I can prove that the RNG is rigged: I'm a winning player! Couldn't happen to a fish like me otherwise.

Any good theories yet on why GP is so quiet on this, and so protective over player stats?

Seems so easy, so obvious and for a clean, honest game... such a no-brainer to provide stats to players.

Fantasy Football leagues provide players with more stats than they could possibly ever use. Yet, a math-game like poker... and GP can't seem to provide what poker sites were providing 20 years ago online?

I'm just interested what the company position is? Why are they against true stat tracking and hand histories?

I'd imagine the same reason a few other sites have taken similar measures:

But what about downloadable hand histories for personal use? Access to a full array of personal stats (from your own games, not other people's) with your deposit?

Did people demand that GP ensure they couldn't look up their own results?

To be clear, I'm not defending it - just letting you know what I believe to be the reasoning they've given.

When Bodog went to completely anonymous hand histories, I was dead set against it for some of the reasons that have been mentioned in this forum. It's been several years, and they've been quite successful. Still doesn't mean it's right (or wrong), but it's worked for them. I know Global has taken a different approach, but the rationale they've given is similar.

I hear you.

Puts players in a tough position, not just with trust issues... but I can't imagine anyone has MORE fun having LESS idea what they're doing playing any game.

But, like you said... they've stated their reasons, which certainly have come into question. It is what it is.

You play there 3 days. Open new account here ?

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Royal Flush apparently about 1 in 30K hands. I saw one in less than 10K at GP, but that proves nothing of course. I could have saw it my first hand and it would have proven nothing.
Kind of funny though.

I got a Royal my very very first hand I ever played on the short lived Poker Mountain (immortalized as Poo Mountain by the legendary Brown Thumb on 2+2). Seemed odd to me then, seems odd to me now. But who knows?

I definitely feel like I see way more huge hands than I should be seeing in my 2 weeks on Global, but I'm winning so I don't care.

Haven't read through all 3K responses... but just wondering, has Global Poker come out themselves and said, in very clear language... "The cards for our games are dealt completely at random?"
Never mind proving it... have they even claimed that the way the cards fall at GP are 100% free from any influence of any other factor?

The premise of this thread seemed to be that winners were "predetermined" - making this more of a lotto scratchers situation. (We're assigning a winner, we just can't say who that will be.) Thus (by the premise) ... this is a sweepstakes, not a gambling site. I'm not looking for a fight, I'm just exploring this premise, albeit a bit late.

This would seem easy enough to disprove.

1. Statement from GP ensuring cards are dealt completely at random following no algorithm, etc.

2. Explanation of methodology used (RNG) etc.

3. Explanation of body which oversees their operations within the sweepstakes industry


I'm winning at GP and generally having fun. But, I wouldn't totally disagree that the cards fall a little funny. That can happen in poker though.

Would seem easy enough to put this conversation to bed....

From the F.A.Q

HOW RANDOM IS THE CARD SHUFFLE USED BY GLOBAL POKER?
The RNG used by Global Poker utilises a Mersenne Twister with background cycling. This was certified by iTechLabs on 15 February 2017 who confirmed that it uses a well known algorithm to generate random numbers. The numbers generated by this RNG have passed Marsaglia's "diehard" tests for statistical randomness. iTech Labs has found that number sequences are unpredictable, non-repeatable and uniformly distributed.

LOL.

In theory, yes, but in reality, it will never, ever be put to bed.

There's a reason that this thread:

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/2...dition-255990/

Has over 80,000 posts and almost 4.5 million views, just like you can find hundreds of websites dedicated to the fake moon landing, the 9/11 conspiracy, and just about anything else you can dream up. The harder you try to convince some people of one thing, the more they become convinced of the opposite. Evidence means nothing to them, as they can always find their own "alternative facts".

I meant more specifically with regards to Global Poker.

It seems they claim their cards are indeed random and to some degree are submitting to a company who claims to do oversight. (Better than nothing.)

I'll say this about GP. I'm a winning player there, but in about 300K hands at other sites, I've never seen anything like what I see at GP.

I'm either running so good I can't understand how it's mathematically possible, or so bad. There is no in between. It's very cartoony. The best 5 days of poker in my life, or the worst 5. No grey area. Is anything possible with a deck of cards? Sure, sure it is. And my experience is only anecdotal. But, I've never seen anything like the first 15K hands I've played there. Royal flush, countless quads and all.

Fun though.

I seen 2 boats lose to straight flushes yesterday, and also seen a royal flush yesterday. I too am a winning player on gp and not saying the rng is rigged. Just felt like sharing what I saw.

Not trying to be confrontational, but for the sake of discussion... how would someone start such a study? It would be easy at Pokerstars or sites that allow stat tracking.

But GP is highly protective of player stats, even your own stats they seem to want to keep you from.

Why is that do you think?

And how would someone put their randomness to the test under these circumstances?

Or here's another way to pose the question...

Simple modification of the card flow to move cash/action around would take some basic junior high school stats/coding. So I think we can all agree that it would be phenomenally easy. Very slight mods in code to increase action, encourage deposits - doesn't take any kind of genius to figure out the math there.

So knowing that this is possible and easy... and GP players have no way to track what's happening at their tables whatsoever (over a long term) ... why would GP NOT modify the card flow?

Furthermore, why given the simplicity and lack of transparency of such a modification... would any players be assured they would not do this?

