Tournament .. open a table of ALL alternates .. not all of them have arrived as of yet ..

1) How many Players have to sit before starting to deal?

2) Do you start to blind all the stacks off or allow (an amount of) time for the others to arrive? GL

3) Call floor, follow their instructions?

Of the first two, I guess it's situation-dependent. There does need to be a reasonable amount of time for players to gather. However, I'm not sure what the definition of 'reasonable' is. Depending on room size, maybe five minutes-ish?

At some point, it's players' responsibility to pay attention.

Once we start, I'm blinding players' stacks in, if I've been so instructed.

A Floor was actually opening the table in this particular case .. so we take that option away There's more to this that I'm leaving out, but I just wanted to know how other rooms handle their stacks.

My assumption is that most rooms blind off stacks that are paid for before the tournament starts .. and perhaps even an alternates stack is in play as soon as they are called. But this particular case of opening a table of all alternates created some dust.

Small room (10 tables) .. no firm precedent on 'stacks in play' or 'reasonable' wait time. They will Bravo text AND call Player phone directly if time allows. Has skipped over an alternate who wasn't in the tournament area when they were called and just left them at the top of the alternate list as well. GL

Every room I have ever worked in had policies for these questions. Granted, some of these policies were loosely enforced and often bent, but there were policies.

For example, every room I worked in had a policy that tournament tables started when at least 4 (or 5 in another room) were present. That policy was often bent when it was clear that a couple other players were on their way (a good dealer would stretch out the prep time to allow the stragglers to make it in time).

That said, I am surprised that the room opened a new table with all alternates. Most rooms I have seen, if it is beyond the first level or two, any new table is opened by taking existing players from other tables and moving them (maybe sprinkling in a few alternates), and then making alternates sit I the already running games.

Same for blinding off registered players who are not present, rooms should have a policy. I have seen this policy vary widely though. I dealt in a room where absent players stacks were put into play only if there was an alternate list (or once registration closed). I have been in other rooms where absent players were given a 10 minute grace period and then their stack was put into play. At this room the policy was not always strictly enforced. Sometimes the floor was busy.

Every room is different, but each room should also have policies in place to handle these questions.

I had a hilarious situation today.

There is a player who I wouldn't call a regular, but he is a long time irregular player. He will show up and play 3 or 4 days a week for a month, then we won't see him for a month or two.

He is literally in contention for one of the 5 nicest humans I have ever met. He is always very gracious and friendly to everyone around him. He never gets mad at anyone, even if a dealer screws up and messes up his hand he is polite to them and half blames himself. He always is helpful to other players even to his detriment. Oppenents can suck out on him with the most ridiculous calls and he is always gracious and happy for them. Literally a really nice human. One of the best. He reminds he of Greg Raymer. That nice of a person. He is also a pretty decent poker player. Certainly a long time winner.

Physically, he is about 5'7" and at least 375, probably 400 pounds if not more. He is so obese that it is hard to estimate his weight. If he said he was 500 pounds I would believe it. This matters later.

It is a $1/$3 table and he is in seat 5 directly accross from me. Normally he plays $2/$5 or $5/$10, but for some reason he was at $1/$3. Maybe he was waiting for an open seat, maybe he didn't bring much money. I don't know.

So partially through my down there is a big hand. It is three bet pre-flop but still three or four players see the flop. Action continues postflop. Pot gets to be huge. Well over $1000. Probably $1300 or $1400. On the river there are only two players left. Seat 9 checks the river, seat 4 bets a decent amount, seat 9 shoves. Seat 4 only has to call maybe $200 (onto a huge $1300 or $1400 pot). He goes into the tank. It is obvious he has a good hand and therefore it should be an easy call just because the size of the pot, but it also looks like he is probably beat. He thinks a really long time. Well over two minutes.

Everyone sits quietly at the table while he thinks. Everyone knows it is a big spot. Especially for the stakes.

The protagonist (who is not in the hand) decides he is going to leave to table. The table is crowded, not just because he is a big boy, but there are all sorts of drink tables, the player in seat 2 has his girlfriend behind him, etc. It is a tight table.

Seat 5 pushes his chair straight back and starts to stand up. While standing up he lets out a really long and loud fart. At least 10 seconds. It reminded me of the story about Andre the Giant farting when filming Princess Bride.

https://www.snopes.com/articles/3491...6-second-fart/

Everyone at the table was quiet for about 15 or 20 seconds. Everyone is trying to confirm they heard what they think they heard.

