I might not be posting this in the correct spot, I tried to find it,
However, last night I was all in against the guy to my right who started grabbing my stack and moving it around and counting it while it was past the betting line.

I didn’t say anything because I wanted this guy in the game and giving me action rather than pissed off, but after the hand he was complaining that I shorted him chips and then other people were saying he should have been penalized or had his hand killed.

So what’s the actual rule that applies here?

Casino & cardroom poker

It was probably your own fault. Stack your chips like a human or count out the bet yourself. Or don't be such a schmuck and tell him not to touch your chips and the dealer will do it.

Nobody besides you or the dealer should be touching your chips. Next time someone starts fondling your chips, stop him.

Ive never heard of any room where someones hand was killed for touching another players chips. That's ridiculous. At least in a cash game.

yea that's def not allowed ; dealer should take control but I've never seen a player attempt that before lol

LOL you serious bro? Do you ever have anything positive to say in this forum? Don't bother to reply/you're now on my blocked list so I won't see it. I'm sure it's a long list......

Correct form for such questions. I'll move it.

There is no penalty in the hand, but if called a floor should instruct the player to never touch another player's chips, or chips in the pot. If you think you were stolen from, call the floor and have him check the tape.

But yes, it is better form to bet in clear amounts and stack sizes that don't require the dealer to restack and count, if possible.

As soon as you made your bet, and after you pushed your bet across the betting line, the chips were no longer yours.

Well, that's certainly technically correct, but is no where near the point.

I don't think he was implying that he still had ownership of the chips, but that stack absolutely represented action attributed to him. Another player manipulating that stack could confuse the issue or allow outright theft. At the very least, it can create procedural confusion.

They certainly don't belong to his opponent.
Only the dealer or the player who bet them should be touching chips.

OP, stack them where they are easier to count?

what kind of room is this where the dealer lets this kind of thing happen? Most legit tables don't want you to touch chips after pushing them forward , let alone some other buffoon in the hand. Dealer/floor "connected" to a reg maybe?

Agree definitely not the point. But I thought technically chips are not in the pot until the bet is called.

the rule that applies is "one dealer to a table"

This has happened to me a few times while dealing, either on a 2/5 NL game between 2 regs, or a 5/5 PLO game, again all regs. Actually just a few days ago it happened on a 5/5 PLO game, guy bets a little over 700 with 7 black in there. Other player in the pot knocks the stack over so it splashes to count for himself what is there (they were sitting side by side). Honestly I didn't care, it saves me a reach, and the two players in the pot were regs who play together all the time, so neither of them care.

I to see it a lot by regs

one will breakdown the others bet then put out chips to match the stacks for the call.

dealers let it go but they shouldn't
then they do it to the fish and it pisses them off and they leave.

BUT the dealer always confirms pot correct before proceeding

Need more here ... but

I've done my fair share of 'Dealer assistance' in my days and have pretty much weened it out of my system. This is very game/Dealer/room dependent.

You should never really 'volunteer' your chip stacking services unless someone has asked or it's your action. This can turn into a very tedious spot, especially in a tournament where 'information' is supposed to be offered only upon request.

Most of the others have gotten this spot on .. GL

Either way, the other player shouldn't be handling them.

Overall it's really not a big deal.

Players shouldn't be doing it frequently but if you're in a game where a lot of players are playing with each other all the time, especially in a small card room or in a more casual environment, it's not unusual for someone to grab a couple chips to post someone's blind who isn't paying attention to keep the game moving, or to take a stack of chips that's been pushed in and break it down to see how much it is. They could ask the dealer to do this for them instead but honestly that just amounts to slowing the game down or giving the dealer extra scut work.

There's no way you can kill someone's hand for doing that if he hasn't been warned already not to. If it's irksome to that particular table or you personally just bring it up with the dealer and if the dealer doesn't take it seriously and you care about it ask the dealer to call the floor.

I normally arrange my own chips in a countable fashion before moving them in and if they don't recognize how much it is I'll topple a stack so they can count it easier myself, or I'll verbalize the amounts if it's going to take me a while to set things up.

It's worth it to keep casual players happy and playing the game. There's almost no risk of someone palming chips in 99.99% of games. And live play goes slowly enough. Whatever speeds things along and keeps people happy should come ahead of arcanum.

I'm very surprised the dealer didn't stop this guy right away. At my cardroom this is strictly enforced - dealer counts the bet/raise, and tells player what it is.

Nobody cares about the little things like another player throwing in someone's blind when the player's not paying attention, or making change for someone's blind, ex. someone throws in a 5 for the blind at 1/2 and the player beside makes change with 1s.

But touching a stack of someone's chips in the middle? Big no-no.

If I am putting an away player's blinds in, I make eye contact with the dealer first, then show my hand palm up afterwards. Maybe excessive, but I don't think it is appropriate to just start jacking with someone elses stack

If I am going to make change for someone's blind, and I don't know them, I hold the change out first and try to make eye contact first or ask them if they want change (some people are very picky about guys touching their chips. As there have been cases, rare, where people are sure they posted, but the pot is short)

I would never ever jack with someone's stack that has been bet. Not only is there a chance that i can foul the stack and create a situation, I am not going to do anything that could influence action, and counting out a bet could do that.

100% agree. It is in the pot or it is mine. But for sure it is not his.

Where I play the dealers would never let a player break down another players stacks to count them. They are so strict about not touching other players chips that I was actually surprised to see how many responses were from people who play where that is considered no big deal. It's a huge no no where I play. That's one of the things I enjoy about this forum, seeing how other rooms do things.

Ehh, while touching someone else chips is generally not advised, I dont think its severe as this thread is making it out to be. In particular, touching someone's else bet or minor repositioning of a stack when someone is matching a stack of chips by calling is really a no harm, no foul scenario to me, it can also be quicker than getting the dealer involved. This of course assumes clear visibility and a neater stack to begin with. When we talk about larger denomination chips, really big bets or jumbles not handling is clearly the better option.

Situations like putting out someone's blind or pushing the money into the middle when out of reach of the dealer are situationally acceptable at the table, so is returning displaced chips that rolled or fell.