Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game) - Page 922 - Hearthstone -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

I just find it funny when they take a card that's good and make it unplayable. It's one thing to nerf, it's another thing to ruin a card. Sucks for people who just bought wings of BRM. I don't mind that's it out of the meta, I just find it funny how blizzard does it. Do nothing for months and say there isn't anything wrong and then make it totally unplayable.

Basically they just say bs until they make a decision. Everyone had a feeling that this day would come--I just wasn't expecting f a buzzard like nerf.

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10-13-2015 , 07:06 PM

#23027

Kirbynator

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Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 52,004

you cant nerf grim patron without killing it

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10-13-2015 , 07:11 PM

#23028

Wolfram

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Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 15,066

Quote:

Originally Posted by capone0

I'm pretty sure they've said that it's on their watchlist for a while now.

And here's the thing, it's really really hard to nerf a card without torpedoing it. Just take a look at Leeroy, Nat Pagle, buzzard, undertaker, tinkmaster, auctioneer, soulfire. Most of them had relatively simple changes, all of them became unplayable afterwards.

I think it has something to do with how stats in a card game are small in scale compared to other games. E.g. in LoL you can fine-tune nerfs by small fractions because units have hundreds of stats points. But in hearthstone if you add one mana for example you slow a card down by a whole turn which is huge.

Last edited by Wolfram; 10-13-2015 at 07:22 PM.

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10-13-2015 , 07:40 PM

#23029

D104

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 18,255

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirbynator

you cant nerf grim patron without killing it

I've have my doubts about the truth of this statement, but you're a lot more knowledgable than me about hearthstone and game design, so I'll defer to you on this. I would have at least liked to see them try though.

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10-13-2015 , 07:41 PM

#23030

dkgojackets

DKGOAT

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 86,123

increasing warsong by 1 mana is actually pretty reasonable compared to destroying the card.

hounds survived 2 to 3. leeroy still was played in some decks after going to 5. auctioneer was tried but rogue is dead. soulfire has a place in malylock but mostly was done in by dark bomb being a card.

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10-13-2015 , 07:42 PM

#23031

gusmahler

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Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 29,443

Thought I'd queue up a patron deck for old time's sake. Wow I'm bad at it. Good thing I always put aside learning how to play it properly. Now I don't have to bother.

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10-13-2015 , 07:51 PM

#23032

Kirbynator

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Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 52,004

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkgojackets

warsong at 4 mana seems worse than what they made it now... no?

who would play grim patron decks with warsong @ 4? (or any deck)

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10-13-2015 , 07:51 PM

#23033

WhiteGoose

confirmed loose

Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 13,009

So the worst company in the world which promotes more degeneracy than drug or alcohol companies messes up something that would be unanimously lauded if it was done just slightly differently. Sounds right.

Secret Paladin isn't even that good. Just keep the board clear and run BGHs or SW;D to clear the 9/8.

I think Kirby is right. Shaman #1. I have like 340 wins now, gonna run this up.

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10-13-2015 , 07:56 PM

#23034

Kirbynator

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Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 52,004

i did not say that

hunter owns shaman too hard imo

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10-13-2015 , 07:59 PM

#23035

dkgojackets

DKGOAT

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 86,123

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirbynator

warsong at 4 mana seems worse than what they made it now... no?

who would play grim patron decks with warsong @ 4? (or any deck)

what? warsong is completely unplayable as is. its a worse raid leader

4 mana warsong could possibly keep patron alive.

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10-13-2015 , 08:04 PM

#23036

DonkDonkDonkDonk

Goose

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 40,115

Would mean you had to wait till turn nine to do the combo without emperor, which prob means the de k gets zerged down too much to make it a viable deck

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10-13-2015 , 08:21 PM

#23037

captain binkles

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Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 46,792

Add me to the list of people who think it was a bad nerf. I also think people who felt the deck was 'uninteractive' either have a very different definition of the term or missed some of the subtleties of the deck.

