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Old 04-05-2021, 01:44 PM   #48376
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

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Originally Posted by synth_floyd View Post
You really do get a lot of free stuff as a new account now. I made it out of the noob ranks and I got 44 expansion packs, quests worth 300 gold and the free deck.

Plus you get the standard free stuff that everyone else has been getting: the Zuljin legendary, the silas legendary, 2 transfer students and the golden classic pack.

The biggest difference is before all those free packs would be classic packs, which by this point were filler garbage. Now you get expansion packs + the no duplicate rule means they're being very generous with free stuff.

Yeah this is probably the best rotation in history for the new player experience. Or for the free to play experience. I was a little miffed about the classic rotation but now I noticed that all the cards I owned from the classic set are golden now which makes me feel better.
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Old 04-05-2021, 04:05 PM   #48377
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

I am seriously confused about the collection system. It seems I have a mix of "core" set cards which are exactly the same as "classic" cards, but I can't use them in classic? wtf?

And what is the point of achievements? I spent at least 30 minutes clicking over and over again to clear them all out but can't seem do anything with the points I got
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Old 04-05-2021, 06:03 PM   #48378
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

it works in the rewards track but agreed it's stupid to click over and over.
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Old 04-05-2021, 10:53 PM   #48379
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)



Legend again, took longer than it should've as I kept trying to do mage decks with minions in them (lol)

Turns out all it took was someone like Thijs to go over every spell in the game and determine which spells were the best in Deck of Lunacy to make it work. Getting massive support spells also helped.

Can finally play fun decks now that i'm legend weeee
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:08 PM   #48380
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)



Few more notes about the deck:

-Went 59-33 (64%)
-Refreshing Spring Water is an amazing addition.
-I think this deck is very strong even if Deck of Lunacy is nerfed.
-If at least 10 damage doesn't come from minions then it's a bad deck for the game. This is a bad deck for the game. As is a lot of the Pen Flinger stuff rogue and paladin does.

My changes if i were a dev:
Remove Deck of Lunacy
Remove Pen Flinger
Remove Tickatus destroying opposing cards
Remove crabs (e.g. acidic ooze) and balance around not having them
If any decks do 25-30 damage from hand look at nerfing it.
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Old 04-05-2021, 11:17 PM   #48381
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Whats the list code
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Old 04-06-2021, 12:31 AM   #48382
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

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Whats the list code
AAECAf0EApPhA/6eBA7BuAPCuAOMuQOBvwPgzAPHzgPNzgOU0QP30QP73QPQ7APR 7AP8ngT9ngQA

Enjoy!
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Old 04-06-2021, 10:45 AM   #48383
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

It would feel weird not having C'Thun in a deck like that. It just gives you so much value for one card that doesn't negate the deck's building restriction.

I feel like it would also work with Deck of Lunacy because I have it in my head that (5+3) -> 8 mana has been a sweet spot for cool stuff. This may not be the case as much any more with rotations and re-adjustments to standard format.

Should I shed a tear for C'Thun as a casualty of fun in the name of winrate? Or am I over-valuing timely 6/6's with Taunt and "Destroy a minion" when I feel like I might not have another good play if I had drawn another card from my deck instead?
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Old 04-06-2021, 11:34 AM   #48384
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

C'thun puts bad cards in your deck in the name of a payoff that you'll never reach. It's just a really bad card. The mage deck doesn't need the value that C'thun provides.

Further, even if you transform the spells with lunacy, 8 mana is not a sweet spot for spells right now. There are 9 of them in total, 3 of which are complete nothings since they summon nothing/do things to minions in your deck, of which the mage has none. Another is a +3/+5 minion buff, which is bad for mage.


Switching topics: Thinking some more, I take back what I said about penflinger. Stats say the card is fine. It's annoying as ****, but it's not broken. I think it's probably healthy for the game as it provides some neutral burst that's been lacking since the departure of leeroy. Maybe just tone down the voice line to once per game or something.
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Old 04-06-2021, 12:18 PM   #48385
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Searix View Post
AAECAf0EApPhA/6eBA7BuAPCuAOMuQOBvwPgzAPHzgPNzgOU0QP30QP73QPQ7APR 7AP8ngT9ngQA

Enjoy!
Thanks went 7-0 with it already although it’s very similar (maybe identical) to the top performing list on hsreplay on diamond 4-1.
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Old 04-06-2021, 12:19 PM   #48386
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

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C'thun puts bad cards in your deck in the name of a payoff that you'll never reach. It's just a really bad card. The mage deck doesn't need the value that C'thun provides.

