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Variance and My Wife Variance and My Wife

07-11-2019 , 09:45 AM
I'm a winning player in my underground, low-rake game (10 percent off the buy-in plus a tip of $1-2). But I am not able to beat the rake in the casino, which is taking $10-$20 per hour from my pots (tip and promotion included). One of my main weaknesses, maybe even the main one, is my low tolerance for variance. That low tolerance makes me err on the side of being a too much of a nit. I play my premium hands aggressively preflop--not a bad thing--but with grey hair and a kind demeanor, observant players just fold (fortunately, there are plenty of fish). I'm also hesitant to play hands with good implied odds against maniacs and bad players on tilt because I'm too scared to risk my stack with mediocre hands.

My low tolerance has to do with my wife. I have a good job and plenty of money for retirement and my son's college education. I do not care when I lose my stack, I understand that is part of poker, and I never go on tilt. I don't mind losing. And I know that winning a lot of the time has to do with just hitting the right cards. But I dread, absolutely dread telling my wife.

At first, she was alarmed when I told her I lost $300, now she is sort of ok with it and trusts that I am a good player, but still gets a bit nervous, and I limit myself to $300 per week. But to become a winning player, I have to be able to tell her I lost a lot more than that. Some people say just don't tell her. And indeed whether I win or lose, I don't tell her...unless she asks. One of the qualities of all gambling addicts is that they lie to their loved ones about their losings.

Any advice?
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07-11-2019 , 06:59 PM
Could the two of you just agree on an overall poker budget for you, and then agree that you aren't going to tell her one way or the other how each individual session goes? Have her treat it like one long session (which is the right mentality generally).
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07-12-2019 , 02:14 AM
If she asks tell her the truth that you lost x amount of money.
If she asks tell her the truth that you won x amount of money.

Don't tell her if she doesn't ask how much you won or lost.

ask her about her day when you get home from playing cards. also don't do what mike did in the movie rounders lol. If you quit playing cards because of your wife that's plain stupid.

Just don't lie dude. that's worse than losing a million dollars.

Last edited by R3M0T3; 07-12-2019 at 02:22 AM.
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07-12-2019 , 08:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by R3M0T3
If you quit playing cards because of your wife that's plain stupid.
This is way overly simplistic, especially in a hobby where financial variance is real. If it causes her that much anxiety, I could see the justification for stopping. I will say it's probably not necessary in this case though.
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07-12-2019 , 11:16 AM
Set aside an amount of money you are comfortable gambling with for a longer period of time (6 months to a year) and agree not to use any other funds for this. $5000 per year is less than $300 a week and if you go busto, you probably shouldn't be playing more anyway.

The other alternative is to buy in short for these games. This may free yourself up to play the more aggressive style you believe is correct.
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07-12-2019 , 08:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by recondite7
Set aside an amount of money you are comfortable gambling with for a longer period of time (6 months to a year) and agree not to use any other funds for this. $5000 per year is less than $300 a week and if you go busto, you probably shouldn't be playing more anyway.

The other alternative is to buy in short for these games. This may free yourself up to play the more aggressive style you believe is correct.
This. It will be even better if you could do some part-time gig, take some overtime at work and take out that money for a separate poker account that way - so it is not coming from what your wife views as your family's primary income. If she needs additional explaining you can always mention that your poker budget is less than many guys' golf/hunting budget.

2) I do not think it is necessarily bad to lie a little bit. I would use the following scale:
Finish the session within +100/-100: Broke even
Won $100/Lost $100: Won a hundred/Lost a hundred
Won anything above $200: Won a couple hundred (whether its $200 or $700)
Lost anything above $200: Lost a couple hundred (whether its $200 or $700)

3) Another thing you need to be cognizant of is your mood. Make sure you are not upset/down when you come home after a losing session (remember its your entertainment activity). Women are usually good in catching those things.
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07-14-2019 , 10:44 PM
Tell her to mind her own business. Jk, i know they can't, but i think buying in short is a good solution.
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07-15-2019 , 11:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chicagodude
Tell her to mind her own business. Jk, i know they can't, but i think buying in short is a good solution.
I really don't think this is the answer. This is just going to cause it to be more likely that he loses his whole buy in in the session.
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07-15-2019 , 02:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WehrmatsWormhat
I really don't think this is the answer. This is just going to cause it to be more likely that he loses his whole buy in in the session.
More likely to lose a buyin that is much smaller - yes.

More likely to lose as big a part of his roll in a given night - no.

The main reason to not buy in short is because the hourly rate for a good player will be higher. OP seems to be playing scared with a full stack so this would also likely up his hourly rate.

Almost any good or bad player is not going to lose more $ per session buying in short though.
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07-16-2019 , 01:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by recondite7
More likely to lose a buyin that is much smaller - yes.

More likely to lose as big a part of his roll in a given night - no.

The main reason to not buy in short is because the hourly rate for a good player will be higher. OP seems to be playing scared with a full stack so this would also likely up his hourly rate.

