This is hopefully going to serve as a place for all the shills, apologists, and employees of Global Poker to congregate and answer any questions you guys might have about the current state of things. Not sure what category Mods fall into considering GP advertises on 2p2, but we will let them answer that.

Anyway, guys like splayaa and the like please feel free to assuage the community on any of the following topics:

1) Lying to the users about PayPal
2) Having the same fixable software issues going unchanged for months
3) 1 week+ reply time on client support tickets regarding cashouts
4) Inability for most users to deposit and not releasing any info as to the reason

There are obviously much more, but I'll stop right there for now.

Thanks for the @ mention. I am calling my mom right now to tell her that her dreams of me becoming marginally internet famous in an online poker forum have finally come true. She loses a lot of sleep at night for me in this but now her fears are assuaged.

To your questions,

1. Yep, they handeled the PayPal situation badly. I personally haven't seen out right lies as you say, but I can also understand people who think they were lied to, and perhaps some have been and I missed their posts. Still best case scenario they handled it badly and I think the reps would agree with that.

2. There are many glitches that have gone unfixed for more than a year. Others have been fixed. Keep in mind they rent the software. Cubeia is who actually owns it and my guess is they are limited to submitting trouble tickets themselves to the company who actually runs the software. So I do wish they would fix glitches, but I also understand they exist and take that into account personally when I play.

3. I can't speak to this personally as I am not currently trying to cashout. But based on the noise I have been seeing in the forums a week+ would not suprise me either. Were I wanting to cash out I would be considering this in my play at global as well.

4. I find this one the most interesting. Many players are seeing Global as a place that went down hill and is starting to just steal the money, but if this was the case, why not continue to allow deposits. To me it seems if this was the case Global would do everything in their power to make sure deposits are coming in. If I am going to kill the golden goose, I want her as fat as I can make her.

So in summary I will say what I always say of Global and ever investment you have ever or will ever make. Never ever take on more risk than your current situation will allow. This includes crypto currencies, bankroll management, buying a house, investing in a friend's business, being smart with your time... and on and on the list can go.

My $weeps Cash came from the original $2 and so the risk I feel is much different than others. But that is my situation. I have seen many people on here that the reason they are having such issues with Global isn't Global as much as it was they want it to be.

Instead they saw a chance to get rich quick, and it fell through. Much like all get rich plans do.

Always take on risk and investments wisely. In everything you do. Make informed decisions. And if the noise about deposits, or glitches or PayPal, keeps you from coming to Global or continuing on Global. Please, in a resonable manner, let these forums know.

For Global to make changes, they have to have reasonable reasons to do it. A lot of threads (including this one) take on a more accusatory tone which will not help things. It is people on the other sides of these keyboards, people with emotions. Treat everyone with respect.

You're definitely right about the way global is handling these situations, its not the best. And we do understand that the tone of the messages aimed at Global Poker is not the most friendly, but we as the player community are getting fed up and frustrated at how things are being handled.

As I've stated in my other posts, the real issue is communication. Sure, there are delays in cashouts, and sure there are problems with depositing. But where is Global Poker in addressing us directly on these problems? Getting replies in emails such as "We apologize for the delay, we will escalate this to our payment team" or "We apologize for the delay, we are experiencing teething problems" do nothing but demonstrate a certain level of incompetence, and its insulting.

We are treated as if we dont understand whats going on or cant handle the truth. All we are asking for is some transparency with the operations. Got a problem with the software? a problem with the new payment processor? Tell us the truth, dont give us half assed answers that dont really set our minds at ease.

Oh and specifically when speaking about cashouts, dont tell your customers that "Your funds will be deposited into your nominated bank within 5 days" When clearly you know you're having a problem clearing those funds. It makes Global Poker look like they dont care about us and are just telling us what we want to hear.

They did blatantly lie to us about paypal. When they were talking about looking at adding additional methods, and again when they forced players to "beta test" worldpay... Joey was in here posting that paypal wasn't going anywhere and they are just looking to add additional methods. This was clearly a lie.