Again, I think it's possible to have fun splashing around on GP but also be suspect of what you see happening.

But this is the problem. It doesn't pass the eyeball test for a lot of people (card flow) .... so the easy way to quell that argument is the access to extensive stats or use of stat tracking software.

Voluntarily reporting their business and audits to regulatory agencies nullifies that unless management is so clueless they don't realize they are hanging themselves. Prior successful history in business and the sector would suggest they aren't clueless.

Can't answer for the lack of hand histories unless it is the fear that someone will build a huge database off of it to sell. I don't personally understand the reasoning, maybe it's simpler to say no to 100% of all software vs spending time going over each one individually. I don't see the harm of making them available CPL days later with anonymous players. What could be developed from that?

+1, this is why I think they do it as well. Its the Mike Pence policy of how to handle opposite sex relatoinships, except applied to poker and software. If you aren't with ANY of them, nothing bad can happen. This is not to say its the best policy ever, BUT... there aren't any alligations against Pence from the MeToo movement... and huds don't work on Global. So is a hammer killing a fly? Perhaps. But it is killing it.

Now I am not posting this link to "prove" it can be done, but it is possible that anonymous data can be made not so anonymous.

https://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/...nymous-people/

Maybe if they converted everything to BB instead of actual stakes, that would help, especially if they threw the GC games in there, but if it says what stakes that are played, I can't imagine it would take a genius to say, "I wonder if this was the table I played at 2 nights ago where my stack was $1,087.54 when I started, and this stats shows someone sitting down with that amount." Then you just keep track of the names at the table off to the side, and match up the data.

Again, we get back to the fly and hammer thing, could their policy here be over-kill? Of course it could be. But it also seems way more likely they don't allow this to protect players than to hide nefarious RNG rigging.

Guys what do you think about this hand

https://play.globalpoker.com/poker-c...4b056a47b2a19f

Stupidity? Miss click?
or something else?

I am not in favor of conspiracy theories, and I've seen a lot of dump plays on GP, but I am pretty sure I've never seen anyone calling with 9 high after being c/r OTT and bet OTR.

Nothing surprises me with online poker. Someone called me to go all in with an under pair and four way to a flush on the board on another much bigger network in a $30 buying MTT. I just assume it's the 'hero call' obsession with some people.

I will bite. Lets assume they are some kind of super user and know the cards, or there is a deeper conspiracy. Why didn't they raise knowing what you would have and you would fold for sure. They could jam with impunity. If you call (which you wouldn't) it would end up being a split pot anyway. So if anything this hand proves in of itself, its legit.

I would agree more with a dewd, that a much more likely scenario is the "hero call" mentality, or a "I am willing to pay to see what this guy has" kind of thing. I auto muck my cards, so I have had light calls and then people tell me in chat, "Just had to see what you had"

it's reasonable. I was thinking about it too. Sometimes I will pay a small bet as well to make a note on a guy. But later in this session exactly this **** happened. Like whenever I had great hand the guy was folding all the time and when I have some sort of "I can call, but not a lot" he was 3x over betting. Probably just coincidence.

Certainly this has to be viewed as a positive. They are at least trying to create some appearance of authenticity. I think it would be nearly impossible to maintain their business without at least some appearance of regulation.
The industry has a woeful track record and for investor confidence, business partners... this adds some sense of validation I'm sure. Whether "iTech" serves the poker community or the companies themselves is impossible to know right now.

I remember back when I was a broke kid, I used to complain that Wells Fargo was stalling my paycheck deposits. I would deposit on a Friday and see overdraft fees the following Wednesday. I'd inquire, they'd have a story. Certainly, Wells Fargo is in a highly regulated industry, answering to a host of gov and consumer regulatory commissions.

You probably know where this is going, later... Wells Fargo paid out a massive class action lawsuit, essentially admitting to manipulating deposits to increase overdraft fees... this among a host of other massive scandals they've been involved in.

But, it was the people who caught it. Not the regulatory agency. Companies like Equifax are regulatory agencies which purport to act as go-betweens between consumers and financial institutions. Yet, you'll notice Equifax has partnerships and advertises with major banks. So who are they serving?

This circles back to why in a financial transition (which let's face it, this is) .... the people involved have to have all information at their disposal. This means full hand histories, stat tracking and extensive transparency. If everyone has access to the same info, how is it an "advantage?" Studying pot odds is an advantage if someone uses it too.

My feeling that Wells Fargo was manipulating deposits was not scientific. Same as my feeling that the cards at GP are a bit silly and cartoony. It's just a hunch, because I have no way to track and even disprove my own hunch. Hopefully my hunch is wrong this time, unlike the Wells example.

Wouldn't it be great to just be able to track all hands, pots and histories and put this to bed? That's my stance, anyway. Seems simple.

When they file reports with the securities agencies, they are affirming that everything g they say is correct and not misleading. Any false statement is an act of fraud. It's viewed a bit different than just standard law enforcement. Accepting money from the public as investment greatly exposes them to all kinds of trouble if they are misleading, let alone outright lying. It's a real slippery slope for any company to play with. With the cash machine they have from all the rake and fees should make it very worth their while to be honest and forthright. Any company can turn out to be a scam, just tough to believe VGW would risk it. Obviously, there is always the potential, just cannot see it happening.

I think it's going to attract more players to global lol.

Seriously though, not a super user. If villain could see your hole cards he would raise the river.