The poor guy wanted to shrink and hide and pretend it was not him, but he was dead to rights. Everyone heard it, it was obvious. So he did the best he could and started apologizing to everyone at the table.

So of course everyone at the table breaks out in laughter. Loud public farts are never not funny. He is such a nice person that everyone tries not to laugh, or at least hide their laughter, but no one is successful. The whole table is giggling like 15 year old boys. Even I am, I try and be professional, but it is impossible.

The guy apologizes again, the laughter sort of slows down, but never really stops, people are trying to be polite, but everyone is sort of snickering. There is a little older Asian lady in seat 7, she says "That was a good one!"

That opened the floodgates. Everyone broke down and openly starts laughing loudly. Half the table is crying from laughing so hard. It was made worse because no one WANTED to be laughing. No one could help it.

This goes on for a while, I couldn't tell you how long because I was laughing so hard. My eyes were watering. Probably a other minute or so. Everytime someone tried to gain control of themselves it just made them lose it that much more.

Eventually the guy in seat 4 who is still sort of laughing pushes his cards forward and openly says he is folding. He says he has no idea if he is good or bad, but he cannot think because he is laughing too much.

While openly laughing, I slowly collect the cards, and push the pot to seat 9.

For the whole rest of the down, everyone would calm down and play would be normal, but suddenly one person would start giggling and the whole table would break out.

I don't think I dealt more that 12 hands or so that down, but it was easily one of the best downs I ever dealt.

Farts.

Always funny.

I also had a crappy tournament down. There is a trend lately of tournament players going almost all in, but leaving themselves a chip behind because of "reasons".

So the blinds are $200/$400. There is some raising and betting. Action gets to the river heads up. A player bets, his opponent moves all of his chips forward except the one $100 chip he leaves covering his cards. I count down the bet and announce the raise. The original better thinks a long time whike tanking. The almost all in player starts to question my count. He wonders why his extra $100 chip is not included in the count. I explain that he didn't move it forward with the rest of his chips.

He gets justifiably angry. He thinks he is all in. While we are talking about it, his opponent says "call". Almost all in player shows and wins. He then starts arguing me over the $100. I explain to him that he didn't announce all in and he left the $100 chip behind when he shoved his chips forward so technically he wasn't all in. He then argued with me and said it was stupid and no one would leave $100 behind. I explained what the rules were and this was not satisfactory for him. He again tried to argue that no one would leave $100 behind.

My mistake was trying to argue that lots kf people leave 1 chip behind. It blew up from there.

I am torn like 8 ways in this. Yes. I completely understand his intention. I also know the rules. Furthermore I know that leaving one chip behind has been the latest trend so I cannot make any assumptions about what his intention was.

Worst of all, he got tilted and we were arguing over a $100 chip at the $200/$400 level. It was highly (massively) unlikely that this $100 chip was going to make a difference in his results .

It was a situation where following the rules sucked compared to using my brain and figuring out intention, especially given recent trends.

You didn't do anything wrong, and the player was not justifiably angry, he was being a douche.

He also may have been angle shooting. If he had lost the hand, I bet he wouldn't be throwing a fit trying to give his last chip to the other guy.

I never had a problem answering either of these questions and didn't know it was very controversial.

1) Room dependent.

2) If a seat is sold, and you have the chips for it, you should deal them in. The floor should have given the alternates enough time to check in (if not, that's a floor issue). Of course you wait until your floor says you can deal.

Had the biggest $hit show at work today over players leaving a few chips behind when they almost go all in.

Player in seat two and player in seat seven get involved in a tournament hand. It gets to the river and there is about $15,000 in the pot. Seat two checks, seat seven bets about $3500. Seat two then puts in a large stack of chips that looks to be ~$24,000 or so. It is close to all of his chips. When he puts the chips forward I get a glimpse of a single $1000 chip he left behind, but I am not sure. It could be a card protector or something else.

Furthermore, the player in seat two leans forward and crosses his arms covering the area in front of him. I cannot see if he has any chips left. I start moving my head around trying to get a better view to see if he is all in. I just want to know if I should put out the all in button or if I should count down his bet and announce it without being asked.

