I've recently released a beta test for a Live HUD for home games.
https://testflight.apple.com/join/k45Zy8So



I'd love to tap the expertize within this forum to get feedback on:
Whether this is something you'd like to use and why (or why not?)?
Whether this could be suitable for Casinos/Cardrooms?
Do you think there is a market for this?

Looking forward to talking about it. Be as honest as you like and feel free to post any existing solutions. This isn't something I'm committed to so I'd really like to gauge whether this is worth putting time and energy in to.

This looks pretty cool, but I really hope their isn't a market for it. No offense, but this sounds as bad for the game as tracking people's wins and losses. It hugely taps the tank, and I wouldn't want it anywhere near my home game, as it might make the losers play better or quit in frustration.

agree w Garick

Nope, not using this in my home game.

In an underground card room, even less of a chance.

That's true I'm an online player and I've always been wary of creating seating scripts and the likes for this very reason and would never add money tracking to a tool such as this.

I'm operating on the assumption that home game fish aren't aware of how to use a HUD. I've intentionally left out explanations or color coding on how to interpret the stats both for legal reasons and because my intended target is only players who already know how to use a HUD.

So I'm hoping this app would be useless to a fish but I could well be mistaken so I'd value your input.

Thanks for your candor I genuinely appreciate it. Why wouldn't you use this in a home game and why would you feel even less comfortable in an underground card room?

Be honest, I'm not particularly committed to this app it's an old university project I've decided to add to my portfolio so I've more apps to show to prospective employers. If this isn't something that there's a market for or is impractical I intend on simplifying the app and doing the bare minimum to release it in a respectful state and move on to more fruitful endeavours. If there is a demand I'll put lots of time an effort in to making this something that can benefit the poker community.

I'd be releasing it for free either way, in the latter case I may add in-app purchases for advanced features I have to put extra work in to. This thread is part of my efforts to determine that demand.

You think fish--a.k.a. people-- are so dense as to not undertstand why some shark is pumping data into their phone during and after every hand?

You mentioned you're an online player. IDK if you've been to many/any home games, but space is tight. There's no way there's enough space in any home game I've attended where someone could use this and not have it seen by half the table (who would then mention it to the other half). Even at a casino it'd be real hard to hide.

BTW I can't thnk of a single poker player who's even halfway decent who can't figure out the vpip and pfr tendencies of the rest of the table. I don't need to know if someone is vpiping 40 or 50% to know what I need to know.

To the extent that this app could have any use, I would think it would be for people who play online on sites where huds are banned. But the amount of energy it would take to input the data would mean you can't multitable. Plus if you're spending all that effort, you could just pay attention and get more and more actionable info that way.

Thanks for bringing this up I should have paid more attention to my last response which was directed at losing players potentially getting better as a result of using the app. I understand now what yourself and Garick are saying now with reference to tapping the tank/losing players being scared off by the use of such an app.

The intent would never be to hide the use of the app, you'd have to be clear from the get go you're going to use it. In my limited experience no-one has ever told me they were uncomfortable with me using the app. If they had I'd have not used it but this hasn't happened to me yet.

This is part of the reason I'd like to run a beta and why I've started this thread. My personal experiences are not a good sample size of live games as I usually play with friends/acquaintances and play for fun rather than to make a steady income from the games.

If this thread is swamped with people who attest that this would have a negative impact on the value of their home game as they know the lesser skilled people they play with would be scared away from the game then I've got what I came here for (4/4 so far) and know to limit the time I put in to this app and move on.

This is a common opinion amongst live players. As you mentioned I was an online player and we're very HUD reliant.

I played online for my main source of income for 6 years but live I really struggle to keep track of 9 other players frequency of hands I tend to be fooled by someone having a hot streak or a bad run and can't pin point their range with much accuracy unless they're a 70vpiper or until I see some showdowns with very loose holdings. Keeping track of even vaguely accurate steal%s 3bet% tells, bet sizes etc as well for 9 other people is beyond me so I created this app initially as it would be beneficial for myself.

I do believe even for experienced live players there's value in having accurate figures on 3bet% steal% vpip as these will always be more accurate than estimating based on memory of previous hands and would allow you to focus better on qualitative reads such as tells or betting patterns.

Good point. I've made this different to other live HUDs I've seen in the past for this reason.

One click for a player who called, two clicks for a raise. That's it. Folding (the most common action), walking the bigblind, 3betting, stealing can all be determined from just these two inputs. Postflop stats are not tracked as anything more than 5-10 seconds of input preflop would be distracting.

Primarily the home game scene is social. I think most players know who the usual winners are, and the losers think they lose less than they actually do. The guys I play with are into having fun, chatting and smoking a lot of cigars. The idea that I was going to use an app to improve my game (I'm one of the usual winners) makes it seem like it's all about the money. Not a good vibe, and I'd rather have them having fun and not trying to play better against me.

For an underground room, I think a lot of the above applies. Add in the possibility that it might be construed as cheating, and protection from a sore loser may be lacking. Both cheating in the "I'm keeping tendency stats", and "I'm getting info from someone else.". Tapping the tank, or looking for broken kneecaps.

With a bit of thought, I could come up with a situation for it's use. But it would involve people I wasn't social with, weren't social at the table, and really just a profit seeking game. I don't think I'd end up at such a table.


It sounds cool. Maybe it would be something players would use in an online home game setting? Those that wouldn't want to pay <insert major brand> prices, but are going to see the same players online. Unless there is a video conference going on, it takes away a lot of the issues that result from being IRL.

Good luck with everything. I'm a fan of people getting paid for work, but putting things onto a resume seems a good exception.

A bit of a derail, but my home game group has been playing on pokerstars homegame since COVID, and it's pretty interesting to see peoples stats on the HUD!
Last night we had a 13 person tourney and I ended up heads-up with one of the guys,(tough old cowboy type) who places well in many of the live tourneys. I now have around 500 hands with him playing 75/45, cbetting 95% of flops. Certainly helped to know his playing style live and now with the HUD online, and set traps with big hands as you know he'll be in there! He still won though.. lol

I'm firmly in the camp that this should be against the rules everywhere, and in the live realm potentially illegal (using an electronic aid to gain an advantage against your opponents or the casino).

I also agree w Garick

Thanks for everyone's candid feedback. I'm a firm believer of failing fast and moving on rather than being committed to an idea.

Based on the feedback here and the lack of beta testers I'll put this on the back-burner for now and focus my efforts elsewhere.

Thanks for being willing to listen to feedback instead of taking it as insults and getting mad.