Although I also think 'interactivity' is a pretty lol buzzword, and the quicker we can move away from that being used to define what makes something acceptable, the better.

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10-13-2015 , 08:32 PM

#23038

dkgojackets

DKGOAT

Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 86,123

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonkDonkDonkDonk

Would mean you had to wait till turn nine to do the combo without emperor, which prob means the de k gets zerged down too much to make it a viable deck

patron almost never goes warsong + patron on 8

moving it to 4 makes it more difficult to fit in an extra ghoul/whirlwind on the frothing turn

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10-13-2015 , 08:43 PM

#23039

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Soulfire is used in the fast zoo deck with fist too

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10-13-2015 , 08:45 PM

#23040

capone0

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Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 43,152

Most posts in a few hours in this forum since TGT came out though....people are passionate about Patrons.

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10-13-2015 , 08:48 PM

#23041

DonkDonkDonkDonk

Goose

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 40,115

I just don't like how blizzards way of nerfing a deck is to just completely kill it. I know patron was OP but not so OP that a minor nerf wouldn't kill the deck but I feel like just killing the deck was a huge overreaction

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10-13-2015 , 08:50 PM

#23042

donjonnie

McSeafield Survivor

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 3,902

about the patron nerf how about changing inner rage to just plus attack no damage

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10-13-2015 , 08:52 PM

#23043

DonkDonkDonkDonk

Goose

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 40,115

Plus, obviously combo decks will get nerfed when they become consistent enough to be viable, other than patron, what combo decks will you see on the ladder, oil rogue? It's obviously fine to die on turn 6 to an aggro deck but any sort of combo deck needs to be killed off ASAP because dying on turn 10 is too much

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10-13-2015 , 08:54 PM

#23044

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by donjonnie

about the patron nerf how about changing inner rage to just plus attack no damage

Then you'd be nerfing the raging worgen OTK deck.

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10-13-2015 , 08:55 PM

#23045

capone0

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Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 43,152

MR Druid is a combo deck.

A lot of decks are mini combo decks like Tempo Mage, Freeze Mage, Demon Handlock, Mid Range Pally.

Most top decks (probably all) have some sort of synergist effects.

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10-13-2015 , 08:57 PM

#23046

Kirbynator

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Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 52,004

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkgojackets

what? warsong is completely unplayable as is. its a worse raid leader

4 mana warsong could possibly keep patron alive.

4 mana warsong seems a lot more unplayable than the current **** warsong that MAY one day have some kinda face warrior working (it wont)

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10-13-2015 , 08:59 PM

#23047

DonkDonkDonkDonk

Goose

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 40,115

Quote:

Originally Posted by capone0

MR Druid is a combo deck.

A lot of decks are mini combo decks like Tempo Mage, Freeze Mage, Demon Handlock, Mid Range Pally.

Most top decks (probably all) have some sort of synergist effects.

Yeah I guess you could call Druid a combo deck but describing other decks as combo decks just because they have synergy is a stretch

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10-13-2015 , 09:01 PM

#23048

DonkDonkDonkDonk

Goose

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 40,115

Anyway my guess is they were planning on adding some new card that would also be aids with warsong so they just decided to nuke warsong to keep those complaining about patron happy, two birds and all that

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10-13-2015 , 09:05 PM

#23049

capone0

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Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 43,152

Well the next addition of cards will likely come with an adventure that will be announced at Blizzcon. So I expect them to release a number of cards that will create the next annoying combo.

I wonder if the change will bring some decks/cards that were truly hampered by Grimm up the ladder.

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10-13-2015 , 09:58 PM

#23050

TheRempel

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 7,281

The ladder is going to become 300% more cancerous now, largely because Patron was keeping things in check. So you goofballs that are super happy patron is getting hit with the nerf bat please wait at least a few days before you start crying about all the face hunter and secret paladin you're about to face in 75%+ of your matches instead of having maybe a game every few hours against patron.

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