To be fair to Joey, I don't think he knew he was lying, I think he was just providing the information he had at the time. But the company was lying through him for sure.

It's just as bad, though, that they are ignoring many of us now who cannot even play at all.

Can players not deposit right now? I keep getting an e-mail from them that says "free $weeps inside" but they want $20?

Right, and this is exactly my point. Perhaps I am too trusting, maybe that is my flaw. But I really don't like throwing around things like "they lied to us" unless there is very specific proof of it happening.

I think too often we get wrapped up in the internet rage train culture that surrounds us, we are ready to demonize everyone in any situation in which there is a chance things aren't on the level.

Of course you should watch what is happening, hence my advice about guarding your investments well.

But I also think there needs to be a piece of this discussion that says, "I am willing to give anyone trying to help the benefit of the doubt."

So again, has Global handled everything well. No, I would never say that. But I also can't say they have out and out lied to us.

And I would be willing to make a sizable (although unwinnable) bet that the leadership behind Joey knew losing PayPal was a possibility and maybe even a strong one, and also believed there was a chance they wouldn't so even in this still weren't lying when the said "PayPal isn't going anywhere"

The world we live in is a lot more grey than some people who make these posts want to believe. Complicated humans running complicated companies are on the other side of those keyboards. So as a reminder to us all, never explain with malice that which can be explained by incompetence and mistakes.

100% agree

Nothing complicated in how they handled it. I know Joey was not completely aware of the removal of PayPal, certainly in the beginning of the 'exciting' new option. Marketing/customer service/management 100% lied about the 'new option'. There is less than 0% chance they had a ten day test run, filled with problems, that determined they should drop PayPal for WP.

They continue to show lack of any sort of professionalism or player respect in not specifically and publicly address the current disaster. Making people wait for weeks on end while they claim to be working on the vending issue is utter bull****. If my clearing agent took more than a day or two to fix a problem I'd get rid of them. VGW will have a signed contract with WP. Failure to perform is a standard clause to end the agreement. It is incompetence and complacency that has left the issues unresolved. Whomever is making the decisions at the corporate level is a ungracious scumbag.

I really don't understand how Mason/2+2/mods can allow Global this sub-forum without addreasing the specific issues. It isn't ****ing brain surgery. Larry should get on the phone with WP and not hang up until it is fixed. If the problem is internal or legal, address the player base and be honest.

I'm curious as to how the ASX and ASIC will view this issue.

This. This is what I am trying to get people to do in these forums.

Take note those who want to see changes at Global (or any company for that matter) This is a well laid out argument that something at best very negligent was done, and perhaps worse. Use this as an example and steer clear of the "maybe someone is lying to us about their baby being born" bs that I have seen from other posters.

Thank you dewd for the logic you bring to the table and for being able to be passionate about this without being a lunatic. Your post sways my opinion for sure on what must have happened at the top, and I am with you, I doubt very seriously Joey or Kimbrly knew what was actually going on, but were told to say and not say certain things.

Keep up the great work.

Could you just have look at him over top of the cubical or thanked him over lunch at the Global cafeteria ?

I can't imagine how ****ing stupid someone has to be to think I'm somehow connected to Global. There is a Darwin Award in your future.

No one eats in the Global cafeteria, everybody brown bags it. #obvi

There is a subset of 2+2ers, and sometimes I fear it's growing, who seem to think there are only 2 camps any time there is an issue with a poker site - those with pitchforks, and those who obviously work for the site. Nothing in between.

I really hope this growing polarization we see online when it comes to pretty much every subject (poker sites, politics, and everything else) is simply reflective of the fact that it's so easy for those with extreme positions to jump in on every topic, and not that this is the way the general population is trending as well. One thing I know for sure - it makes online discussion pretty toxic, and sometimes pointless.

