What makes a poker player different?
09-04-2021
, 10:50 PM
09-05-2021
, 05:25 AM
09-07-2021
, 09:18 PM
Quote:
There is something about us that doesnÂ’t click with the rest of society. There is a mix of reactions when a non-poker player finds out you play poker. Some are impressed, others look at you like a degenerate.
Almost all of them are surprised by the amount of money that is won and lost over the course of an afternoon at even the lowest stakes live games. Many will express surprise at the thought of winning/losing $500 in a night, and bewilderment or disbelief at the notion that this is “just another day at the poker tables”
Where does this chasm of difference come from? How do our brains disconnect from the reality of what we are doing on a hand by hand basis? $500 will buy both of us (the poker player and the non poker player) the same amount of goods/services, but a poker player wonÂ’t blink as he watches a pot that large (or larger, by orders of magnitude) get shipped to their opponent. They will reach into their pocket, pull out five more black (or purple, or orange) chips, and continue playing the game like nothing happened.
But this is a necessary part of becoming a good poker player. Being able to separate our emotions from the value of what we are playing with. We cannot make proper decisions at the table if we are thinking about what else we could be doing with the money we are piling into the pot. How is this done? Why does it happen? What differentiates us from “normal people” in allowing our brains to disassociate from the value of the chips we risk on a regular basis?
Perhaps IÂ’ve been drinking too much whiskey tonight. For now, I reach back into my pocket for five more black chips, and play another hand.
Almost all of them are surprised by the amount of money that is won and lost over the course of an afternoon at even the lowest stakes live games. Many will express surprise at the thought of winning/losing $500 in a night, and bewilderment or disbelief at the notion that this is “just another day at the poker tables”
Where does this chasm of difference come from? How do our brains disconnect from the reality of what we are doing on a hand by hand basis? $500 will buy both of us (the poker player and the non poker player) the same amount of goods/services, but a poker player wonÂ’t blink as he watches a pot that large (or larger, by orders of magnitude) get shipped to their opponent. They will reach into their pocket, pull out five more black (or purple, or orange) chips, and continue playing the game like nothing happened.
But this is a necessary part of becoming a good poker player. Being able to separate our emotions from the value of what we are playing with. We cannot make proper decisions at the table if we are thinking about what else we could be doing with the money we are piling into the pot. How is this done? Why does it happen? What differentiates us from “normal people” in allowing our brains to disassociate from the value of the chips we risk on a regular basis?
Perhaps IÂ’ve been drinking too much whiskey tonight. For now, I reach back into my pocket for five more black chips, and play another hand.
Poker can "click in society". As soon as I started looking for a job, I put it in my CV (No job ever, so yeah, kinda had to put something to explain the late education). If you kinda know what you're doing, you're also able to speak about it in terms that will resonate with your audience. You adapt to your opponent. Obviously, some people will not be permeable to the idea or allegories. But that's probably people you don't want to work with anyway. coincidentally, I am now in a pretty good position, and have an interview with a potential new hire who played poker professionally for 5 years (applied through LKin, I don't actually know him). And he is above average significantly on the tasks we gave him despite the lack of experience. Poker players are not special, those who make a success of it (to some extent), often have other qualities to offer (for instance, analysis, synthesis, data oriented jobs or even marketing or sales).
I have to give you a point when it comes to the money. My friends and family don't have a problem with the game itself or me playing it to make money. However, we just don't talk about amounts anymore, except maybe sometimes with very close friends. And even then, we only talk about specific hands. With my parents, I never talk about hands, only the bottom line. And even then, I have to lie because they freak out so fast if they think it is too much. They truly think people are going to kidnap me.
I think amounts are the biggest hurdle. As much as people want not to judge, or understand that you are winning money, there is a mental barrier with amounts. If you play 10/20, a 20K pot might not be that unusual. But to the regular person, they will never understand unless you're literally making bank (and even then, I am willing to bet you'll get the "I am worried about you, what if you lose?" discussion at some point). Similarly, online, winning 10K a month at 1/2 is nothing insane if you play for a living. But try and tell your parents about that 2.4K pot you won against a whale, I can assure you they'll get worried somehow
This mental barrier gets completely shattered when you play poker (or gamble) for a long time.
