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Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game) Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

10-26-2015 , 10:50 PM
BGH isn't the reason those aren't run. They cost too much mana, or don't have enough health/upside. Plenty of BGH'able cards are used. Giants, Mal'Ganis, Fel Reaver, Boom, Ragnaros, Alex, Gedden, and sometimes Nefarian, Neptulon, Rhonin, and even less often Deathwing & Varian. You are correct that more of them would be run if BGH didn't exist (but that isn't why they aren't run now).
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10-26-2015 , 10:51 PM
OIC, I disagree with one of those. I use Deathwing in control warrior a decent amount.
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10-26-2015 , 10:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vixticator
BGH isn't the reason those aren't run. They cost too much mana, or don't have enough health/upside. Plenty of BGH'able cards are used. Giants, Mal'Ganis, Fel Reaver, Boom, Ragnaros, Alex, Gedden, and sometimes Nefarian, Neptulon, Rhonin, and even less often Deathwing & Varian. You are correct that more of them would be run if BGH didn't exist (but that isn't why they aren't run now).
Every. single. one of these (excluding fel reaver which is an epic and is used for it's body on curve) has an immediate effect, which is the only reason they can be used.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vixticator
BGH isn't the reason those aren't run. They cost too much mana, or don't have enough health/upside. Plenty of BGH'able cards are used. Giants, Mal'Ganis, Fel Reaver, Boom, Ragnaros, Alex, Gedden, and sometimes Nefarian, Neptulon, Rhonin, and even less often Deathwing & Varian. You are correct that more of them would be run if BGH didn't exist (but that isn't why they aren't run now).
Quote:
Originally Posted by vixticator
Quote:
Originally Posted by Searix
see? this is my point. We can't even play these cards even if BGH didn't exist
OIC, I disagree with one of those. I use Deathwing in control warrior a decent amount.
I'd love to at least try out decks with Icehowl in control, or Majordomo when you're at ~15 hp (Coldarra Drake builds ho!)
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10-26-2015 , 11:06 PM
Fel Reaver has no immediate effect. It can lose you the game if answered by BGH. It is run in 2 popular decks, and sees play in other fringe mech decks. Like, it has a much bigger downside than most of those cards you listed if answered by BGH. Do you not agree? Like half of the decks out there don't run a BGH. I realllllllly don't think Icehowl is being shut out because of it.

(Icehowl does have an immediate effect too.)
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10-26-2015 , 11:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Searix
The following legendaries would otherwise see play if Big Game Hunter didn't exist:

Immediately see play:
Icehowl
Mekgineer Thermaplugg
Majordomo
Deathwing
Malorne
Illidan
Velen
Rend
Mogor
The Beast
The Skeleton Knight
oh come on, lol. most of those cards would still not see play. MOGOR? give me a break.

Quote:

Might see play:
Gruul
King Krush
Onyxia
Anub'arak

Instead we don't see play from these, in part or wholly because BGH exists

They've had to balance EVERY new legendary on having 6 or less attack (Kel'Thuzad, Chromaggus), or having an immediate effect if it does (Rhonin, Dr Boom, Neptulon). That's not good game design
Agree with this tho
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10-26-2015 , 11:13 PM
Am I the only one that thinks BGH is a good mechanic?
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10-26-2015 , 11:14 PM
Hoot hoot mother****er
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10-26-2015 , 11:18 PM
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Originally Posted by CyberShark93
Hoot hoot mother****er
Is also an annoying but necessary mechanic
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10-26-2015 , 11:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vixticator
Am I the only one that thinks BGH is a good mechanic?
its really really bad for the game
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10-26-2015 , 11:47 PM
Ok, bought 7 more classics and cracked The Black Knight. Seems solid but only in certain metas... and probably not the one we're in. Disenchant?
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10-26-2015 , 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Kirbynator
its really really bad for the game
this ^
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10-26-2015 , 11:57 PM
That list of 7+ attack legendaries has to be a troll, right? Those cards aren't played not because BGH but because they suck.

Onyxia
Velen
Deathwing

These are the 3 that might see some popping into the meta if BGH didn't exist. But you already see Velen and Deathwing in fringe decks.
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10-26-2015 , 11:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Searix
no it's not

i did the write-up in another thread, but basically these cards (BGH, Ooze, Harrison, Flare) become OP if they work, and underpowered if they don't
How can you say Harrison is either overpowered or underpowered? It is right on the borderline of being good enough to play for tons of decks.
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10-27-2015 , 12:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Priptonite
Ok, bought 7 more classics and cracked The Black Knight. Seems solid but only in certain metas... and probably not the one we're in. Disenchant?
You can disenchant it, but it's a card you'll *probably* need to craft in the future. As in a future expansion.
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10-27-2015 , 12:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vixticator
Am I the only one that thinks BGH is a good mechanic?
Probably. I use tons of bghs but i dont like it. I legit only play tons of bgh targets or none.
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10-27-2015 , 12:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Priptonite
Ok, bought 7 more classics and cracked The Black Knight. Seems solid but only in certain metas... and probably not the one we're in. Disenchant?
I would def not de it since it cracks the meta from time to time. I like tbk.
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10-27-2015 , 12:20 AM
Honestly the only legendary that i think becomes playable if bgh disapears is onyxia. (Deathwing is already used sparingly but i think bgh doesnt impact deathwinh at all, and varian is just not that great so thats why)

Every other legendary just isnt good enough.

