Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2

02-17-2008 , 01:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeMcQ1
New to table...
Am I overthinking this?

Poker Stars $0.50/$1.00 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (CO): $283.05
BTN: $17.30
SB: $94.50
BB: $56.90
UTG: $517.75

Pre Flop: Hero is CO with Q A
UTG calls $1, Hero raises to $5, 2 folds, BB calls $4, UTG calls $4

Flop: ($15.50) J K A (3 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($15.50) T (3 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $12, BB waited a bit before BB calls $12, UTG folds

River: ($39.50) 6 (2 players)
BB bets $39.90 all in, Hero...

I believe I would call here you need to be good >33% and I think you probably are against a total unknown.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 01:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeMcQ1
31/14/1.3 af by street --> 1.5/1.8/1.5 ~200 hands
I'm like 26/22 and have been raising limpers a lot, I've 3 bet villian a couple times but not crazy...he's folded every time.

Poker Stars, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter
Hero (SB): $192.55
BB: $52.60
UTG: $172.60
CO: $98.50
BTN: $559.95

Pre-Flop: K A dealt to Hero (SB)
UTG checks, CO folds, BTN raises to $4, Hero raises to $15, 2 folds, BTN calls $11

Flop: ($31) J 9 8 (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

Turn: ($31) A (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $25, Hero calls $25

River: ($81) K (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $519.95 and is All-In, Hero...

Damn strange. Sometimes people do this with the nuts figuring you can only have a couple of hands you could call with and they're going to be difficult for you to fold, but he cannot have the nuts here since you have the Ks. I guess I would fold because there are plenty of hands he could have that beat you and you're not getting good odds.

Did you think about betting the turn? I just had a twenty minute argument with myself about betting the turn but it ended in a draw...
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 01:59 PM
6-3 off is so AWESOME flop a 6 float it have a donk min bet to the river hit your 2 pair ship it in he calls with TP TK you double up and make the MONEYSSS!
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 05:20 PM
Mikey - as I said on AIM but I'll post here - first hand I call for sure. Second hand I had exactly the same thoughts as jbrochu. I would bet the turn for sure. He can call with worse and you have a lot of outs to the nuts. The small pot would suck if you have the nuts.

her0carn - a post like that should go in the censored thread.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 05:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeMcQ1
31/14/1.3 af by street --> 1.5/1.8/1.5 ~200 hands
I'm like 26/22 and have been raising limpers a lot, I've 3 bet villian a couple times but not crazy...he's folded every time.

Poker Stars, $0.50/$1 NL Hold'em Cash Game, 5 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter
Hero (SB): $192.55
BB: $52.60
UTG: $172.60
CO: $98.50
BTN: $559.95

Pre-Flop: K A dealt to Hero (SB)
UTG checks, CO folds, BTN raises to $4, Hero raises to $15, 2 folds, BTN calls $11

Flop: ($31) J 9 8 (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

Turn: ($31) A (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $25, Hero calls $25

River: ($81) K (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $519.95 and is All-In, Hero...
i bet the turn here. only hand i see vill doing this with that you beat is like AJ or some other 2pair. fold as played.

i like your flop check, with the As i would cbet.

Last edited by cakewalk; 02-17-2008 at 05:51 PM.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 05:53 PM
Is there a good article/post or could someone write an essay on table selection. I have 25k players datamined on my site and I have a table selection tool but I'm not sure on how to pick out my tables. Currently I have a points system that works like this:
  • 10 points VPIP 58-100, stack min 75 (BBs)
  • 7 points VPIP 48-58, stack min 75
  • 4 points VPIP 38-48, stack min 75
  • 2 points VPIP 40-100, stack 50-75
I choose the table(s) that have the most points. Should I add something to my scoring system?
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 06:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by K䲰䮥n
Is there a good article/post or could someone write an essay on table selection. I have 25k players datamined on my site and I have a table selection tool but I'm not sure on how to pick out my tables. Currently I have a points system that works like this:
  • 10 points VPIP 58-100, stack min 75 (BBs)
  • 7 points VPIP 48-58, stack min 75
  • 4 points VPIP 38-48, stack min 75
  • 2 points VPIP 40-100, stack 50-75
I choose the table(s) that have the most points. Should I add something to my scoring system?
This is way more elaborate than what I do and I think I table select more than most. Your system looks really good to me. Looks like you should be giving us a tutorial about the software you use and how to set up your system on it Karp

edit - Can you use PFR% in your point system?
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 06:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cha59
This is way more elaborate than what I do and I think I table select more than most. Your system looks really good to me. Looks like you should be giving us a tutorial about the software you use and how to set up your system on it Karp