Further, even if you transform the spells with lunacy, 8 mana is not a sweet spot for spells right now. There are 9 of them in total, 3 of which are complete nothings since they summon nothing/do things to minions in your deck, of which the mage has none. Another is a +3/+5 minion buff, which is bad for mage.


Switching topics: Thinking some more, I take back what I said about penflinger. Stats say the card is fine. It's annoying as ****, but it's not broken. I think it's probably healthy for the game as it provides some neutral burst that's been lacking since the departure of leeroy. Maybe just tone down the voice line to once per game or something.

Pen flinger is a cool design. I like the card. I’m a broken record at this point, but what’s busted is just paladin. Making an entire handful of 0 mana librams is so dumb.
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Old 04-06-2021, 12:20 PM   #48387
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

This rotation is one of the rare times where the meta that existed before it was sooooo much better. God I loved the last meta.
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Old 04-06-2021, 01:12 PM   #48388
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Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Quote:
Originally Posted by D104 View Post
C'thun puts bad cards in your deck in the name of a payoff that you'll never reach. It's just a really bad card. The mage deck doesn't need the value that C'thun provides.

Further, even if you transform the spells with lunacy, 8 mana is not a sweet spot for spells right now. There are 9 of them in total, 3 of which are complete nothings since they summon nothing/do things to minions in your deck, of which the mage has none. Another is a +3/+5 minion buff, which is bad for mage.


Switching topics: Thinking some more, I take back what I said about penflinger. Stats say the card is fine. It's annoying as ****, but it's not broken. I think it's probably healthy for the game as it provides some neutral burst that's been lacking since the departure of leeroy. Maybe just tone down the voice line to once per game or something.

The spell mana discount turns them into 7 mana spells, right?

C’thun is there to put a clock on control decks, because no-minion mage (sans deck of lunacy) doesn’t really have a way to pressure. It’s very reactive. I think that list will likely be good even if deck of lunacy gets nerfed and c’thun becomes the main version.

Last edited by jmakin; 04-06-2021 at 01:34 PM.
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Old 04-06-2021, 01:34 PM   #48389
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

If you go incanters then lunacy, then yes they are 7. If you go lunacy first, they are 8 mana spells.

The top end burn of spell mage is bonkers and there are no control decks in the meta outside of some wacky priest deck every 50th game. The deck doesn't need an additional threat imo. The c'thun cards are just soooo bad.

Interested to see how the meta shakes out once lunacy gets bopped. I don't think there is gonna be a huge shakeup or anything, but at least it will be more varied instead of having mage be 50% of the meta.

Would like to see them nerf the paladin sword when they nerf lunacy, that card is mega OP. Paladin needs to get tuned down in probably one other way too. I'd say first day of school to 1 mana.
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Old 04-06-2021, 06:55 PM   #48390
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

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I thought this was going to be a bad deck. The curve is so low. Kazakus was amazing but power of creation was the MVP of the deck. I also high rolled a few times with trick totem. The 3/4 with frenzy: "gain divine shield" can get a lot of value too.

Part of it is that I'm still in the noob pool for arena opponents. They say for new accounts your first few arena runs are only against new accounts. But once I started getting above 7 wins, I was definitely facing regular opponents. One person had the legend card back.


+ steward of scrolls, claw machine, smug senior, deep freeze, power of creation, burly shovelfist
Congrats. Allow me to remind you that we have an arena thread. The past couple of years I've been trying to keep that thread somewhat alive. Will you help me?
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Old 04-06-2021, 08:37 PM   #48391
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

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The spell mana discount turns them into 7 mana spells, right?

C’thun is there to put a clock on control decks, because no-minion mage (sans deck of lunacy) doesn’t really have a way to pressure. It’s very reactive. I think that list will likely be good even if deck of lunacy gets nerfed and c’thun becomes the main version.
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If you go incanters then lunacy, then yes they are 7. If you go lunacy first, they are 8 mana spells.

The top end burn of spell mage is bonkers and there are no control decks in the meta outside of some wacky priest deck every 50th game. The deck doesn't need an additional threat imo. The c'thun cards are just soooo bad.

Interested to see how the meta shakes out once lunacy gets bopped. I don't think there is gonna be a huge shakeup or anything, but at least it will be more varied instead of having mage be 50% of the meta.