I finally see a chip still behind his arms so I start to count down his bet. At the same time, the player in seat seven takes approximately half a stack of $5000 chips and puts it forward of the line, but doesn't release them. I am not sure how many chips seat seven put forward. Gun to my head I am guessing $45,000 or $50,000, but it was fast and his hand was on it the whole time so it was hard to see clearly. It could have been $35,000 or it could have been $60,000. I don't know.

Seat two immediately turns over his cards revealing two pair, seat seven then turns over his cards revealing a straight. Seat seven then pulls his ~1/2 a stack of $5000 chips back and puts them with the rest of his $5000 chips. I try to tell him to stop, but he continues and says he has the other player covered.

There are a few issues here. Seat two raised the bet of $3500 to about $24,000 (I never got to count). When seat 7 put his partial stack of $5000 chips forward was it a call or a raise? It depends upon the amount he put forward. Furthermore, by turning over his cards, did seat two accept the action of calling the potential raise with his few remaining chips.


Seat 7 genuinely thought seat 2 was all in and he was calling. But he probably put enough chips forward to constitute a raise, but never released them. Seat two immediately turned over his cards causing seat 7 to turn over his cards thinkingbhe beat the all in of seat two.

A mess.

I immediately call the floor. The floor is a very good floor. Easily one of the best in the industry. However this is not a cut and dried situation. There is more than a few points of contention in both players actions. I think a floor could rule many different ways here and all of them defensible. I even think outside factors (such as the reputation of each player) should factor in.

Of course seat two insisted that the other player only called and he should still have $1100 behind (it turns out there was a $100 chip left back in addition to the $1000 chip). Of course seat seven insisted seat two was all in.

A huge mess.

I also have a question. Why are players pretending to go all in but intentionally leaving a couple of chips behind against someone who has you covered?

I am trying to figure out the advantage of doing this? Why are so many players doing this?

I am not talking about raising and putting in a large portion of your stack, but still leaving yourself 15 or 20 bbs behind. I understand there are reasons to do that on rare occasions.

I am talking about a player putting in 95% of their stack as a raise and leaving 2 bbs behind (or less).

The only thing I can think of is that it isn't strategic, it is for a story. Only have two bbs and come back to cash and you have a good story.

Am I missing something strategically?

Maybe it is only my area, but the move has seemed to happen a lot more lately. More and more players are doing this and I am trying to figure why because it is making my job much harder.

I'm not saying it's a sensible strategy, but people do nonsense things all the time...

Only thing coming to mind is that a player might want to add-on for less than an allowed buy-in if they were felted.

This happens here and there in tournaments I deal, so I'm gonna imagine myself in a tournament with 10 big blinds. Whether I open shove 10 BB, or open to ~8 BB I'm obviously committed to the hand. If I open to 8 BB, people may see that I don't have an all-in button in front of me and assume my hand/range is stronger than if I shoved. Even a perceptive person may not take the time to see my stack is super short, especially if I'm covering up my play area with my arms, which I personally consider angling.

If that's becoming a frequent issue you might have to talk to management about it and ask them how you're supposed to handle it from the moment seat 2 moves his chips forward. If there's a clear framework how to deal with a situation where it's unclear if a player is all-in or not (which kinda defeats the purpose of the all-in button) that all dealers in the room follow, you don't have to worry about players singling you out for addressing the situation immediately. For example by asking them if they're all in and reminding them that all chips need to be visible at all times if they're not all-in.

Think it's a bit icm related a bit big blind ante related a bit whimsical and a bit mimicking other people doing it. I've done it and stalled for a 1kish pay jump.

Seems like the player should keep the 1100 but whatever.

There's zero advantage to leave minimal chips behind in cash .. except maybe .. You don't have to show first if the V shoves and a call is made. I do this quite often to see what I was up against and while most of the Players know I could have 'anything' I still don't like to show unless I have to.

My understanding is that you can't add-on for less than the table min, but I could be wrong. Any 'adjustment' to a stack must be within the table stakes. You can play with a stack less than table min, but only once you've started 'legally'. Again, my understanding and I am aware that some casinos allow one short buy between 'full' buys. GL

There are circumstances where it makes sense to leave one chip behind.

Bounty event, multi way pot. You're encouraging someone to raise rather than just call, which could put you heads up.

Near a pay jump you can lose the hand but still hang around for a while.

