I have a big gambling problem. I had built my bankroll playing 0.05$ short deck poker. I had strict rules to follow bankroll management, and move down if i lost 5 buyins when taking a shot at 0.1$, but i could not control myself enough to move down, went on tilt after a couple bad beats and blew my whole bankroll.

I am not looking for a complete cure of my addiction (it has some positive sides aswell) and its not possible. However I was wondering if it possible to develop enough selfcontrol to follow simple bankroll management plan while beeing addicted to gambling? If so, how?

I am in therapy but they dont want to help me control it they just want me to quit.

It is quite unfortunate but GA is arguably the hardest addiction to control. Find out whether it is substance abuse related (yes, caffeine is a substance) and ween yourself off the substance. Your other options are finding other passions in life and making changes to your lifestyle, which means finding other activities that you can enjoy/dedicate time to that isn't gambling.

If you replace gambling with alcohol in your statement, do you think you sound stupid?

Don't play poker for the money. Don't be thinking all the time that you can move up the limits and buy a lambo or whatever.

No? Gambling addiction is a behavioral disorder/disease, alcohol addiction is a substance abuse disorder. I'm saying that alcohol and caffeine can be directly related, and the cause of, a gambling problem.

For some people, gambling stimulates the brain in the same way that drugs can affect certain people. No one should encourage an alcoholic trying to come up with a way to drink in a controlled fashion. Alcoholics should generally quit drinking. Gambling addicts arguably should quit gambling altogether.

I do agree with this.

Bet on banker.

watch brandi love or sara jay instead.

Ask the therapist about food addiction. Do you have to quit eating in order to treat it? Obviously not. Same thing. They need to understand that you are not playing against a negative expectation, in effect giving your money away. There is a difference between degenerate losing gambling and needing discipline. Tell'em I said so. LOL.

Agreed. That's the hard truth.

Plus the language of OP shows he'll never get it under control. He made these 'strict rules' to follow, then blows past them. Also mentions there are positives to this mindset, which ofc he doesn't list because they're bs.

What is the evidence underpinning this assumption?

I'm too lazy to site the specific sources, but if you dig around you'll find peer reviewed studies correlating caffeine & GA. From my own experience with GA, I know that caffeine, especially high does from coffee, keeps me deep in GA. There is also a reason why all casino's have coffee shops, a lot of them having a Starbucks at the very entrance. Gotta keep those OMC's hooked!

Where I live, Starbucks is all over the place, and if you add in other coffee shops, they're everywhere, and I go to them often.

I think the main reason casinos have coffee places, and they're not all Starbucks, is that they're popular among casino customers just liek they're popular with people not in casinos. Also, in most cases, the coffee shops, just like many other casino stores, are leased properties. That is, as the business owner, if you're willing to pay the rent, you get the shop. I don't think the idea that drinking caffeine will encourage people to gamble has much to do with the placement of coffee shops, even if this is correct.

Best wishes,
Mason

Correlational studies are fairly meaningless in this example. People who are addicted to gambling (and indeed other addictions) tend to be poor at life generally: they tend to have poor diets, exercise less, drink more alcohol, and yes perhaps they drink more coffee than average.

Perfect case of correlation not equalling causation.

Also, what Mason said. Coffee in casinos probably helps people gamble for longer - that's why they serve it free in casinos in the UK.

Hi Elrazor:

Coffee is free in Las Vegas casinos as long as you're gambling. Some poker rooms, such as the Southpoint, which has a 30 table room that (currently) between their cash games and tournaments they fill up on most days, has a free coffee dispenser where anyone playing or waiting can get a cup of coffee.

I alsways viewed the free alchol drinks as an inducement to gamble and never thought of coffee that way. But perhaps it is, and for those poker players who like to put in marathon sessions (which I never do), it may help to keep them at the table.

Best wishes,
Mason

Hi kalledabaws:

I've always been of the opinion that as long as you're able to win at gambling, being addicted to it isn't the worse thing. It'll just mean that you'll spend to much time in the casino or poker room and miss out on many good things that life has to offer.

As for a bankroll management plan, the main thing you need to know is not to play too large relative to your bankroll. However, you seem to be having other problems such as going on tilt. I suspect that the best thing you could do is to improve your knowledge of what I call "all things poker," and this includes strategy, variance, and why things based on probability theory can often appear counter-intuitive. I suspect, and someone like Elrazor can certainly give you better advice than me, that improving your knowledge (of poker) can help you solve your issues unless you have deeper mental issues which I have little understanding of.