Would like to see them nerf the paladin sword when they nerf lunacy, that card is mega OP. Paladin needs to get tuned down in probably one other way too. I'd say first day of school to 1 mana.
D104 is correct in that mage doesn't need more burn, here's an example game: https://hsreplay.net/replay/YFopj4Lf9tQCqPBYEyh9tA

We have
2x Runed Orb for 4 damage (+Discover spell for more burn)
2x Fireball for 12
2x Apexis Blast for 10
2x Mask of C'Thun for 20

=46 damage in hand, but then you can get spell power minions from font or primordial studies to add an extra 1-4, but we're already way past 30 damage.

THEN you consider we haven't even counted damage from minions, and again haven't counted extra from discover, or spell damage minions adding more
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Old 04-06-2021, 08:39 PM   #48392
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

If/when they nerf lunacy, just saying cthun might still be added but it probably wont be because more burst is needed (against current meta decks).

Also yes that is Thijs's deck I listed, there's not many spell choices you can make beyond swapping up secrets
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Old 04-06-2021, 10:18 PM   #48393
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Safe to craft a golden Deck of Lunacy? If it's on the hot seat for a nerf, it would be really fun to play with it golden for a while.
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Old 04-06-2021, 10:48 PM   #48394
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Theres no need for a nerf, face decks beat it solidly.
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Old 04-06-2021, 11:36 PM   #48395
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Lol the card has like a 75% mulligan wr, it should and will be nuked from orbit

It’s a completely safe craft, it’s a lock to be nerfed next week
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Old 04-07-2021, 11:01 AM   #48396
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Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Not even close. This is the top winrate mage deck at legend (6000 game sample). Face aggro beats this deck.



I’m honestly perfectly fine with a legendary card that a deck is designed around having a 60% mulligan WR. This card has been around for a WHILE and was never broken before.

What makes it powerful are all the no minion support spells that came with the package. And you only gotta play this game at legend mmr to see that people are countering the **** out of it and its play rate is already going way down.

Last edited by jmakin; 04-07-2021 at 11:12 AM.
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Old 04-07-2021, 11:39 AM   #48397
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Lunacy's mulligan WR across all decks is currently sitting @ 69.4%, which is beyond broken and includes some TERRIBLE decks. But sure, go ahead and ignore the 20 no minion mage decks that have a bigger sample so you can cherry pick the one that "supports" your argument.

The existence of a counter does not mean a card isn't broken. Further, your supposed counter is only a 55/45 favorite.

Anyway, the point of this is to answer Aceium's question: Yes, this card is 100% getting nerfed next week.
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Old 04-07-2021, 12:23 PM   #48398
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Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

I chose the highest winrate deck at legend with the most number of games. Legend sample sizes are smaller but 6,000 games is plenty. The stats are all there, it’s only like $5/month to subscribe. They’re all very similar at legend and if I actually wanted to cherrypick I’d look at top 1000 only because they really drive the meta.

Legend stats are the ones you have to look at, not spread across the entire player base, which not to be elitist but especially early in an expansion are playing terrible gimmick decks (and poorly) and are not refined at all.

Legend players innovate counters to these dominant strategies. The stats suggest there is a counter and the dropoff in mage at my mmr is very noticeable.

I’ve been doing this a while and go over these stats quite a bit. I know which ones to look at. I know that you understand all this. Even vicious syndicate mostly uses legend stats to make their analyses. It’s the best playerbase to look at when deciding what the good decks/cards are.

Again, this card has been around a while and was never broken before. Refreshing spring water is FAR more broken, combined with other mage card draw they can just cycle way too fast.

I don’t doubt it could be nerfed but it’s a mistake to make balance decisions in this way. This deck has a 55/45 weakness to like, 4 different decks and we’re only a week into this meta! It’s not broken. There have been far more broken decks in the past that went untouched.

Last edited by jmakin; 04-07-2021 at 12:28 PM.
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Old 04-07-2021, 12:54 PM   #48399
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Y'all might be interested to know that I created a thread dedicated to achievements.
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Old 04-07-2021, 02:01 PM   #48400
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Re: Hearthstone?! (Blizzard online card game)

Just got legend with lunacy mage—didn’t have cthun. Deck definitely performs worse with cthun. I’ve been running the version that thijs was running. It does take some skill to beat aggro decks with the deck and timing your play of deck of lunacy, the discount card or going all in on burn mage is important especially since there is so much mage vs mage. I enjoyed the deck and the luls, but would prefer a different meta. Pen flinger can be easily fixed. Just make it so it can’t fit face and it’s essentially meh but playable.

I really find the 1 mana that gives you 3 minions to be very clunky in most matchups. I didn’t have the 10 damage 7 mana card as well but I saw a lot of opponents with that card at the top of diamond.
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