Js999sQs on the board. I bet 325, guy shoved 375, 3rd person folds, I call. He shows KTss, puts other two cards forward and face down, dealer takes those two cards from the seat and puts them next to the muck next to the 9 seat. I show my whole hand. Who gets the pot?

if I remember correctly, he only has to show two, because omaha requires only two in the hand played.

But everyone has gotten into the habit of showing all four because of Omaha hi/lo, or misreading their hand.

So if not hi/lo, he wins.

But if the room requires it, the dealer screwd up.

At least in (most?) regulated rooms you certainly have to show all 4 cards to claim the pot at showdown.

As for who gets the pot, that depends on what hand you showed. If your hand beats the K-high flush, the dealer should muck the other hand and push you the pot. If your hand doesn't beat the K-high flush, the dealer might remind the other player that it takes 4 to win. Regarding the latter, house rules might come into play.

9 T J Q K is a straight flush

lol, my bad.

Trying to claim that pot with a loser doesn't make much sense to me. I hope the dealer didn't muck the winning hand.

These are the relevant TDA rules.

13 a. he obviously violated that. hand is not properly tabled
b. he did not properly table the hand, yes. but the cards he did reveal were enough to win the hand so the floor might make a decision that they were sufficiently tabled to win the hand. however he might rule them not sufficiently tabled.
14. the two cards not in the muck are identifiable and thus clearly still live.
15. this one is weird. I would say this is more that he should have told the guy to table all cards in the first place. I think this is no longer applicable because the cards should be recovered first before they are tabled. so the dealer should call the floor over and let him make a decision.

think it becomes more interesting if the cards were not so obviously retrievable. just let the floor recover the cards and push the pot. hell even if he doesn’t recover the cards push him the pot and give him a warning that his hand will be declared dead next time if the cards are mucked by the dealer.

I think there are basically two reasons that a hand has to be fully tabled in whatever game.

The first is that the other players in the hand are entitled to see all of the cards of the winning hand. They paid for it. And aside from losing they can learn something about the way the winning player plays whatever game they are playing.

The second is that it is conceivable that the winning hand has other cards that would make it cheating or a fouled deck in which case the hand would be declared a misdeal and all money would go back to the originators of the bets.

At Foxwoods many years ago there was a hand in which one player had quad 4's and another player had trips on a AKQ44 board (OK I have no idea what was actually on the board because I wasn't at the table at the time but it could have been the board...) Had the player with quads been allowed to show just one 4 she could possibly have split the pot with the other player who had a single 4 instead of winning nothing (the reason there were five 4's in the deck was that the hand before at the must move table a player had been dealt a 4 which allowed her to move tables and she brought the 4 with her by mistake and discarded it into the deck that had just been dealt at the new table).

Having said all of that if I was the losing player in the hand I would just ask the dealer to turn over the other two cards in the hand and allow the pot to be pushed to the straight flush winner with no objection. I would look at those other two cards in an attempt to understand the playing strategy of the other player. I would have no interest in winning the hand on a technicality.

While it was a bit early for the Dealer to pull in the face down cards at least they didn't muck them. The Dealer probably just paused in this case waiting for some sort of action by the other Player in the Showdown or the 'offending' Player to realize they need to show all four. If the Dealer didn't want to try to handle it themselves then a Floor should be called and 'Katie bar the door' for what should be an easy ruling.

While Rule 15 is numerically 'later' than 13 and 14 it does take precedence here mainly because the Dealer probably had enough time to read the KTss as the nuts before the normal muck reflex took over for the other two cards. This Player was first to show, so IMO all four cards should be tabled to claim the pot.

As we have discussed many times in poker .. warnings and penalties are typically doled out after the hand. It's very difficult to kill a live hand and in this case we are dealing with the nuts being tabled.

I guess kudos to the Dealer for not mucking the other two cards and realizing the situation .. but IMO they never should've pulled them in without first imploring the Player to table them and/or then calling the Floor over (which probably wouldn't have been necessary). GL

Like I've said before, I don't read partially tabled hands.

"Are you folding? It takes four cards to make a claim to the pot."
And I would read/announce the fully tabled hand as the current winning hand.

That violates OPTAH.

Well then OPTAH and TDA Rule 15 are in direct conflict with each other.

It's almost impossible for you to not 'see' what has been tabled and realize that it's a made hand. You may not announce it, but you know it .. and that enters into Rule 15 territory.

I screwed myself (or did I) out of a PLO pot when I only table 3 cards showing my missed wrap .. not realizing that the River gave me a Full House. The Dealer pulled in the facedown card and mucked the other three. One of the Players at the table said something and the Dealer said there was nothing they could do once the 4th card was mucked. (In this case the Dealer was the Floor also, so no recourse available.) Did the Dealer screw me over? Maybe, but I didn't see it so it's on me first before them. The Dealer said they saw it but snapped mucked the face down card anyway .. "Nothing they could do .. " I knew better but didn't say anything .. GL

Implore and advise are two different things.

Since you did not say what you had, I am assuming his flush beats what you had.

1. Normally and by rule you must table all hole cards.
2. Being close to the muck on the two down cards doesn’t matter. They are not in the muck and are clearly identifiable as described so they are still live.
3. Dealer should not have pulled in the 2 cards. He should have told player to table all or fold. At this point he should push back cards and say show all of discard without announcing winning h@nd. He should do 5his regardless of what you showed or even if you have not showed and it is his turn to show.

Imploring might be too strong a word but the above posted rule 15 clearly says dealers should inform player all the cards must be tabled to claim pot. So maybe not implore but definitely should inform.

Also the fully tabled hand can be read as it is fully tabled. But until first player tables all 4 cards or releases all 4 it is too soon to declare a winning hand.

I'm calling bullshit. The dude tabled a K-high straight flush. Tabling your hand in an attempt to win the pot is just a douche move. And I'm a rules nit.

At worst he gets a warning. Killing a hand like that is bad for poker and almost any floor will find a way around doing it. The fact that you even tried an angle like this is not a good look.

I was not hero just copied and pasted. Also perhaps relevant he was rude to everyone and mega slow rolled hero.

Straight flush

He has not yet tabled anything. Though he should be given the opportunity to finish tabling his hand.

A hand is NOT tabled until all the hole cards have been placed face up on the table such that they can be read by dealer and others. Since this is PLO that means all 4 hole cards must be placed on table face up. The 2 cards near the muck have not been placed on felt face up.

Technically, yes. However, your "hero" tabling is hand, after seeing the straight flush in an attempt to win is still a douche move.

I feel like the correct thing for Hero to do is make a comment that its 4 shown to win instead of trying to angle shoot for the pot vs straight flush.

I have no prob H tabling his hand. Anyone can always table his hand. Now if he tries to get the straight flush killed, that is a douche move. But if H does nothing but table his hand and for whatever reason this room has the crappy rule that kills the other hand without opportunity to finish tabling it, I blame the room.

I have not heard H did anything other than just table his losing hand. I suspect he may have. If so that is bad.