No bgh would impact a few fringe big cards tho - like sea giant maybe. A lot of decks that are on the fence about running 1 bgh target would prob veer towards yes. For example in priest might throw in boom. My midrange hunter would feel better about boom too.
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10-27-2015 , 12:30 AM
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Originally Posted by bgordon
How can you say Harrison is either overpowered or underpowered? It is right on the borderline of being good enough to play for tons of decks.
vs. each individual deck though

Against a warrior/hunter it's overpowered

Against a non-weapon class it's underpowered

Let me use an extreme analogy: Imagine they made a 0 mana card that instantly killed warriors. What would happen?

-First day everyone would use it. Free wins against warriors for little investment.

-Week later no one plays warrior, people start to only run one in their deck.

-Month later almost everyone has got the memo not to play warrior, decks stop running it.

-2 months later only 1 in 10 decks run a copy, a very small amount of people start to play warrior again and find a new meta and have success.

-Eventually a balance is struck where some (very few) people play warrior, and another few play the insta-kill warrior card.

What conclusions can we draw? In the long run the card is balanced because it causes a corresponding amount of less warriors, which in term means less of the card being played.

However

a) Is the card fun?
b) There are a large amount of decks (any warrior deck) that are being prevented from playing, is that fair?
c) Should a person automatically win if they were lucky (or smart?) enough to have the insta-kill warrior card?

Now... re-read this replacing the card with BGH and warriors with 7 attack minions

Last edited by Searix; 10-27-2015 at 12:36 AM.
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10-27-2015 , 12:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vixticator
BGH isn't the reason those aren't run. They cost too much mana, or don't have enough health/upside. Plenty of BGH'able cards are used. Giants, Mal'Ganis, Fel Reaver, Boom, Ragnaros, Alex, Gedden, and sometimes Nefarian, Neptulon, Rhonin, and even less often Deathwing & Varian. You are correct that more of them would be run if BGH didn't exist (but that isn't why they aren't run now).
Yeah, if BGH were removed there's no way we'd see the **** 7+ legendaries get played. Rather, we'd see the currently used legendaries used more. Like decks that dropped Boom to have no BGH targets might run him. Or decks that replaced Rag with Ysera might consider switching back. Malorne and Skeleton Knight are not going to be making an appearance regardless of BGH.
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10-27-2015 , 12:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Dazarath
Yeah, if BGH were removed there's no way we'd see the **** 7+ legendaries get played. Rather, we'd see the currently used legendaries used more. Like decks that dropped Boom to have no BGH targets might run him. Or decks that replaced Rag with Ysera might consider switching back. Malorne and Skeleton Knight are not going to be making an appearance regardless of BGH.
like i said, nerf BGH and the outlier 7+ balanced around BGH (dr boom)
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10-27-2015 , 01:02 AM
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Originally Posted by IHeartAsians
what do gaming chairs do that good office chairs cant?
Not wear down so fast?

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Originally Posted by mephisto
Ikea chair ftw.
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10-27-2015 , 03:26 AM
BGH is fine mechanic imo. Druids innervating out Boom on turn 3 is a good reason for it to exist. Paladins buffing their stuff to BGH range early on. Rogues and cold blood. Us mages and our nasty Esportal pulling of Dr Boom and crap on turn 4. Games would get out of hand without it. Not to mention some decks like Warriors bomb training with a bunch of Legendaries that need to be replied to with removal and not board trades.

I don't use it. But I don't have a problem with it either.
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10-27-2015 , 03:43 AM
Searix -

Leper Gnome is a much bigger factor in limiting how many big fun expensive minions get played. Removing BGH would have some impact at the margins, but Illidan is still going to be in 40th place when someone is trying to decide what 6 mana minion to add to their deck.
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10-27-2015 , 04:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Searix
The following legendaries would otherwise see play if Big Game Hunter didn't exist:

Immediately see play:
Icehowl-terrible--maybe in a silence deck
Mekgineer Thermaplugg-no too much mana and situational
Majordomo-played for troll, just not a very good card
Deathwing-already played in weird dragon decks and troll decks
Malorne
Illidan-i could see play
Velen-already has been played but not a ton
Rend-maybe
Mogor-hell no
The Beast-not really
The Skeleton Knight-straight up trash

Might see play:
Gruul-probably
King Krush-problem is value
Onyxia-played in arena--very good card--this should be in your upper list
Anub'arak--played in arena--this card actually would be played, a lot without bgh and if rogue had control decks

Instead we don't see play from these, in part or wholly because BGH exists

They've had to balance EVERY new legendary on having 6 or less attack (Kel'Thuzad, Chromaggus), or having an immediate effect if it does (Rhonin, Dr Boom, Neptulon). That's not good game design
the problem is there are better 7+ damage drops that are less situational and just better even if bgh did exist.
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10-27-2015 , 05:05 AM
lol pirate rogue is seriously underrated. Zalae just ran over three people with it on his stream after playing it for donators. It seriously has such insane burst. Whenever I see people throw rogue into the shammy category I wonder if they've played around with pirates.
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