.
** Sometimes a set of posts starts in good territory, then slowly moves into violation space. If I can catch this happening in time, I will sometimes just post a warning not to continue the debate and leave the minimally violating posts there. A typical example: initial posts talking about a change in policy at a room (fine), then some posts saying "I will/won't come with this rule" (basically fine), then some posts saying why the rule sucks (basically not fine). If allowed to continue, it will almost always then devolve into a bunch of arguing about CV science, then trolling, followed by flaming and personal attacks (definitely not fine).
** Outside of CV issues, I will sometimes edit, rather than delete, a post if: (1) I am at my computer rather than on my phone, where editing is a PITA, (2) it is a new poster who may not yet understand the rule they are violating, and (3) after editing to excise the objectionable content, there is still other content there worth preserving, possibly which has already led to continued discussion before I got to the post [typical example: a privacy violation that occurs while discussing a real topic of concern for the community].
** None of these exceptions apply to the set of posts you're referring to.

* As an aside, my moderation philosophy continues to be: start by trying not to moderate small violations, and hope that the community ignores them or does not engage, in essence letting you guys manage it yourselves. But if (and sadly, when) things snowball, or if a user reports the posts, then I take moderation action. And when that happens, I am more likely to moderate heavily, to make sure the behavior does not continue.

* It's not personal. I often don't even look at who is posting what, I just look at the content. I have even moderated some of Lattimer's posts in the past, without realizing it. And I hope he feels free to do the same to me.

Summary: I don't care if you want to give your hot takes on these topics, just do it in the containment thread, not in general CCP or Venues posts, so that they won't bother the people who don't want to read it. If you see someone else posting about it in a general thread, just ignore it. If you can't stand to let that post remain uncontested, then report it. Just don't respond to it in the same thread. If you must respond with your own viewpoint, move the discussion to the containment thread and continue it there.

A final note: in writing this post, I realized that the Forum Rules sticky actually did not mention the CV containment thread, so I added it, and noted specifically that containment thread violations may be deleted.

+1 for having your own code of fed regulations
+1 for knowing the correct plural of forum

Now just try enforcing said regs with a verbal warning first and posters will have a chance to move it to your preferred containment thread.

There's a new thread to discuss the feasibility of allowing Texas Poker Rooms to have their own individual threads in the Venues section instead of being lumped together into a single thread under Home Games.

One of the mods said we should also call attention to it here to ensure it was seen by the relevant staff

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/5...forum-1810796/

Thanks for linking it. I have responded in that thread.

Please note that browser2920 has rejoined as a mod of CCP (along with V&C). Other than adding his name at the bottom of the thread list, nothing much else should change.

Community members:

We recently received a request from a poster to delete a thread he had made in order to facilitate his reinstatement in a room. The mods here discussed.

We usually decline these requests, particularly after posts have received substantial community engagement, because the thread belongs to the community at that point, not to the OP. However, in this case, we have decided to proceed with the request, and to post a short summarized version of the thread here instead, because our opinion is that the benefit of deleting the thread to the real world poster outweighs the downside to the community.

You are, of course, welcome to comment on the moderation action taken here.

You are also welcome to comment on the post (or rather its summary I guess) here in this thread, or in the low content thread. But my request is that you please don't just try to recreate the thread that was deleted - we deleted it in order to facilitate the reinstatement of the player, and ask that you put yourself in that players shoes and consider avoiding making his life more difficult.

I know some of you took screenshots of the old thread, and good on you for that. Unless it somehow becomes truly needed for some future issue, however, please refrain from just reposting them, or doing anything like that.

We believe that this issue between the poster and the room will be resolved as a result of these actions, and have been told that they have ironed out the "misunderstandings" between them, whatever those were. If that ends up not being the case, we will revisit.

Thanks.

10/27/2023, redacted post "Banned From Horseshoe Baltimore"

I doubt everyone who posted and/or read the thread you are deleting will read this here. You might want to consider creating a thread that says what you said above without using the original post and without asking for comments in the new thread itself (you could point them to this thread if they want to comment)

Some ideas for titles:
"Baltimore, you never know what might happen"
"Turns out there is always hope"
"This site, forum, and community can actually help!"

Then you can close this new thread (so nobody can continue to post in public) and at least everyone will know what happened.

It may have been the right decision to lift out the thread in this case, there was that much specifically personal in there, so just a title change might not have been enough. If it's the exception confirming the rule of letting threads stay, we'll survive.