You can try to run that one chip up if you lose. Big blind antes actually make it easier to climb back up if you are in position. Wait for a decent starting hand then guaranteed 1BB plus several times the small chip if you win.

In a cash game, many rooms let you short buy as long as you have at least one chip still in play. I know a couple of serial offenders of this move.

Not saying that any of these make it profitable to do it, just that some people might think it's a good strategy. That, or they simply find it amusing.

For limit games where I play this is useful for my short buys.

I mean, he left chips behind and he never said all in. This is cut and dry

As described, push the pot to seat 7 and seat 2 plays on with $1100.

Seat 7 can insist all he wants but seat 2 never put out the final $1100. Seat 2 never said call of a raise by seat 7. Seat 7 never said raise nor provided dealer a chance to count and confirm a raise (plus here it is released chips that bet/play not carried ones, but that is here). And seat 2 never said all in. It is seat 7 responsibility (protect ones hand means more than putting a chip on them) to know the action or ask for clarification.

Simply put, seat 2 never did anything to put the final $1100 in play. Now if floor wants to impose a penalty on seat 2 for exposing his hand prematurely, fine. But you can't put him all in.

anywhere I have played you can add on for any amount. Why would the house prevent a $1 add on?

A rebuy means you are consuming a seat that would otherwise be available. But a tiny add on doesn't change the seat consumption, you were already consuming that seat for at least one more hand with or w/o the addon.

I agree it's a silly rule, but I have played in places with that rule.

I was playing, not dealing, but I haven't quite an an implosion as I saw last night in a long time. It was a $1/$2 game with a max $500 buy in. This guy had ~$4800 in front of him. I was only at the table a very short time so I don't even really know how good of player this guy normally was. All I know is that he lit that $4800 on fire in about 20 minutes.

I sit down at the table, first hand the arsonist gets involved with a new player who had just sat down a few hands before me. New player has ~$500. It gets to the turn, about $100 on the pot. Arsonist checks, New Player pauses for a bit and sort of touches the table, but to me, it was clear he wasn't checking. He was adjusting himself in his seat and his hand hit the table. Dealer didn't see it as a check either and continued to look at the player.

Arsonist immediately goes off on the dealer and insisted the player checked. Player immediately says he did not check and was thinking. Dealer calls over the floor. Floor comes over and asks what is going on. Dealer explains that he was waiting on the new player and that thr Arsonist insisted the new player checked. The dealer explained that he didn't see it that way and that the new player said he hadn't acted yet.

The floor is quiet and starts thing for a second. This gives the Arsonist an opening. He insists that everyone at the table saw the new player check. So I immediately speak up and say I didn't think the player checked. I couple of other players murmer in agreement with me.

Not to toot my own horn, but most of the floor people at this place know me and know that I am serious when it comes to rule calls. If I am saying the new player has not yet checked and the dealer is saying the same thing (and at least two or three other players are nodding in agreement), the floor knows the new player did not check.

He rules the new player can still act. The new player bets $80. The Arsonist is pissed off. He really wanted the other player to check. He argues with the floor. The floor doesn't budge. So he slams his chips down and starts mumbling. He is clearly not happy. Finally after a really long time of him mumbling and pouting, he says that he is all in. The New Player immediately calls and turns over top set. Arsonist lifts his cards a bit but doesn't turn them over. The river comes and is a blank. The Arsonist throws hia cards forcefully forward facedown. Later the players next to him said that he had a flush draw that missed.

He doubles up the new player, so $500 of his stack is gone.

It is still clear that he is absolutely 100% pissed off.

Next hand he throws in a chunk of chips as a raise to open. It turns out to be $40. No one calls and he collects the blinds. He does the same thing the following hand, only this time someone reraises him. He thinks and then angrily folds.

Next hand he raises again with a chunk of chips ($45). A player reraises to $100 and The Arsonist shoves. Player calls and tables QQ . It holds and the Arsonist doubles him up (maybe $350). Over the next few hands he keeps raising and getting called/reraised and losing. Literally within one rotation, he loses the full $4800 (2400 big blinds).

Unfortunately I got zero of it.

It was amazing to see someone lose what was probably 40% of the chips at the table in 7 or 8 hands.

($4800) in 20 minutes at 1/2 is an inferno. I don't even see how it's possible. But hey, it sounds like the guy had fun, and that's all that matters.