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Casino Cashier Scam Casino Cashier Scam

12-30-2017 , 06:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pure_aggression
Just anecdotally, the majority of the times they check the cameras in the poker room for a ruling it comes back "inconclusive”
Because the casino doesn’t care who is supposed to win a pot. Their goal is to protect themselves from people stealing money from the house. At the poker tables, they want to be able to have conclusive footage of dealers palming chips, not of player Z putting in the right amount of chips.

Besides that, the casino usually picks the approach that causes the least overhead.
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12-30-2017 , 11:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gpo613
Back in '04 I was at the Bellagio. Just arrived in LV. I was going to go sit at 15/30 LHE. So I was going to buy $600 in red. I gave the cashier $600 and she brought out 3 racks of red($1500) and started to slide them to me. I wasn't really thinking and was grabbing at them and she realized her mistake. I almost booked a $900 win without playing a hand.
They're going to notice a $900 shortage. Unless you're fine with never returning to any of their properties you're going to be asked to pay it back. Same thing happened with someone I know except he kept the additional $500 in chips and just went ahead and sat down at the table. Week later he wasn't welcome till the money was paid.
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12-30-2017 , 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Reducto
This would increase the number of times an incorrect payout was made and possibly noticed, would halve the rewards, and requires that you trust the other person not to do or say anything stupid.
While that's true, on a practical level, it's common so unsurprisingly people are not rational.

The directionality is usually reversed (or more accurately, the casino is most worried about the scenario in which the directionality is reversed) - the cashier is compromised (drug habit, gambling debt, etc) and pays the associate from the till, and then has to steal from a customer to make it even.
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12-30-2017 , 02:45 PM
I have an Idea. How about carefully counting how much your chips are worth before cashing them at the cage. Then count out how much money they just gave you for the chips. It should match. Has anybody ever tried that method??

Last edited by Bene Gesserit; 12-30-2017 at 02:51 PM.
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12-30-2017 , 03:45 PM
Meh. OP goes to the cage, doesn't pay attention because he's a) watching the game, b) checking out the waitress, or c) too busy looking at his phone, and then compounds the mistake by not counting the money until later, so now he makes up a story about being "scammed."

Lesson not learned. It's your money. Pay f'ing attention.
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12-30-2017 , 04:26 PM
I know how much money I'm expecting to receive and then I watch the count like a hawk. Someone with sleight of hand skills could short me I guess but missing the count by $100 is not going to slide.
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12-30-2017 , 05:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pure_aggression
Sure it is risky. Usually when this has happened they are the only cashier working in the vicinity, even if there is another employee near by they have little incentive to rat them out.

Exactly, either way it is prudent to double check you chip count and the cash received.

I would agree most errors are honest mistakes, and that's what makes the scam so clever and allows the potential scammer to operate with impunity.

I think there is a psychological basis for why scammers choose to skim precisely $100 off, if the first two digits are correct and then the 3rd digit is only off by 1, seems like it's more likely to trick people even if the counted down their stack prior to getting to the window.

I don't think nickel and diming would have a better EV for the scammer.

I think I've seen this set up (being shorted exactly $100) about a dozen times.

Pointless to level accusations when intent can't ever be proven, just wanted people to be aware of the possibility.

Just anecdotally, the majority of the times they check the cameras in the poker room for a ruling it comes back "inconclusive".

Regardless, people get fired all the time for stealing, usually they get away with it many times before they are eventually caught.
Yeah gotta remain alert at cashout. At which casinos and how many times at each have you seen this? Have any cashiers done it more than once?
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12-30-2017 , 08:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurn, son of Mogh
Meh. OP goes to the cage, doesn't pay attention because he's a) watching the game, b) checking out the waitress, or c) too busy looking at his phone, and then compounds the mistake by not counting the money until later, so now he makes up a story about being "scammed."

Lesson not learned. It's your money. Pay f'ing attention.
If you actually read the OP the situation was immediately resolved as soon as I told them it's short. Ive never not realized it til later, unless I was conned and never realized it haha.

