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Probability "Problem" Probability "Problem"

02-02-2020 , 09:20 PM
I've been playing Big O online. Lately I started noticing that whenever I played four or five big cards in my hand that the Flop would come with three low cards. I started keeping track of it. The Flop has come with three low cards 62 out of 70 times that I had four or five big cards in my hand. What are the odds of this? This seems highly improbable but maybe I am overestimating the improbability of this. Thanks
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02-03-2020 , 07:30 AM
It depends how you define low cards.
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02-03-2020 , 11:23 AM
Low cards in Big O are A 2 3 4 5 6 7 and 8.
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02-03-2020 , 11:50 AM
It's more likely to happen when you have 5 high cards than 4, but even if you had 5 high cards in all 70 cases, the chance would be on the order of 1 in 1.458 E23, which is about 146 sextillion. Since you had a mix of 5 and 4 high cards, it's somewhere between that and 46 septillion.

Suspicious indeed.
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02-08-2020 , 04:00 AM
Just to give you an idea of how big the number one septillion is, If you were to take one septillion pennies and divide it equally among every man woman and child on Earth, you would be giving each and every person 1.5 trillion dollars which is 10 times more than the richest person on Earth currently has
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02-08-2020 , 11:40 AM
The way I think of it is, it's like winning the Powerball jackpot 2.95 times in a row, because
(292M)^2.95 = 1 E25

Which site is it?
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02-08-2020 , 12:33 PM
It's funny you mention that it's like winning the Powerball three times in a row. That's the exact conclusion I came to last night as well. I would rather not mention the site. The funny thing is I'm still winning on that site as well as a previous site that uses the exact same platform. If somebody was going to rig it so that you lose, this would be a dumb way to do it. Once I see the flop, I fold, so I lose about $20 at most.
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02-09-2020 , 08:50 AM
Right I'm not saying this is a smoking gun, but it's not nothing either.

The boring explanation would be that this is one of many improbable things that could have happened to draw your attention. In isolation, each thing is one in a zillion, but in combination they're not. What happened here was low flops with high hole cards, but it could have been countless number of highly specific things, because in poker, anything highly specific is improbable. Really any series of deals is near impossible in its own way, but some stand out to us more than others. You didn't consciously datamine, but your brain naturally notices patterns and trends, so subconsciously you were datamining and not super unlikely to find some kind of seeming anomaly.

However, now that you've identified a single hypothesis to keep track of, you might as well continue updating the 62/70 tally. Maybe bump this thread after you've gathered another 30 results in the sample.
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02-09-2020 , 06:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by heehaww
The boring explanation would be that this is one of many improbable things that could have happened to draw your attention. In isolation, each thing is one in a zillion, but in combination they're not. What happened here was low flops with high hole cards, but it could have been countless number of highly specific things, because in poker, anything highly specific is improbable. Really any series of deals is near impossible in its own way, but some stand out to us more than others. You didn't consciously datamine, but your brain naturally notices patterns and trends, so subconsciously you were datamining and not super unlikely to find some kind of seeming anomaly.
This explains away a lot of rigging theories, but not this one. I don't know how to quantify it mathematically but this is too improbable and not specific enough a circumstance. The distribution of high/low cards is very important to a split pot game. This game is either rigged or OP didn't gather the data correctly.
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02-16-2020 , 01:15 PM
So here's my math.

The chances of getting all low cards if you hold 5 high cards is: 36/47 * 35/46 * 34/45 = 44%.

Using a binomial calculator, out of 70 trials:
-- The (cumulative) probability of getting more than 35 low flops is 16.8%
-- The probability of getting more than 50 low flops is 0.000215%
-- The probability of getting 62+ low flops is so astronomically small it might as well be impossible.

My guess is you weren't counting correctly. You probably included some flops with a single high card, or are completely making up these numbers. The only other explanation is that it's incredibly rigged.
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02-17-2020 , 01:49 PM
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Originally Posted by tombos21
The chances of getting all low cards if you hold 5 high cards is: 36/47 * 35/46 * 34/45 = 44%.
If a low card is defined as Ace through Eight, then your 36 should be a 32, and so on, which changes the probability to < 31%, making your overall point even stronger.
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05-01-2020 , 12:29 PM
Okay so I quit playing Big O and started playing four card pot limit Omaha Hi-Lo on the same website. I started noticing that it seemed like my A2 hands weren't making the nut low nearly as often as they should, so I started keeping track. Once I started keeping track whenever I had A2 dealt to me I made the nut low 5 times out of 62. Some of those hands I had A23. My research shows that I should make a low 24% of the time with just the A2 in my hand but that percentage jumps to 40% if I have A23. Now I only counted a success when I made the nut low and if I made a live Ace or live Deuce I counted it as a failure. Also there were about 4 hands where there was a possibility of running low cards coming on the turn and River but I folded. I counted those as failures. I'm trying to figure out if this site is legit. What do you think the odds of only succeeding five times out of 62 is?

Last edited by Hemidaytona; 05-01-2020 at 12:38 PM.
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