I've been dealing for over a decade now, and can probably count on two hands the number of times someone has made a 3-bet in preflop action, where the raise amount was less than double the original raise. For example.

SB - 5
BB - 10
Raise to 30
Re-raise to 55

Invariably, when something like this happens, it's either because the 3-bettor is all-in, or he didn't realize that there was a raise in front of him and thought he was raising the big blind, or occasionally, or he's likes to get cute with his bets. Anyhow, this is pretty rare behavior.

I think a lot of players don't even know it can be done, to be honest. I've definitely had to explain why a less-than-double AI reraise still reopens the action at least 3-5 times in my 2 years of dealing.

This happens a lot when a player accidentally puts out more than a call but not the full raise. Like, in a 1/3 game someone makes it $15 to go and the person puts out $25 in reds.

"That has to be $30," someone will try to help out.

"No," I say, "the bet is actually $27 so you need to put $2 more out there," I'll motion to the player.

Without fail someone will argue with me and I have to spell it all out. Makes me wish I had an abacus with me.

Just this past week it came up and someone just refused to understand what just happened. Literally was mumbling to himself about it for five minutes. And this wasn't an idiot, it was a semi-competent reg who for whatever reason just couldn't wrap his head around the fact that you doubled the raise, not the whole bet in front of him.

I explained this concept recently to a fresh-faced teen chiprunner who was listening in on a conversation about it. "Don't have to double it to raise, just raise as much as the last guy raised." He got it. (I think)

Now when he sees me he points and smiles and says "Don't double the raise!"

So don't worry guys I've got the next generation well taken care of.

Get um fresh .. they haven't been influenced by Regs who have lived through, but not accepted or understood, changes in rules as the game and rooms have evolved. Not every industry can have the riggers of academies that produce rookie cops and cadets that know nothing other than their training .. and had someone over their shoulder making sure they didn't vary off course before they passed. GL

As noted but feel it needs more emphasis. No yo do not need to double the raise. You only need to increment your bet by matching the prior bet or raise increment.

For 3-bet the doubling argument makes sense. But extend the example to 4- or even 6- bet or more to dramatize that only matching the incremental amount is needed.

Another way to demonstrate the linear (vs geometric) size growth would be a tournament, limit holdem hand were two players are heads up at the river with both holding the nuts (eg. a AAK94 board and both holding AK). The only bet size available is fixed to one big bet. Otoh since both hold the nuts and after the first action the player currently acting is closing the action and thus must raise. So the action would have to go bet, raise, raise, raise, raise … until one player is all in. The incremental bet size doesn’t double but continues to match

With that said, in Europe, at least in the past, they actually do have a minimum size of doubling. But this may have changed.

Yes, I think it would be pretty rare to find a poker room in Europe that still has the 2x previous 'bet' rule still in place. I remember it was pretty weird (I think) to watch a WPT with 'American' rules in Europe v an EPT with European rules back in the day.

Hard to tell if WSOP, WPT or TDA had the greatest impact on this adjustment. Maybe Kenny Hallert was a big influence with his deep runs in the WSOP ME?

"In order to 'raise' you much at least match the most-previous legal increase amount in addition to matching (calling) the current bet." GL

I'm curious on everyone's thoughts on this. Apparently lots of players hate when other players announce their hand at showdown as "two pair" on a paired board, some even see it as a cheap angle attempt. But as a dealer I've always done this, and now it's got me wondering if others do the same and if it's correct procedure.

For example, board is 46K54, guy tables pocket 7s, I'll announce "two pair, sevens and fours" and push up the K and two 4s on the board.

Anyone who has a problem with a player or dealer accurately reading and announcing a hand needs to grow up.

What I do have a problem with is the guy who says, "I have a set" when he tables Q6 on a QQJ72 board.

I don’t mind either of these. On the SET comment it tells me something. I know from the board the one hand they DONT have is a set. Either they have a boat and misread the board or trips. Both tell me a tiny bit of info.

