At my California cardroom, the first time I ever cashed out for more than $2000, they asked for my drivers license and entered my info into their system. Now every time I cash out more than $2K, they ask for either my ID or my name and log the transaction.

What do they do with this info? Do they keep records in case they get subpoenaed, or the IRS is auditing a player and wants to see their record of transactions?

Cash transactions over $10,000 have to be reported to the Federal government on a document called a CTR (cash transaction report). It is meant to catch people laundering money. Because of this, some people will "structure" a series of transactions below this number. If you do a series of transactions and it adds up to $10,000 within a day or two, then they will fill out the CTR. There could also be something specific to CA going on. But I've seen this practice in LV and other locations.

Do you have a players card there? Maybe that's why they're asking for your DL. My room has a 3K limit before they ask me for my card.

They just log it internally, nothing gets reported as long as you're not doing this 5x/day or laundering money.

Might be in case a W-2G is needed?

As above, every casino (and bank) has an internal process rule about what level of transaction they need to track to be sure they are meeting the requirements to report CTRs for any transaction or set of transactions in a day that exceed 10k. Typically, this is just internal tracking, unless you get to 10k the CTR will not be filed. $2000 is maybe on the slightly lower end of what casinos usually use, but it's certainly within norms.

Even if a CTR is filed, it's just a report. Unless you are doing it a lot, or being suspicious, nothing is going to happen with this. If you do reach a threshold FinCEN will watch you and make sure you are not laundering money or supporting terrorism with it.

Ostensibly none of this is reported to IRS at all. It's a completely separate branch of government looking into financial crimes and terrorism, nothing to do with taxes.

If the casino/bank catches you trying to avoid these reporting, they will instead file a Suspicious Activity Report (SAR) on you. They will do this if you decline to provide ID, or they catch you structuring (asking what the reporting limits are, and trying to process numerous transactions under that limit, to avoid reporting), or if you in any way act suspiciously about it. This is worse for you, now they are definitely going to pass that on to FinCEN and they are likely to investigate you. Still, as long as you're not money laundering or supporting terrorism, probably nothing will happen. But you should know that structuring is actually a crime, so by trying to avoid an innocuous reporting issue, you are are instead committing an honest to god crime.

https://www.fincen.gov/sites/default...TRPamphlet.pdf

Bottom line: just cash in for whatever amount you would normally do, and give them your id whenever they ask, and you'll be fine.

Another possible reason is the casino is required to seize winnings for child support.

I believe checking for any government-related outstanding debts can only be done when a player wins a jackpot over a set amount. Unless you hit a bad beat jackpot, or something similar, they can't attempt to seize anything from a standard poker cash out.

Tomorrow morning they'll be 15% less people logging in with their cards, maybe 25% if the areas tax payers decide not to take the chance also.

Yes but from a state or national lottery

Dinesh nailed it as usual. Occasional 10k cashouts are really not a big deal and anything less is not even reported. Just give them your info when asked.

Every so often the government audits casino reporting procedures and starts fining places that aren't tracking transactions properly. The last round it was millions in fines, which is why cash doesn't play in most rooms and why there are often signs saying players can't buy/sell chips to other players. We're probably overdue for another round of fines.

Just cash out $1999 at a time

This would be the easiest SAR of that cashier's career. At least in the places I've worked, the people that cash you out are far more knowledgeable and observant than one might think. If they have the slightest hunch that you withheld some of your chips to avoid any limits (and players tend to make this WAY more obvious than they realize), the moment you walk away they are calling surveillance and/or nearby cages to let them know. You're drawing 10 times the amount of attention to yourself than you would if you just handed over the ID/player's card when asked.

Most local laws do not place the amount so low. They usually are like 10k or something (ymmv based on state/if it’s on a reservation). Potentially if you know the law you can refuse but it’d be pretty silly to do so. They won’t report it to the irs at all.

Depends on the state. In Maryland the casinos are governed by the lottery commission so if you win a high hand promo especially one that triggers a tax form then you will be run through the database


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In Las Vegas they generally ask for ID at $3000. I didn't know until I read this thread that they don't file the CTR until you actually go over 10K.

One time I had a lucky week and realized that, between cash deposits to my checking, savings, wife's account, and various credit cards I had deposited 10K in the credit union. I wrote to them proactively and explained what I had been doing. CTRs are a fact of life, but you want to avoid SARs/stuff that looks like "smurfing."

Yes .. some casinos have dropped down to $2K from $3K in the Midwest. You shouldn't be able to get a casino employee to give you a detailed reason as to why either .. they will just say it's their policy.

Lots of Poker Players take chips home to avoid these types of 'issues'. The casinos don't seem to care if it's Poker Players doing this, but if you win a lot in the Pits you may find yourself being asked to cash out all your chips at one time. Otherwise they could consider that you are making 'Structured' cash-outs to avoid the 'tracking'.

The most common 'excuse' casinos will use it that Surveillance must verify (and thus document) all cash-outs of over $2k in case of a mistake (not in their favor) is made by the Cashier. Thus also limiting the Cashier's ability to skim bills (which is harder to do in smaller transactions).

I've never heard of winnings from Poker or Pits being garnished .. however, I wouldn't be surprised if 'hand-pay' Slot, Pit Jackpot or Promotional payouts are targets for liens that a Patron may have against them. GL

There are legitimate reasons to not want to hand over ID and you are not required to if it's < 10k, no matter what their policy is.

Advantage players protect their identity very carefully.

Yeah but if you’re not an advantage player it’s pretty silly to care.

And I’m pretty sure 10k is not a universal thing, it varies from state to state or even jurisdiction to jurisdiction.

financial institutions in the US are absolutely required to file a report at 10k due to federal laws. They will need your ID to do this properly (and if you refuse, they file an SAR on you instead, which will probably have your photo from surveillance and probably your name and players card info from their in house security as well).

Whether and when they request your ID for smaller amounts is up to them, but after the first fine for not properly reporting a structured cashout they will start asking for them from 2-5k just like every other institution does.

You are not required to hand over ID for any cashout, but they don't have to cash you out either, and if you don't hand it over you will have an SAR filed on you instead. I mean, if you like poking yourself in the eye, have at it I guess.

They absolutely do have to cash you out whether you give them an ID or not if it's under 10k. They will try to tell you they won't, but they ARE required to.

However, they can ban you from the casino if you don't.

This is true, they can cash you out and ask you not to come back. You still don't have to ID yourself though.

"Could I please have a check for the $10K?"

What do you do if they don't? Call the cops?

Keep the chips and structure. Easy game.