Twitch - this gonna be the nail in the coffin
04-09-2015
, 09:54 PM
04-09-2015
, 11:26 PM
04-09-2015
, 11:50 PM
04-10-2015
, 01:18 AM
04-10-2015
, 01:33 AM
Quote:
Was planning to write something for a while now but didn't found time or energy so far but since i'm reading twitch twitch twitch everywhere these days here we go. Also english is not my mother tongue so excuse eventual mistakes i make but in this post i will abstain from my trademark "teh" and similar stuff.
I started with onlinepoker mid 2000s and played recreational in the beginning and started to play for a living in 2009 after i quit my job. I've seen alot over the years and i pretty much always played the same stakes with NL200 fullring as my main game. Of the folks i played with in 2010 there are maybe 10% still around. The rest is gone. Apart from the exceptions which moved up and still stayed there 80+% are not playing for a living anymore because it was not possible for them anymore.
Over the years games got tougher and tougher up to a point where you really shake your head if you think about some years back. The average NL100 game these days is for sure tougher and filled with better players compared to a NL1k game in 2010.
The biggest damage in this whole development was probably due to pokerstrategy.com. I remember in 2010 if you had a russian at the table he was a maniac and loaded with money. Today you have 5 russians at every table who are agressive and in many spots close to GTO and not easily to exploit. Thanks for developing the russian market, pokerstrategy!
Smaller damages were/are done by several coaching sites even though their influence is neglicible compared to ps because for them you actually have to pay and don't get money and lessons for free which get you started. They still were and are a strong contributor to what games currently are.
Other factor like blackfriday and ringfencing several countries weren't good for poker either but by far not as bad as the two points above.
Now we write 2015. While in 2010 when somebody asked me i told him to quit his job and start play for a living today i tell him to stay as far away as possible. Things have changed abit.
If you look into several forums here the tone gets more and more agressive towards each other because more and more people cannot make a living out of this game anymore.
If you speak to other regs you hear alot of complaints that games are too tough, the rake is to high, there are less games running etc.
And now at this absolute lowpoint in over 15years of onlinepoker we get TWITCH.
And we celebrate it like the best thing that ever happend to poker!
In every podcast i hear how good twitch is for poker. That another boom is coming. That everything is getting better from now on.
But i tell you what. There is no new boom. And things will get tougher. Alot tougher. Tough to a point that alot of those people who are reading this will not be able to play for a living in one or two years from now.
Lets break down this awesome site called twitch for a moment. Wich brings in new players like nothing else:
So all you streamers target an audience which, apart from people who already playing poker more or less serious, consists of very young, probably 15-30y/o males, with in most cases pretty much zero disposable money (unless they have rich parents) who enjoy computer games and most likely spend the majority of their free time in front of a screen and you teach them that you can make alot of money by playing poker, what hands to play, how to play them, how to approach mindset issues, how to build a bankroll, where to watch strategy videos, etc.
Now i ask you guys what could possibly go wrong?
I don't see another boom, all i see is 1000s of new, hungry and highly motivated regulars. And a coffin with a nail in it.
So please all you podcasts, newswriters, players, etc. - before you communicate how awesome twitch is the next time please turn on your brain and think for a couple seconds. Twitch is by far the worst thing that ever happend to poker for anybody who is currently playing for a living - ainec.
tl;dr
- sky is falling
- game over soon
- twitch doesnt get a single recreational player playing any sort of meaningful stakes with a 45/15
- twitch will produce 1000s of regulars grinding up from the micros to however far they manage to come
I started with onlinepoker mid 2000s and played recreational in the beginning and started to play for a living in 2009 after i quit my job. I've seen alot over the years and i pretty much always played the same stakes with NL200 fullring as my main game. Of the folks i played with in 2010 there are maybe 10% still around. The rest is gone. Apart from the exceptions which moved up and still stayed there 80+% are not playing for a living anymore because it was not possible for them anymore.