On one side : most compulsive players chase a high, and that is why the losses grow crescendo. The stakes they used to play at don't excite them as much. They want to play higher, they want to feel that high.
On the other : grinders just get used to it because there is no way around it. if you're making an average of 10K of month, you can afford to suffer through a week or two losing a significant amount of money. If you play for a living, you NEED to be comfortable with the amount you are playing. You need to be aware of the possibility of a loss and be OK with it.
tldr; it's all about getting used to the amount or chasing, depending on what type of poker player you are. Or a bit of both
I guess I'll also address the fact that I quit playing for a living. I guess it kind of reduces my credibility. To be completely honest about it, I realized I was not mature enough to handle my own schedule. Thought my studies where holding me down, when they provided some form of line to follow. I stopped to focus on poker, and played less in two years than I would when studying for 2 semesters. I was too young, it was not as much about poker as much as it was about me not being ready to be an adult without ever living the life of someone who actually works hard for close to nothing in returns, whether it be enjoyment or payment.
Last edited by howbathat; 09-07-2021 at 09:46 PM.
09-07-2021
, 10:10 PM
Quote:
Imo, it is that is there is a very fine line between skill and degeneracy. The game itself relies on degens to start tables and feed the others. It also transpires into the way people perceive poker players. It's not only about you, it's also about the perception of somebody who knows nothing about the game but what they were told. Poker is full of winning players on a 1.6M hands downswing., it does not help with credibility either.
Poker can "click in society". As soon as I started looking for a job, I put it in my CV (No job ever, so yeah, kinda had to put something to explain the late education). If you kinda know what you're doing, you're also able to speak about it in terms that will resonate with your audience. You adapt to your opponent. Obviously, some people will not be permeable to the idea or allegories. But that's probably people you don't want to work with anyway. coincidentally, I am now in a pretty good position, and have an interview with a potential new hire who played poker professionally for 5 years (applied through LKin, I don't actually know him). And he is above average significantly on the tasks we gave him despite the lack of experience. Poker players are not special, those who make a success of it (to some extent), often have other qualities to offer (for instance, analysis, synthesis, data oriented jobs or even marketing or sales).
I have to give you a point when it comes to the money. My friends and family don't have a problem with the game itself or me playing it to make money. However, we just don't talk about amounts anymore, except maybe sometimes with very close friends. And even then, we only talk about specific hands. With my parents, I never talk about hands, only the bottom line. And even then, I have to lie because they freak out so fast if they think it is too much. They truly think people are going to kidnap me.
I think amounts are the biggest hurdle. As much as people want not to judge, or understand that you are winning money, there is a mental barrier with amounts. If you play 10/20, a 20K pot might not be that unusual. But to the regular person, they will never understand unless you're literally making bank (and even then, I am willing to bet you'll get the "I am worried about you, what if you lose?" discussion at some point). Similarly, online, winning 10K a month at 1/2 is nothing insane if you play for a living. But try and tell your parents about that 2.4K pot you won against a whale, I can assure you they'll get worried somehow
This mental barrier gets completely shattered when you play poker (or gamble) for a long time.
On one side : most compulsive players chase a high, and that is why the losses grow crescendo. The stakes they used to play at don't excite them as much. They want to play higher, they want to feel that high.
On the other : grinders just get used to it because there is no way around it. if you're making an average of 10K of month, you can afford to suffer through a week or two losing a significant amount of money. If you play for a living, you NEED to be comfortable with the amount you are playing. You need to be aware of the possibility of a loss and be OK with it.
tldr; it's all about getting used to the amount or chasing, depending on what type of poker player you are. Or a bit of both
I guess I'll also address the fact that I quit playing for a living. I guess it kind of reduces my credibility. To be completely honest about it, I realized I was not mature enough to handle my own schedule. Thought my studies where holding me down, when they provided some form of line to follow. I stopped to focus on poker, and played less in two years than I would when studying for 2 semesters. I was too young, it was not as much about poker as much as it was about me not being ready to be an adult without ever living the life of someone who actually works hard for close to nothing in returns, whether it be enjoyment or payment.
