If he takes them to court, I think in fact he has to keep the money, and then the court decides what to do with the money. What happens if he returns the money is not sure. He might just get f.

Ops cards could have gotten worse for insulting them, but that could be due to being really upset.

If they find an arbiter they both agree on this could be settled quick.

What about Jesse's homophobic comments? Does him making homophobic remarks and talking about the stable owner's mothers getting banged by black and brown guys not matter? Is Jesse the only one allowed to be a bigot and to "charge for his time"? I demand payment for the time I've wasted on this thread. Jesse you now owe me $1,000 dollars + another $100 for every future post I have to make going forward for wasting my time. And for the homophobic comments you've made on this forum you owe 2p2 an additional $1,000 for spouting your hate speech on here. For denigrating the mother of Jeremy, who is blameless and has nothing to do with this issue, you owe Jeremy an apology as well as $10,000. You don't insult someone's mother Jesse, that's wrong in any culture. Case closed.

Jesse doesn't want arbitration, he just wants to steal, he's already said as much.

What court has precedence, or will pay you back for your time? I have no idea what court since I don't know where any of you are based, and honestly, I don't think any court will pay you for your time. I also don't know if a court in a relevant jurisdiction would even award you anything if someone was a racist ******* to you, especially given that you've engaged in your own insults in return. But I'm not a lawyer, and not an expert on these matters. But I've had numerous exchanges with people, both as a customer and serving customers, where I've had tons of my time wasted. Never in my wildest dreams would I have considered that I have the right to charge them for my time. As a white man, I haven't experienced any discrimination that I was aware of, so I can't speak to what I'd expect if I experienced that - but I would think the threshold for awarding damages for racist email and chat interactions would be pretty damn high, and situation dependent.

In addition, I don't know that I'd trust your perception of what happened to be entirely accurate. You've been imprecise in this thread just with me multiple times now. You suggested before that I had insinuated...well, I'm not sure what because you never said, and you also said that I should be added to "that list" which presumably was of people who were "completely ignoring the racist hate coming from that stable". I showed you that you were wrong on both counts, and I heard nothing further from you on that. Now it's suggesting that I said this was premeditated (whatever "this" is), although this time you've admitted you don't really know if I said that or not, as you said "I believe you or another said before" - ****, dude, I only have six ****ing posts in this thread. After you already falsely misrepresented my posts before, would it really be that hard to look up to see if I mentioned anything about "this" being premeditated? Guess what? I didn't. So, given your sloppy work just in this regard, I wouldn't be shocked if you didn't have all your facts right in regard to the situation at hand.

If it were me, I'd pay the money owed and move on. You've blasted, or in your words, exposed, the stable so everyone can make their own decisions WRT them in the future. At this point, you're just harming your own reputation, and potentially opening yourself up to legal trouble. But that's your decision to make, obviously.

I, um, wait, what?

Jw, is there any other group of people you would categorize as having bad hygiene? Or is it only cool in SJW land to negatively stereotype against the western world?

You’re not being morally consistent, similar to OP saying he is outraged about racism while calling others butt buddies.

You've said so much in this post it would only derail the conversation even more to address, each one. Which, coincidentally (or incidentally) is the exact strategy the stable took.

I have been consistent in what I have said. If you think not, then go back and post my quotes, not an elongated sentence of your presumptions merged into multiple paragraphs making accusations.

To address the fundamental question you did raise: It is not only entirely possible for you to charge customers you serve, for your time, but it is the fundament reason you charge them. You are selling them your time, in the form of a service or a product.

Except the stable is not your customer, they are your business partner. And you can't charge someone something without them agreeing to it beforehand either.

You now owe me $1100.

I cannot speak for washoe, so I will not attempt to do so. Nor do I care to address the cleanliness of each culture. Funny how you focus on this, attempting to point out a double-standard, but you DON'T EVEN point out the fact of what we actually know to be certain. The blatant racism, which was only defended by members of the stable and by the stable themselves. Start your focus there, then if you wish to have a normal conversation, proceed from there.

Calling someone a buddy is not a negative connoting word. Also, how do you presume to know what my morals are? Furthermore, the main point is a person in power wasted the earning potential and time of the stable, including myself, because of his radical ideas. Me, calling someone a buddy, has no affect on them working nor earning.