Over the years games got tougher and tougher up to a point where you really shake your head if you think about some years back. The average NL100 game these days is for sure tougher and filled with better players compared to a NL1k game in 2010.
The biggest damage in this whole development was probably due to pokerstrategy.com. I remember in 2010 if you had a russian at the table he was a maniac and loaded with money. Today you have 5 russians at every table who are agressive and in many spots close to GTO and not easily to exploit. Thanks for developing the russian market, pokerstrategy!
Smaller damages were/are done by several coaching sites even though their influence is neglicible compared to ps because for them you actually have to pay and don't get money and lessons for free which get you started. They still were and are a strong contributor to what games currently are.
Other factor like blackfriday and ringfencing several countries weren't good for poker either but by far not as bad as the two points above.
Now we write 2015. While in 2010 when somebody asked me i told him to quit his job and start play for a living today i tell him to stay as far away as possible. Things have changed abit.
If you look into several forums here the tone gets more and more agressive towards each other because more and more people cannot make a living out of this game anymore.
If you speak to other regs you hear alot of complaints that games are too tough, the rake is to high, there are less games running etc.
And now at this absolute lowpoint in over 15years of onlinepoker we get TWITCH.
And we celebrate it like the best thing that ever happend to poker!
In every podcast i hear how good twitch is for poker. That another boom is coming. That everything is getting better from now on.
But i tell you what. There is no new boom. And things will get tougher. Alot tougher. Tough to a point that alot of those people who are reading this will not be able to play for a living in one or two years from now.
Lets break down this awesome site called twitch for a moment. Wich brings in new players like nothing else:
So all you streamers target an audience which, apart from people who already playing poker more or less serious, consists of very young, probably 15-30y/o males, with in most cases pretty much zero disposable money (unless they have rich parents) who enjoy computer games and most likely spend the majority of their free time in front of a screen and you teach them that you can make alot of money by playing poker, what hands to play, how to play them, how to approach mindset issues, how to build a bankroll, where to watch strategy videos, etc.
Now i ask you guys what could possibly go wrong?
I don't see another boom, all i see is 1000s of new, hungry and highly motivated regulars. And a coffin with a nail in it.
So please all you podcasts, newswriters, players, etc. - before you communicate how awesome twitch is the next time please turn on your brain and think for a couple seconds. Twitch is by far the worst thing that ever happend to poker for anybody who is currently playing for a living - ainec.
tl;dr
- sky is falling
- game over soon
- twitch doesnt get a single recreational player playing any sort of meaningful stakes with a 45/15
- twitch will produce 1000s of regulars grinding up from the micros to however far they manage to come
. it's an accomplishment if you are able to tread water these days.on a side note, cardrunners should make a moving down the stakes series to celebrate their 10th anniversary.
04-10-2015
, 01:37 AM
Threads like this make me laugh. All these cry baby regs gurning like little biatches cause new people might come into the game with some experience, and maybe beat them lol
You think someone watching a few streams is so unfair and you feel this threatens your future as a poker player??
So seating scripts and HUD's are fine?? It's ok for regs to use all the software they can to give them an advantage, but a rec watches a video or two and you sh@t your pants
Well I hope they ban the use of software, and all the 'twitch newbs' come and kick your ass
You think someone watching a few streams is so unfair and you feel this threatens your future as a poker player??
So seating scripts and HUD's are fine?? It's ok for regs to use all the software they can to give them an advantage, but a rec watches a video or two and you sh@t your pants
Well I hope they ban the use of software, and all the 'twitch newbs' come and kick your ass
04-10-2015
, 01:40 AM
04-10-2015
, 02:04 AM
04-10-2015
, 02:10 AM
cool rant, games would also be much better if all teh timstones stopped script seating as well. its pretty obvious you have not progressed with the game and have been surpassed by the new regs who have came through, not everyone needs to rely on teh seating software to make money.
glgl when the new stars changes come in
glgl when the new stars changes come in