Poker can "click in society". As soon as I started looking for a job, I put it in my CV (No job ever, so yeah, kinda had to put something to explain the late education). If you kinda know what you're doing, you're also able to speak about it in terms that will resonate with your audience. You adapt to your opponent. Obviously, some people will not be permeable to the idea or allegories. But that's probably people you don't want to work with anyway. coincidentally, I am now in a pretty good position, and have an interview with a potential new hire who played poker professionally for 5 years (applied through LKin, I don't actually know him). And he is above average significantly on the tasks we gave him despite the lack of experience. Poker players are not special, those who make a success of it (to some extent), often have other qualities to offer (for instance, analysis, synthesis, data oriented jobs or even marketing or sales).
I have to give you a point when it comes to the money. My friends and family don't have a problem with the game itself or me playing it to make money. However, we just don't talk about amounts anymore, except maybe sometimes with very close friends. And even then, we only talk about specific hands. With my parents, I never talk about hands, only the bottom line. And even then, I have to lie because they freak out so fast if they think it is too much. They truly think people are going to kidnap me.
I think amounts are the biggest hurdle. As much as people want not to judge, or understand that you are winning money, there is a mental barrier with amounts. If you play 10/20, a 20K pot might not be that unusual. But to the regular person, they will never understand unless you're literally making bank (and even then, I am willing to bet you'll get the "I am worried about you, what if you lose?" discussion at some point). Similarly, online, winning 10K a month at 1/2 is nothing insane if you play for a living. But try and tell your parents about that 2.4K pot you won against a whale, I can assure you they'll get worried somehow
This mental barrier gets completely shattered when you play poker (or gamble) for a long time.
On one side : most compulsive players chase a high, and that is why the losses grow crescendo. The stakes they used to play at don't excite them as much. They want to play higher, they want to feel that high.
On the other : grinders just get used to it because there is no way around it. if you're making an average of 10K of month, you can afford to suffer through a week or two losing a significant amount of money. If you play for a living, you NEED to be comfortable with the amount you are playing. You need to be aware of the possibility of a loss and be OK with it.
tldr; it's all about getting used to the amount or chasing, depending on what type of poker player you are. Or a bit of both
I guess I'll also address the fact that I quit playing for a living. I guess it kind of reduces my credibility. To be completely honest about it, I realized I was not mature enough to handle my own schedule. Thought my studies where holding me down, when they provided some form of line to follow. I stopped to focus on poker, and played less in two years than I would when studying for 2 semesters. I was too young, it was not as much about poker as much as it was about me not being ready to be an adult without ever living the life of someone who actually works hard for close to nothing in returns, whether it be enjoyment or payment.
11-22-2021
, 06:36 PM
12-08-2021
, 01:58 AM
i dont think of losing or winning a 500$ stack in a vacuum. i just inherently see it as an investment im leveraging, and just a small chunk of a variance graph that's +ev
i know when i play plo5 im going on a 2k swing, but in the end ill NET 10$ profit
so its all worth it
i think the disconnect is just people who look at the numbers and understand stats/investing, and people who know about their uncle who's addicted to pills and lost the house on blackjack
I have yet to meet anyone in real life who seems even remotely impressed, most people just react like I'm bragging to them about running a successful drug dealing business or being a carny
so ya.. the statistically enlightened vs the ignorant
i know when i play plo5 im going on a 2k swing, but in the end ill NET 10$ profit
so its all worth it
i think the disconnect is just people who look at the numbers and understand stats/investing, and people who know about their uncle who's addicted to pills and lost the house on blackjack
I have yet to meet anyone in real life who seems even remotely impressed, most people just react like I'm bragging to them about running a successful drug dealing business or being a carny
so ya.. the statistically enlightened vs the ignorant
Last edited by LordPallidan12; 12-08-2021 at 02:06 AM.