[QUOTE=mamelas;56871164] You didn't call him a "buddy" you called him a "buttbuddy" and you also called him words that were censored by this site, I'm guessing that word started with an 'f' and ended with a 't' f****t.

You now owe me $1200.

Finally, you have returned after a couple weeks with a new, original angle. I applaud you for this, even though you and the other 4 Nazis have been all but original before.

Who are you to say who I can charge and who I cannot?
If you and I wish to work together, in the future, and I agree to pay you that sum, then that will be my decision.

Yet, I think your car, armchair psychology gig might earn you more

Charge whoever you want whatever you want, that's fine, but they need to agree to that beforehand. You can't charge someone retroactively when they never agreed to it. You can't take someone else's money against their will, that's stealing.

You now owe me $1300.

[QUOTE=SimpleRick;56871170] And so many people may love to be called a butt buddy. I told him I would respect his decision not to be called that. They did not afford me the same respect and this is the reason we are here.

They believed they could bully me into submission by incessantly disregarding my attempts to bring this to their attention. Eventually, people who do this will only answer to one thing: material means. Therefore, my time was charged.

For teaching you this valuable lesson I charge you $10,000 (adjusted for future inflation). If you wish to apologize, in the future, then this sum will need to be paid, for you to work with me.

This nonsense is getting really old.

Oh, FFS.

Yet, they continued to charge me my time, continuously, by not responding to their Nazi friend's overt radicalism.

And you have now proved my point.

You can have the last word, since you are so keen to do so.

Yes, how do you think I felt, after constantly dealing with Jeremy and his radicalism? Then, being disregarded by the 3 amigos who made excuse after excuse for him?

Here is the remainder of the money owed to them (link below), although I could have very well charged more. Also, I have videos to post of the charitable donations I made on the stable's behalf. If you think this is about money, then you are sadly mistaken.

https://gyazo.com/9a97bbae12d3f1b340e4baa1a2110723

What word were you using in your post that 2p2 kept having to censor? Was I correct in assuming you were using the f-slur there Jesse?

I don't know what this has to do with your continuous misrepresentations of my posts.

@ simplerick
@bobo

Op did offend the stable guys, but you are taking it out of context imo.

- he insulted the 3 amigos, said butt buddies, itt. But he apologized immediately after. And the way I understand it he only insulted them after many accounts belonging to the stable power played him itt. He implied that these accounts are close and said butt buddies. However I wouldn't think the term butt buddies was so bad in this context.

- he insulted Jeremy's mother in the stable chat. BUT he did add "is that why you are so rascist?" So the insults were a reaction of being insulted. That makes a huge difference in my books.

Look, we are playing a CRAZY GAME for a lot of money.
If we are not stable, we go to a stable. Did the stable do a good job in stabilizing op? I don't think so. If anything I can't think of a better way to destabilize a horse as to throw stupid racist and false comments at him while playing.

The word stable in itself means something. It's supposed to help the player to be stable. If the stable did something to tilt the player I would say that is something that shouldn't have happened.

Business and law can be ruthless.
Most stables apparently see staking only through a business point of view. And there is the mistake. It involves humans. Any deal involves humans. So we should treat each other with respect and fairly.

At any point if we know the outcome can be influenced. Poker might be the only thing were every little **** matters.

Maybe we can get someone , Joe ingram? to do an arbitration as op wished for.

Not that it matters but -
Still haven't seen a single racist slur ever directed at OP or his family. Jesse the SJW turning more into thought police at this point. Not that it matters, anyone can say anything to anyone else and that's not a precursor to stealing money from them.

Jesse sent us $450.40 in bitcoin from his BetOnline account, which he was reloaded for an amount of $1000 hours before his breakdown. He has only played 4 games during this time with our money in his account and is down $75. So looks like he's decided to steal $475 from us there

It does not matter if it the racist slurs were directly or not. Period. End of story. Ok?
You keep repeating this invalid argument to look better, where defacto it makes you look more ignorant and at fault. What you do is called gaslighting.

If you are black and I say all blacks are low iq and have bad hygene, over and over again, YOU will take offense. That's why racism is not allowed anywhere.

This part has been widely understood itt.

I don’t think you’ll find many people that will justify OP taking your money. He should give it back. He’s not entitled to it just because he was mistreated. The catfishing allegations seem real, but almost all backers do this bc they can’t handle downswings.

