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the Distraction of Possible Cheating the Distraction of Possible Cheating

08-16-2018 , 03:09 PM
Especially online, it just seems so likely that there is all kinds of cheating going on making winning seem impossible. Collusion, super-users (your hole cards being seen), teams of players, software being hacked and future boards known. I'm even starting to wonder if my local casino poker room has any cheating. That is awful because I've come to count on the fact that the casino games should be the safest in town.

The possibility of being cheated is a constant and hugely detrimental distraction while playing. Does anyone agree? What to do?
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08-16-2018 , 05:45 PM
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What to do?
Not play?

(or open your own site that doesn't cheat)
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08-17-2018 , 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Max Jam

The possibility of being cheated is a constant and hugely detrimental distraction while playing. Does anyone agree? What to do?
The possibility of being cheated is constant. Just as is the possibility of being in a car accident every time you drive, or being poisoned every time you eat food from a restaurant. Are those huge distractions to you?

I have played online for years, and have known it is possible that people are colluding. And when I play I don't think about it at all. If I was really concerned about cheating I would not play.
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08-18-2018 , 02:24 PM
I would think that game selection would be important. If you suspect certain cheaters. Mark the players, don't play those tables. But if those reasons are that important to you then don't play online, only play live.
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08-19-2018 , 08:08 PM
I guess you could say that online poker means so much to me that I don't want to just not play.

I appreciate the replies so far.
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08-19-2018 , 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Max Jam
I guess you could say that online poker means so much to me that I don't want to just not play.

I appreciate the replies so far.
The simplest advice is valid whether you are concerned about cheating or not. It is just more important if you have a great concern about cheating.

Only play for stakes where it won't bother you if you lose. Then you can just play as much as you want and you don't have to be distracted by the chance that someone is cheating. Play your game and try not to think about anything but playing the best poker you can play.
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08-20-2018 , 03:25 AM
I don't want to accept being cheated in any game! Under any circumstance, for any reason.
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08-20-2018 , 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Max Jam
I don't want to accept being cheated in any game! Under any circumstance, for any reason.
I'm not saying you should accept being cheated. I think you shouldn't worry about being cheated when you are playing online because the probability is very low. But you do worry about it and think it is very high. If I thought it was very high, I wouldn't play. You think it is high and you have to play because it just means so much to you. I'm just saying that I would not risk much money if I thought there was a high probability of being cheated (I actually wouldn't risk any, but you would).
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08-20-2018 , 11:52 AM
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Only play for stakes where it won't bother you if you lose.
This

Anyways, if you're worried about being cheated online then the solution is obvious: play live at a casino.
OK, people can cheat you there, too, but it's a lot harder because they are on the spot. Then again: People can cheat you at the cashier at Wallmart. It's all about what kind of probability of being cheated you can accept.

Becoming paranoid about it...well..how exactly does that help?
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08-22-2018 , 12:07 AM
If you're using the crutch of feeling cheated after every losing session you will have trouble identifying the areas you need to work on to improve your own game. Online poker is tough to beat at any stakes theses days and accusing sites of cheating is a convenient cop out for a losing player.
The general consensus from intelligent players is that successful poker sites don't cheat the players. They earn plenty from the rake and it's in their best interest to run an honest game. Sure, there have been various instances of bad behaviour from sites, but the field in general isn't cheating you, and if you stay with the better known sites you're probably not being cheated.
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08-22-2018 , 01:35 PM
I wasn't really thinking about sites doing the cheating. However, it does seem extremely likely that other players online are doing all kinds of cheating.

I haven't been improving my game much at all while being stuck in micros (where even world class players have a hard time advancing to low stakes online). My difficulty due, in part, to being cheated and/or the distraction of that possibility.
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08-22-2018 , 05:42 PM
Why does it seem extremely likely that other players (in the micros) are doing all kinds of cheating? I'm guessing that the only evidence you have of that is that you can't win.

If the only other thing that keeps you from winning is the distraction of the possibility, then it means you are playing differently because you are afraid of the cheat. That is easy to solve. Don't change your game to adjust to cheaters - play the way you would if you didn't think there were cheaters. Because obviously your changes haven't worked, or you wouldn't be posting about it.

As for world class players having a hard time getting past the micros because of all the cheating - I'd love to see one example of such a player. Maybe our definitions of world class are different, but to me all world class players can beat the micros.
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08-22-2018 , 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by VBAces
Why does it seem extremely likely that other players (in the micros) are doing all kinds of cheating? I'm guessing that the only evidence you have of that is that you can't win.

If the only other thing that keeps you from winning is the distraction of the possibility, then it means you are playing differently because you are afraid of the cheat. That is easy to solve. Don't change your game to adjust to cheaters - play the way you would if you didn't think there were cheaters. Because obviously your changes haven't worked, or you wouldn't be posting about it.

As for world class players having a hard time getting past the micros because of all the cheating - I'd love to see one example of such a player. Maybe our definitions of world class are different, but to me all world class players can beat the micros.
I didn't say it is because of cheating that world class players have a hard time advancing from micros but, it could be a factor? Obviously rake is a factor.

Maybe I'm a bum? What exactly is bum-hunting?

I appreciate some of these comments and thoughts and hope others do too.

I don't have evidence of being cheated. The strange plays I've seen repeatedly that only make sense if the opps could see cards or know the cards dealt and/or board cards. Maybe a text list in a file of all the cards at the table? You could normally expect to have strange plays go against you sometimes and for you sometimes. But what if 95% of the strange plays you see go against you? Even stupid crap like when your AA walks literally 8 out of 10 times for a week at a time and one of the 2 times you get action its HU vs. T7 off and you get coolered. I don't care about AA that much but when you see that over and over, what would you think? These are tables where there is plenty of action but then AA, KK gets dealt and it just folds around a huge majority of the time, for days at a time. I know it happens but not 80% of the time for consecutive days at a time on action tables.

In online plo cash games there seems to be crews of 2+ players that just sit and wait for me to build up 200BB then the guy that has position on me waits and waits playing passively until that gross cooler hits. It makes me wonder if they wait for the time i have 1 out and their buddy folded that card. This has happened repeatedly. And its hard enough to get up to 200BB to begin with.

MTT teams, SNG teams. They could theoretically win a majority of any entire MTT prize pool, or an entire SNG prize pool.

I think the micros online are a comedy of cheating training lately. The higher the stakes the less detectable it would be as they learn. And I know there isn't much in it afa money to cheat at micros for money. But it could definitely be a training ground for learning and advancing in cheating; taking food off of people's tables. Micros could even be worthwhile for people in poorer countries? I hope this isn't the case. I'd be THRILLED if it was truth that online poker cheating doesn't happen!
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09-07-2018 , 01:04 AM
Crickets. Did I step out on a limb?
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