I assure you the story is not bogus.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bene Gesserit
I have an Idea. How about carefully counting how much your chips are worth before cashing them at the cage. Then count out how much money they just gave you for the chips. It should match. Has anybody ever tried that method??
Common sense, but I'm sure not everyone is 100% focused on it all the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer
I know how much money I'm expecting to receive and then I watch the count like a hawk. Someone with sleight of hand skills could short me I guess but missing the count by $100 is not going to slide.
Yeah I'm sure it probably doesn't work much on alert and sober people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoseJohnnyJimJack
Yeah gotta remain alert at cashout. At which casinos and how many times at each have you seen this? Have any cashiers done it more than once?
Not gonna put specific people or casinos on blast, I'm sure it could happen just about anywhere, there are two establishments I can remember it happening more than once from different employees. A dozen times out of 1000 times cashing out is still an extremely rare occurrence, 99% of employees are legit.

So yeah, beware. Trust everyone but cut the deck.
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12-31-2017 , 02:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pure_aggression
If you actually read the OP the situation was immediately resolved as soon as I told them it's short. Ive never not realized it til later, unless I was conned and never realized it haha.

I assure you the story is not bogus.
Nobody's accusing you of creating a bogus story. At issue is you determining that being shorted on the odd rare occasion is an intentional "scam" by various cashiers rather than innocent mistakes.

I don't know about you, but over the years I've had cashiers make more mistakes in my favor (which I immediately corrected), then the other way around.
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12-31-2017 , 09:30 AM
wowo what scumbags they are
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12-31-2017 , 05:48 PM
Occam's razor says that what you have experienced is more likely mistakes than organized crime.

Employees in the casino industry who get caught stealing not only will be fired and become subject to criminal charges, but will also have a hard time getting any reemployment.

Systematic scamming of customers would need to be very profitable to be worth the risk. It is unlikely that the number of systematic 'mistakes' necessary to make such a scam profitable will go unnoticed in the long run (and even in the short).

Do you even make mistakes at the table? Most players, including seasoned ones, will make mistakes even in large pots. Cashiers handle money all day. There are simple procedures in place to prevent these, but nobody is above screwing up.
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12-31-2017 , 10:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DC2LV
I don't know about you, but over the years I've had cashiers make more mistakes in my favor (which I immediately corrected), then the other way around.
of course there are errors made, but when errors are brought to their attention, they recount the chips/cash, not

Quote:
Originally Posted by pure_aggression
As soon as they were finished counting I said "it's short", they instantly reached back in the draw for another hundred without even recounting the chips.
Where there's smoke there's fire
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01-01-2018 , 12:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Playbig2000
Where there's smoke there's fire
Oooooor, they realized they made a mistake, said "oh ****, he's right, I forgot the 100 in green right there, derp!" and paid him out the appropriate amount.
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01-01-2018 , 01:06 AM
I don´t get it. If someone shorts $100, that means there are $100 in chips more in the cage. In order to get the $100 you have to take out $100 in chips and not the bill itself, don´t you?
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01-01-2018 , 01:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrFabulous
I don´t get it. If someone shorts $100, that means there are $100 in chips more in the cage. In order to get the $100 you have to take out $100 in chips and not the bill itself, don´t you?
Okay think about it. Cashier begins the day with $10000. $5000 in cash and $5000 in chips. At the end of shift he should still have $10000 but it shouldn't still be $5000 in cash and $5000 in chips. It will be some other breakdown.

Now suppose he actually has $10,100. Is he over in cash or chips? You can't tell. All he has to do is take $100 in cash or chips and he balances the breakdown doesn't matter.

Sent from my PH-1 using Tapatalk
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01-03-2018 , 01:25 PM
always count your chips before getting to the window and always count your cash before leaving. doesnt take much time and worth it for the 1/100 times the count might be off (intentionally or by accident) from a cashier.
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01-04-2018 , 05:34 PM
If they didn't recount it when you told them it was short I hope you immediately went to management and reported it
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01-05-2018 , 12:15 AM
I found the OP both believable and helpful.

I think though that the number of people at the cage doing this is very small.

Camera angles probably don't matter. They are only going to the cameras if there is a problem (long or short). The bigger problem is being seen palming $100 out of the drawer by other people at the cage, especially supervisors.

I would guess all of us at one time or another are cashing out big and are tired and not paying complete attention. I will now be much more aware. Thanks.
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