I also don’t think you’ll find many people in jeremy’s side. Having American military experience almost helps OP’a point, as some of us know first hand how mercenaries can be.

I don’t think there were any “good-taste jokes” made. I think there is some serious hostility toward minorities from your people. It’s not natural to make fun of someone for how and where they were born. Glorifying your privilege is also not a joke, at least to most sensible people. You guys clearly think yourselves superior.

I’d say OP owes balance + MU. But I’d say he has some righteous complaints, from what I’ve seen. OP calling them nazis is only natural but they are simply prejudiced.

This is very interesting to me as a player. You must be very careful who you pick as a backer.

@bobo, Id paid back too. With a bad feeling though.

I believe op uncovered something here and if he paid back the money we would most likely not have this conversation.

He could have ignored these comments and continued to play with 3 amigos money as of now. But he didn't.

literally started my post with "it doesn't matter..." but that seems to be the only sticking point jesse keeps trying and failing to make is that people said bad things to him and his family. Quite the opposite is true and has been posted redundantly, of Jesse being extremely foul directly to Jeremy, as well as the partners of the stable.

You accuse me/us of gaslighting, a newage word to me, but means psychological abuse and manipulation. whattt?? Stop blaming others for your inadequacies and demanding that they foot the bill for your frivolous demands. Personal responsibility is all but lost when people are demanding to be paid for offhand racist comments and 'psychological abuse'. Grow up.

Jeremy said some things that were subjectively out of line for those easily offended. We never condoned this behavior but learned from it and deleted any chats where those discussions were taking place. what else should we be expected to do in that situation? Especially when everything was fine for 12 months and then out of the blue we are all nazi's when a reload is a couple hours late.

We also fulfilled Jesse's wishes and completed our community service to the latino community by helping 10 actual latinos make over 200k between them while playing under us and helping to further their poker careers, and a decent amount more when you include all the loans we gave them to help pay bills while in MU. (missing one guy who blocked some of his SS accounts with us who was up 80k or so iirc)


cce9
what have you done to put a quarter mill in the bank for 'your people' Jesse, besides plundering money and time from those who provide these opportunities?

Nobody is defined by any demographic, they are defined by their actions. Jesse is stealing money from people he decided he didn't like and playing the race card to garner sympathy towards his misplaced social justice cause.

If things worked like that and I could just demand money from anyone I disagreed with while keeping a clear conscience I'd be stoked! That's just not how the world works though, unless you are delusional.

I have no idea why you're including me in this. I've taken nothing out of context, and all I've said about this issue is that OP has been hurling insults in return, which he has. Repetitively.

Butt buddies makes sense in only one context - as a homophobic remark. As for apologizing - yes, he did, while minimizing it at every chance he could. "And so many people may love to be called a butt buddy. I told him I would respect his decision not to be called that." "Calling someone a buddy is not a negative connoting word." Kind of reminds me of those "sorry you were offended" apologies we see so often. And in the meantime, he continues with the Nazi remarks. How meaningful is an apology followed by more insults?

I don't really care if he wants to carry on like this, that's up to him. My only point is that it may weaken his case in the eyes of some, and perhaps even in legal proceedings. How seriously should outrage at racist remarks be taken when the same person is making what most would see as homophobic remarks?

In the meantime, he has now managed to misconstrue/misrepresent my posts not once, not twice, but four times. And when I called him out for it again the last time, his reply was "Yes, how do you think I felt, after constantly dealing with Jeremy and his radicalism?" - like that has anything to do with our conversation and somehow makes it OK. OP's credibility is pretty lacking IMO.

The word stable has two distinct meanings, which you seem to be confusing. The noun and the adjective are very different.

2+2ers have a really strange obsession with Joe Ingram as some kind of savior for anything poker-related. It's even more oddly placed here. I have never known him to be some kind of staking expert, and I don't see what there is to arbitrate.

This incorrect understanding of yours seems to drive a lot of your belief that there is something to arbitrate. Hate speech is illegal in many places. Racism is, rightly, not acceptable to most people. Racism not being allowed anywhere? That's ridiculous. I expect there are very few, if any, places where one could make the sweeping statement that racism isn't allowed.

How does that even make sense? If OP had paid back the money, he could have started the exact same thread - and had much more universal support.