Best wishes,
Mason

This sounds rather contradictory. Especially if you have family/loved ones.

It’s not the worst thing, you just miss out on birthdays, holidays, major life events, day to day quality time together, getting to know each other, seeing the world, helping others, finding profound meaning in your life, spiritual endeavors, etc. But hey, at least you’re a winning player!

Gambling addiction is destructive to your life. Even if you can make a financial living through it, which incredibly few actually do especially over the long run, dismissing it as though it isn’t that bad because you only miss out on many things life has to offer, especially in a thread where the OP states he has a big gambling problem, is irresponsible.

I’ve been around poker/gambling for a long time and have known a number of addicted gamblers who were also winning players. And while they certainly had problems at times, I never observed the type of misery that you describe.

However, it’s also my opinion that most addicted gamblers are also losers, and they do have many of the problems you describe.

Best wishes,
Mason

For the ones who you don’t think had those problems (you might be surprised at what was likely happening behind closed doors), how many were saying they were in treatment for it?

My point is, OP is saying he is in treatment for what is a destructive gambling addiction and is clearly so addicted he can’t even fathom quitting. So he came here to find someone to support him going against his therapist’s recommendations and goals of treatment by finding a way to maintain his addiction.

I mean no disrespect to you and I believe your heart is in the right place by suggesting he just needs to get better at gambling to make it work, but that type of advice is potentially very counterproductive to the therapeutic process. It’d be like telling an alcoholic in AA to study viticulture and get a job in a winery rather than quit drinking alcohol.

This depends on whether he has a gambling addiction or is a skilled player with a discipline problem, does it not? I will reread OP's description but as I remember it, well I'll check it. If a person has an eating disorder, the redress is eating with discipline, not quitting food. Similar situation if the player can play with an edge.

** Okay I reread it. It doesn't sound promising or that there is any reason to believe OP is playing with an edge. Yes: quit. Do something you are better qualified for and take the cure on "gambling."

The analogy of eating doesn't really apply as it's a biological need to eat. If you stop eating, you starve to death. If you quit poker, nothing happens at all.

Yes it applies. Addiction to food and addiction to gambling have much common ground (as do all addictions). Biologically needing food to live is a separate issue entirely. The point is the fact that you need food to survive makes it a perfect illustration that the solution to addiction is not necessarily cessation ... and can't be.

Sooooo......alcoholics should be encouraged to continue to drink? Because it “can’t be” cessation for some reason?

Sir the best cure for your addiction is to find a more meaningful outlet for it. The biggest lie of poker is the idea that it's a game where individual skill can be great enough to overcome the luck factor regardless of which part of it you fall into. Most people here will hate this, but it's simply not true. Between the variability and margin of error possible in your assumed skill, the huge amount of standard deviation in poker (luck spectrum), and the unbelievable damage the rake has on a player's winrate, trying to take this game seriously is a fool's errand for just about everyone. Would this forum exist if the amount of losers didn't greatly outweigh the number of winners?

Also, don't beat yourself up over not stepping down in limits. There's a very real problem present with stepping down and the game as a whole. Poker is very hard work that demands alot of hours, yet you are statistically likely to see a negative result for that time. If that drives you insane, GOOD!! It should, because people are not meant to throw their time and labor away like that.

When your therapist says you should quit, I don't know their reasoning so I can't speak to whether that's appropriate. I will say as someone who used to play a ton and who just gave up coaching others that I think you should quit because your time and labor can be put into many other sectors of society that will yield a far more positive outcome. Poker isn't a golden goose anymore. It's a waste of time. Every hour you get screwed by variance could be an hour building a resume, a business, a home that has resale value, a portfolio. The list goes on and on. So your loss is twofold every time the game kicks you in the nuts.

My point is you can use that assumed addiction and turn it into an advantage instead of a source of misery. Channel it into another interest with a positive ROI. I used to feel like you ya know. Then I found public office and politics. I still play from time to time casually, but the allure of this game is pretty diminished now compared to a career where I earn far more, is more stable, more fulfilling, and the ROI only continues to grow. I couldn't go back to the grinding days now if you held a gun to my head. I need that time to outwork my opposition in office, connect with voters, and fight for legislation that isn't garbage. The more good I do, the more my life bankroll seems to grow. Find whatever it is out there that does that for you. You won't care about this game anymore.