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Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever)

12-31-2018 , 09:19 AM
Villain is a rec woman in her 40s, totally passive, seen her limp AK 5min before.

Blinds 800/1600 w BB ante. Eff. Stack 43000.
Hero has KK UTG1, raises to 4200.
Folds around. Villainess (CO) raises to 7600 !!!
At this point I already "knew", it was AA. She was looking away, smiling. The min-raise imo is always AA with this player type.
What an incredible fold this would have been right here!
But then I start thinking and questioning my subconscious/gut feeling. Recalling friends questioning my min-raise=AA theory. Maybe it is something else this time. Maybe she just loves QQ so much.
Then I just blank somehow (say to myself: just play "solid" poker) and raise to 19000 which is probably the most stupid sizing with a stack of 43000. Agreed?
She shoves happily and I call it off getting about 3:1, which is - again - plain stupid. Right?

So how to play this in the best possible way, apart from the god-like insta-fold. Or is that an option to some of you?

I do not like flat-call too much, because it leaves us in the dark wrt to QQ vs AA and we probably have to call two more bets or maybe we face one big jam.

So what about raising to 11000 and then folding to a jam? I had never considered that before (because I would frown upon it as "not solid poker") but in a spot like this it seems pretty much perfect.
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
12-31-2018 , 11:29 AM
If you have your read that this min-raise is AA then fold. Vs semi-competent villains this is a stack off situation >25bb deep
Any 4bet is all in, don't get fancy. You aren't gonna fold KK after putting 30% of your stack

Don't show results if you want real analysis
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
12-31-2018 , 12:16 PM
How do you know she was 40?
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
12-31-2018 , 12:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davesreiberg
How do you know she was 40?
Just felt it
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
12-31-2018 , 01:59 PM
You didn't really offer an argument against flatting other than it would make your feelings go icky.

Even if you're never folding KK and you know she has AA, I'd rather root for a board that scares her into not putting in the rest of her stack than any other suggestion.

....any other suggestion bar folding. I folded KK 35bb eff online a couple of weeks ago and didn't sweat it. If I'm to answer to friends let them fund my buy ins.
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
12-31-2018 , 03:54 PM
Just flat and play post.

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Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
12-31-2018 , 07:34 PM
I always find it amazing how much thought there is put into these kinds of cooler situations. You can easily stack off in this situation and you far better off working on basic stuff such as what ranges to open and how to handle preflop game than how to make ridiculous hero folds with KK 25BB deep.

IF you’re SUPER confident that this woman just has it cause of live reads or whatever just flat it and play it POST as others have suggested but really don’t sweat it when you go broke here.
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
12-31-2018 , 09:00 PM
Setmine FTW
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
01-01-2019 , 07:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whia
I always find it amazing how much thought there is put into these kinds of cooler situations. You can easily stack off in this situation and you far better off working on basic stuff such as what ranges to open and how to handle preflop game than how to make ridiculous hero folds with KK 25BB deep.

IF you’re SUPER confident that this woman just has it cause of live reads or whatever just flat it and play it POST as others have suggested but really don’t sweat it when you go broke here.
+1
Worrying too much about how to avoid this kind of spot is likely to have a negative effect on your game
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
01-01-2019 , 02:26 PM
First off, reraising is not a good idea if she won't stack off with anything other than KK+ or flat worse. This goes even for players other than passive fish. Obviously, this gets more complicated and irritating if there's a cold caller somewhere... Also, fwiw, limping AK is not a sure sign that villain won't 3bet here with AK. I think in their minds, limping AK is setting a trap.

Sometimes players will m3bet with other pocket pairs/broadways, so it's not a good idea to muck imo versus a min-raise. Villain can easily be doing this with Js+ and even less commonly around 8s+. You're better off flatting and playing poker postflop. If villain goes pot, pot, pot, she probably has the goods. Any A-high flop or K makes our life super easy.

+1 also to what Whia said.

Last edited by goldFishshark; 01-01-2019 at 02:31 PM.
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
01-03-2019 , 12:48 PM
As played, you dont trust your reads. Why should we?
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
01-12-2019 , 09:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjjou812
As played, you dont trust your reads. Why should we?
WTF?
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote
01-12-2019 , 01:13 PM
You said twice that this player and action is AA, literally " is always AA"
Folding KK at 25bb - but how exactly ? (most obvious spot ever) Quote

      
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