Yep! And even worse, I think people taking too strong a stance on either side simply weaken their arguments with their bias and the asinine claims that often follow. Hmmm...just like politics.

Lol, in the case above, there is a third camp. There is the group that can't read. I've done nothing but call out Global for their lack of professionalism and respect for the player and their monies. The internet allows for people to make empty claims without fear of personal exposure for being a bit dumb.

On a side note, Global is a paid advertiser here and they have a fairly serious issue going on. Their customer service has lowered the bar for online poker to an inconceivably dismal level. Just read back through the cash-out thread and you can see all the inane responses to simple questions like...where the hell is my money? VGW is a small company, their isn't a 100 departments to escalate a simple issue. Furthermore, they lied about the 'additional' option to deposit/withdraw. Larry or Nigel can get on the phone with their World Pay equivalent and find out what the hell is going on. Instead, they opt to send out dopey emails that offer zero information and seem to be canned responses. It's not brain surgery. World Pay processes transactions between VGW and their player base. This issue should be resolved in a phone call. I'm not claiming 2+2 has any part of this mess, but they have the ability to contact Larry or Nigel directly and request an answer. If their contact information is needed, I can provide it.

There is no obligation on 2+2's part to help, but it would be a gracious gesture if Mason, Matt, etc... could send an email asking VGW to directly address the issues. I've seen Global's ads on some new sites of late. They have funding. Not paying people their own money due to any issue is grimey af. They can wire funds from their company account and deal with the inconvenience internally instead of putting it all on the behalf of some players.

I think its time for us now to include Larry and Nigel regarding this matter.

Please provide their contact information and I will directly reach out to them regarding this matter.

can players not deposit?

So our first non-splayaa response strategy is that of the high road variety. Not a bad one, but not exactly a creative one either. Let's hope it's just a teaser before the good stuff.

I had a look at the last couple pages of the cashout thread, and what I *believe* I saw mostly related to a dozen or so Canadians who are having some major frustrations with cashouts, and possibly a few others. I see Kimbr has responded within the last 24 hours, and that one or two of those players finally received their money as well. But I doubt my brief look has given me a full grasp of the situation - what would you add to my brief summary?

And to be clear, I'm not looking to minimize what's going on, but simply to understand it.

No idea what this is about.

May not matter, I gave out phone numbers and direct contact info and it seems like a couple of the people reached mgmt at VGW. We'll see in a week.

Kimbr and Joey are doing what they can. I've spoken to both privately and Joey at length. I'd imagine they are almost as frustrated as some of the players. Hopefully, now thatgmt has been directly alerted, it will be resolved.

OK, thanks - I know you'll let me know if the situation doesn't improve.

As a general rule, 2+2 doesn't jump into player-poker site relations all that often, as we'd just be a third party that doesn't know the whole story, and I'm not sure if it really helps all that much. But when situations get widespread and serious, we definitely want to know about them. And there have been times when I see things I think need addressing, and have quietly emailed a contact or two about them.

To sum up it up for you Bobo:

All Canadians having major problems getting paid.. My first WD took over 30 days, the second one I got today took 19. I basically kept getting the run around and copy pasted message; I had to follow up DAILY with Kimbr / Global support and fight for them to finally send my wire. The reason my first one took so long is because I probably wasn't as aggressive as this time around.

The biggest issue here is the lack of transparency with the site in general. I don't think they are out to steal money but there is a HUGE customer service issue. They are simply overwhelmed with things to deal with. As soon as they see a bigger issue, they just push it to the side and it gets dragged on for much longer than it should. I've been playing poker online for quite some time and this is one of the most tilting withdrawal experiences I've ever had, hands down.

I do think Global Poker is legitimate, just a huge lack in customer service and massive delays if any big issues arise.

Gotta concur with that last sentence. The customer service often sends incomprehensible responses not germane to the original email, or, they just say something that is untrue.

Don't forget refusing players access to hand histories and searchable stats!

(You know, because like Paypal... players just don't want those things.)