While the trips/set distinction is important when discussion/analyzing a had, during actual play and hands are announced at showdown it seems.... trivial.

I've seen a 'winning' hand mucked on A8466 when a Player tabled AK and announced 'two pair' the other Player had A8 and got fooled by the King 'kicker' as better than his kicker. It may be appropriate when the Board is paired to go a bit beyond 'two pair' and actually state 'Ace-six' or something similar.

But we've also discussed how to announce a flush when there are higher cards on the Board and this seems to be along the same lines.

I agree that a few Players seem to be bothered by the 'two pair' announcement since they typically share the pair, but it's up to them to pay attention at Showdown when the hands are read. I don't think I've ever seen this as an angle .. more so just a 'da' announcement when they flip over pocket Queens.

Are we to announce 'Ace-high' on 88466 when A3 is shown or 'two pair, Ace kicker'? Why is it so simple when the Board is double paired v single pair? Should be the same announcement and understanding by the Players involved.

Most Dealers do a combination of announcement and pushing Board cards .. and probably most expand their announcement in cases where the Board is double paired but the Player is using a 'higher' pocket pair .. 88466, showing TT.

I see way more Players announce 'trips' when they have a set than the other way around, but that could just be a local thing. You get trips way more than sets, so that word seems to be in their head more often.

Players will be Players, I would love to see a little more announcement from the Dealer in these cases, but I don't think it's mandatory either .. just stay in flow.

We could open the 'just table your hand' discussion too as it's usually all tied together in a spot like this. GL

Why? "Set" isn't even a term in the hand rankings. If somebody says "set" they clearly indicate they have 3 of a kind and not a full house.

I'm slightly annoyed by the "two pair" declaration. Makes sense for dealers to do it, but that's after cards are revealed.

It's not possible to have a set unless you have a pocket pair. It's the fact that someone is showing how sophisticated they are while simultaneously being ignorant that bugs me.

Given how much pressure dealers are under to follow procedure and avoid influencing the action with coaching and hints, it seems unfair to me that they might get grief for literally announcing a formal hand ranking such as "Two pair, ace kicker"

That's obviously correct. What I am saying is that it's not possible to have a set at showdown anyway, at least not when it comes to declaring you hand based on hand rankings.

I don't really care how they announce their hand as long as they're telling the truth and actually tabling the hand. I can't stand where they do that dance of announcing a straight without showing their hand. You're either attempting an angle or slowing the game down.

I 100% prefer dealers to name the exact hand in this manner. Yes I think maybe occasionally someone is trying an angle when they announce 'two pair' but that's a different situation. A formal and precise declaration of the hand seems the right way for the dealer to do it.

I think people who get upset about the two pair announcement are just cry babies. And if they muck bc they dont realize the board is paired,then that's on them for being lazy and not paying attention. To take that logic to its conclusion then if there are 3 kings on the boatd and a player turns over JJ should we just announce "pair of jacks " rather than full house bc anyone with a pair also has a full house? Of course not. The dealer or player should announce his actual best 5 card hand. That way everyone is using the same standard.

Sometimes I think some players just go out of their way to find things to be upset and miserable about. Usually they all play in the daytime O8 game, but sometimes they escape to the NLH games.

Sometimes? You're talking about poker players, right?

Lol. It's true all the time. But sometimes I just don't want to think about it.

Agree.

This is 100% true and is especially obvious when someone loses a hand. I basically never speak to someone immediately after winning a hand off them (unless they talk first) because a solid 20% of players pretend that the most harmless of remarks is an egregious breach of poker etiquette.

How miserable in life do you have to be to come in on a holiday and play LAG as f*** and stiff every single hand all night long? And it’s not a deer-in-headlights player, that would be understandable, this guy is obviously a seasoned vet.

Oh yeah, Merry Christmas everybody.

We all know the type that spends Christmas in a poker room rather than among family and friends.

Good luck out there today.