Almost any good or bad player is not going to lose more $ per session buying in short though.
Eh, playing short is a bit of a different animal than playing with a full stack. I think there's more of a difference there than just winning a bit less.
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07-28-2019 , 03:17 PM
Show her the books, so to speak. My wife had some difficulty with me losing a buy in, but once I explained my bankroll and showed her how I was using my winnings (retirement and debt reduction) she was happier. Now she just leaves me to it and doesn’t really ask.
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07-28-2019 , 05:33 PM
Your wife is just like the other poker players. They want to get a read off of you so that they can make a decision of how they want to respond. Keep a poker face and confidently go all in because you know it doesn't matter if you win or lose, because you always win in the long run.

And when you are heads-up against your wife, keep a poker face and confidently go all in with love, joy and smiles. She just wants to know that you have a plan or budget for how much money you could potentially lose. Tell her you don't like how it makes you feel when you have to tell her that you lost money. Instead tell her, "my poker session was super boring, until John started laughing and spit his beer all over the guy next to him.......after todays session, my poker bankroll is at $4,700" maybe you guys agree to a $5k starting bankroll.

Make up some funny poker stories that you can tell her when you get home and before long she won't care about the bankroll.
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08-09-2019 , 09:04 PM
Variance and my wife lol that is a clickbait title.
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08-10-2019 , 01:20 AM
Teach her the game.

Go play 2-4, 3-6 or 2-4-6 with you.

Play as well as you can in those games.

Don't tilt, have fun. Explain to her that the objective is to get her card savy enough to play a tourney.

Hope her first tourney, she goes deep. Or, sees you go deep! Either way, you will be good. If you both flame out early, pray you play with nice people.
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08-10-2019 , 01:22 AM
And, never lie. Be honest.

If you are playing scared to tell her, you will play bad and guarantee a loss.
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08-10-2019 , 01:26 AM
Boba Fett might ban me for 3 low content posts in a row, but it is important.

Get her to play.

If she has no interest, play your best.

Don't tie immediate wins to your ability to play later. You might run bad. Just tell her you love her, it is a hobby, not a career, and you want her support.

If she doesn't giver her support, just quit. Life will be better.
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08-14-2019 , 01:33 AM
You shouldn't have to lie to your wife about your poker situation. Its just going to make you feel guilty and it will effect your poker play having that burden on your shoulders. If she finds out her way without you telling her trust me its gonna be a lot worst for you. She wont trust you anymore. If you told her your threshold is 300 then you better only play 300. If its going to be 600 tell her. SAy hey I am going to start using 600 cause that way i can play longer and the longer I play i get an edge. You have to explain why your doing it too. If she doesn't like it to bad its your money its your decision not hers. But she will at least respect the fact you were being honest.
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08-16-2019 , 10:20 AM
Sounds like you are about as responsible as you could get for a gambler, not risking money you need for something else, and keeping retirement and college funded.
You also say you are a winning player, at least in your local underground game.

Do you keep records?
Do you keep records in one of the many available dummy proof easy to record poker logging apps? ( I use poker analytics on iphone)
If so, Log your sessions for, say, 6 months.
Then allow the lady to have a look at it, and go through and look at your results, she will see that some days you lost 300 dollars, sometimes you lost 300 dollars for 6 session in a row, but overall when you play you are making x.xx$ per hour, so win or lose, the amount of I made 300 or lost 300 in a night doesn't mean as much, she understands you're making around 10$( for example a random number) per hour overall.

I let my partner view all my data every couple months or whatever, she knows I may be going on downswings, and occasionally I have lost from half to close to a years worth of her salary in a week before, but overall over the past Y years I am making $xx.xx per hour. Helps me explain to people ( who are capable of conceptualizing things in the long term at least) the variance of poker and that winning or losing in the short term doesn't really matter, without them having to actually understand anything about how to play poker themselves.
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09-16-2019 , 02:38 PM
I don't have anything to add other then: A+ thread title.

Jokes aside, I don't see what the problem is as long as you:

A) Win at Poker

B) Don't put your family's financial security at jeopardy

C) Don't lie to your wife

If all the above is true, your wife should not have an issue with you playing poker.
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09-17-2019 , 06:40 PM
Just don't quit til you're even. Duh....
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09-19-2019 , 06:08 PM
I didn’t read this thread through, but I would just say to her ‘I love what I do, i need to honor my passion for this thing, sometimes I will lose.’ That’s what I did. If you can put together a sample people really understand the visual rep of variance through a graph

I would also consider playing online where you can really put a few hundred bucks to good use, and play enough volume to overcome variance and actually realize an edge + improve along the way through sheer reps

PS: we all hate telling our loved ones about losses, bcz nobody but poker players really understand the variance associated. Mostly I just keep losses a secret

Last edited by +EVillain; 09-19-2019 at 06:16 PM.
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09-20-2019 , 07:05 AM
In all seriousness, it's probably best if neither she nor you think about how much you are up or down in a single session. If she asks how you did tell her your results over the past year. "I'm up $10k so far this year" is a lot more important than a few hundred in either direction in a given night.
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