Please bring them back

if we can't get 20bb back can we at least get 25/50? would make the reg battling more worth it too

Care to explain exactly what your reasoning is behind saying 40-100BB poker is objectively better than 20BB? Over the vast majority of postflop situations, a hand of 100bb poker will generally have at most one extra bet that can be placed into the pot when compared to 20bb poker. For recreational players, this extra bet generally goes in when they have a very low amount of equity (0-20%). Short stack poker allows for players to show off a much higher level of poker knowledge due to forcing players to adapt to dynamic game conditions where players are forced to much more aggressively play pots as blinds make up a much larger overall percentage of chip stacks.

I mentioned before, but I'm feeling the decision makers at Global do not understand exactly how much both preflop and postflop strategies change going from 15bbs to 20bbs to 25bbs to 30bbs to 40bbs. At shorter blind levels, in order to win players must adapt and apply strong poker theoretical knowledge and have a firm understanding of how many different variables affect the EV of different lines, instead of relying on static preflop ranges and simplified heuristics extremely common among 100bb regulars. Shortstack postflop play rewards players who need to play aggressive to win small pots, instead of the standard 100bb global regular where their entire strategy revolves around making a great hand when the recreational player makes a good hand, and making good hands when the recreational player makes a marginal hand.

If you're open-minded to learning more about shortstack play and bringing back the 20bb tables, feel free to send me a PM as I'm more than happy to explore this topic more in-depth. If you feel certain that 40-100BB is "objectively better poker than 20bbs" due to adding at most one more possible available bet postflop that often severe punishes recreational players, I urge you to reconsider and at least think of the large number of players on Global, both recreational and grinders, who strongly prefer to at least have the option of playing shortstack poker.

No, GFY.

We will see? You can see that recreational players enjoy 20BB tables because there were many recreational players playing them, and not playing the 40-100BB tables. By offering both options you give recreational players their own choice-some may find a "full stack" more attractive, some may not. By forcing them to play a game that you subjectively call "better poker" is taking the choice away from your target audience and encouraging them to play elsewhere. I've not seen many of the common, casual rec players at the 40-100BB tables since the 20BB tables were shut down.

I agree they should offer both. With that said, I’ve found the full stack games at 200nl and 500nl to be better since they got rid of the short stack games, but interestingly the fishier players that I’m seeing are not ones who were playing the 20bb games. Small sample size and it is purely anecdotal, but thought it was interesting to note.

Site doesn't have enough players to offer both. 40-100bb is more popular and should be what's offered. It's also less susceptible to botting/collusion.

Just chiming in as a 10-20 regular on Global. Please bring back the shallow games. There were a lot of recreational players playing because it's less intimidating, and the edge that pros have over them is smaller. It also encourages regs to start games more because the edge that one player has over another is smaller, and the losses are smaller.

Personally, I'd rather have a constant flow of 10/20 games where I have a small-medium edge vs less action + the fish getting cleaned out quickly.

There could even be a compromise, like Full Tilt's shallow tables back in the day, which were 20-40bb buyin.

I completely disagree with everything you said here.

Global has enough players to offer both. 4/8 short, 5/10 deep, and 10/20 deep have been running consistently since the short tables were introduced, especially over the past 6 months.

There was a lot more 4/8 and 10/20 20bb running than 5/10 100bb, proving recreational players enjoy playing 20bbs more than 100bbs, since generally games in 2020 don't run without at least one recreational player in the game. If a recreational player wants to buy in a game with $160, he's generally much happier and will have much better results buying into a 4/8 short game than a 1/2 deep game.

I don't understand how 100bb bots are harder to design while they consistently earn much more than short bots, as ranges and meta strategies are much more consistent at 100bbs. At short tables, preflop ranges are much more dynamic due to different stack sizes, and postflop strategies while playing 20bb-50bb can deviate greatly from nash while still maintaining roughly the same EV. It's much more difficult to be good postflop playing 20-50bb stacks than it is to be good postflop just playing 80-200bb stacks. Just because the average Global regular lacks the knowledge on how to play postflop at a variety of shorter blind sizes doesn't mean shortstacking is easier than playing at 100bbs.

For further proof that botting 100bb is much more common and easier than botting multiple short stack sizes, look at the bot rings that have been exposed for taking millions out of online poker. The vast majority (all?) of NL cash game bots have been playing and botting at 100bb tables. On sites where short games are offered, bots are much less common as good players can deviate their strategies greatly from nash at shorter blind levels, and bots, at least so far, are unable to properly deviate from nash in order to counter unconventional strategies in NL short cash games. MTTs are a different beast, but if a person doesn't understand how adding antes changes preflop and postflop at short blind sizes they definitely shouldn't be part of this discussion.

Pros want higher stakes and deep buyins for more edge.

20bb were more popular at 10/20 than 5/10 deep before.

The best for Global Poker is not having any high stake. Rob Young in Joey Ingrams's podcast says high stake does not benefit poker site at all. The poker site rather keep the money at site and collect rakes.

These games also had way more action than FR or 6-max. Even as a regular I found the shorter games to be a lot more fun with constant action and all-ins: the kind of drama recreational players love.

Website still shows the 20bb games listed on the rake page and does not include the new 2k 10/20 game. Can we get this updated?


https://globalpoker.com/rake/

very supportive of a return to real 100bb poker

+1

"real" lol. It's not a return if 100bb poker never left. Having 20bb tables simply provides players with more options.

I'd be happy if they had both. The action at 10/20 hasn't been great so far.

They've had 10/20 PLO for months & still haven't updated the page.

They’ve updated it now. Identical to 5/10 rake which is extraordinary and much lower than the 150bb cap NL game was before. When you factor in the short handed and HU rake reduction as well it’s a huge change. Thank you David.

Even if 40-100bb poker is objectively better... does it really matter?

For instance your other offerings:

sit and goes:
normal
turbo
hyper turbo

Why have 3 options if 'normal' is objectively better poker? (i dont think it is, just following the line of thought)

Different people enjoy different things... And I dont follow why you can't offer 4/8 and give 2 options at 10/20.

I think you're missing how fun it is to start with 20bb and run that stack up and have people not able to match and stack you right away.

Please reconsider and bring them back!

Thanks!

I played as much 20bb as anyone and can say pretty confidently the 20bb games were devoid of bots so it's really not a pressing issue.

Notice how dead the 10/20 and 5/10 games are now also......there were always multiple 10/20 and 4/8 when there were 20 BB options...........recreational players don't want to lose $800 or $400 on one hand.

Fair point.

In pure commercial terms: better = "it is more likely to have players stick around for it / return to it".

This weekend was 4th of July, all sites prob experienced a lull. During the times I play it seems like there’s at least the same amount of games running on avg above 500 NL.

Well said, +1

love the 10/20 100bb. great changes, good job gp