edit - Can you use PFR% in your point system?
Available stats are
  • VPIP
  • PFR
  • AF
  • WTSD
  • WSD
  • Stack size
  • # of hands
Forgot to mention that I use minimum 75 hands for each category. The software that I use is Eyepoker. Spade-eye probably has it too. The points system is really easy to set up. It's in the options. After scanning the tables just rate tables on their points scored.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 06:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by K䲰䮥n
Available stats are
  • VPIP
  • PFR
  • AF
  • WTSD
  • WSD
  • Stack size
  • # of hands
Forgot to mention that I use minimum 75 hands for each category. The software that I use is Eyepoker. Spade-eye probably has it too. The points system is really easy to set up. It's in the options. After scanning the tables just rate tables on their points scored.
how much is each value weighted ?
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 07:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cakewalk
how much is each value weighted ?
You weight it. Like you can give 13 points to a player with 78-99 VPIP who has minimum 150 hands and who goes to showdown atleast 34% of the time.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 08:35 PM
Getting a good table is important but where you sit is equally important. I won't stay at a table any longer with one of those 60 vpip passive calling station types on my immediate left. They just screw my game up too much. Get that sucker on your right and a couple of tight unimaginative players on your left and now you're styling.

I'm sure you guys already know this but for some reason until lately I would hang around too long in bad situations instead of hunting for good seats.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-17-2008 , 09:49 PM
karp,

Maybe you don't have enough data to make this a good idea, but you could look through your PT and look at the stats for players who you are up a lot of money on.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 01:06 PM
Okay since the closest decisions matter the least I'm gonna post some common spots that come up often and might lead to major leaks in one's bankroll. Stay with with me.

All events occur on on NL100 6max tables with 100xBBs unless otherwise stated.

COMMON SPOT UNO

2 fold
Hero raises to $4 9 8
Button calls
Blinds fold

Flop: K Q 2
Hero bets $7
Button calls

Turn: 3
Hero's plan?
(if Hero checks and if Villain bets it's 2/3 pot)

Villain is
  1. LAG
  2. TAG
  3. LAP
  4. Unknown
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 02:08 PM
Karp, for every one of those opponents I would lead right out again for close to full pot so I can set up a shove on the river.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 02:14 PM
Mike,
Call river with the straight.
Bet turn with As Kc. As played I would fold the river you only beat a bluff, but I would bet it as well and let every two pair or other stupid hands call.

Karp,
I bet the turn vs. everyone.


Quote:
Getting a good table is important but where you sit is equally important. I won't stay at a table any longer with one of those 60 vpip passive calling station types on my immediate left. They just screw my game up too much. Get that sucker on your right and a couple of tight unimaginative players on your left and now you're styling.
This is bad it really isn't that hard to adjust vs. these guys just don't bluff them and vbet a lot.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 02:34 PM
Quote:
This is bad it really isn't that hard to adjust vs. these guys just don't bluff them and vbet a lot.
I don't see why it's bad to just move and find a better spot keeping those guys on my right.

For one, when they're on your left you have to open less and c-bet less. You also end up getting squeezed a lot more if the players in the blinds have any clue what's going on. At nl100 there is no reason imo to bother with that when you can almost always find a better seat at another table.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 02:54 PM
Im an ass. Hero wasnt supposd to make the flush on turn. Please?

All events occur on on NL100 6max tables with 100xBBs unless otherwise stated.

COMMON SPOT UNO part DUE

2 fold
Hero raises to $4 9 8
Button calls
Blinds fold

Flop: K Q 2
Hero bets $7
Button calls

Turn: 3
Hero's plan?
(if Hero checks and if Villain bets it's 2/3 pot)

Villain is
  1. LAG
  2. TAG
  3. LAP
  4. Unknown
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 03:00 PM
Karp,

I too would lead turn almost always against everyone. The only exception is if I have an aggressive opponent who I've set up to check/raise the turn. i.e. I've ch/folded a few turns after cbetting flop vs him or the table a few times. But this particular hand you've illustrated is just set up too nicely and you should keep betting for value and for protection.

(edit for non-flush)
If I checked I would check/fold to 2/3 bet vs most without any history.
That said, I will 2 barrel sometimes vs TAG, and maybe LAG depending on recent history.

Last edited by MikeMcQ1; 02-18-2008 at 03:07 PM.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 03:26 PM
Karp,

I think the reads need to be more specific in your second example with the blank turn.

Like if I've had several hands against a LAG where he floated the flop and I check/folded to a turn bet I might c/r here although it would be better with some overs and the draw or maybe a gutterball/flush combo draw. Sometimes just firing a second barrel is good too if he's the type of LAG that will float one street but give up to further action.

Against most passive players I would check hoping they check behind but would probably call their 2/3 bet if I know they would likely call a decent size bet on the river if they have anything at all.

Against a good TAG I would probably check/fold a lot.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 03:29 PM
Karp,

Bet.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 03:32 PM
oh, both hands, btw.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 04:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jbrochu
I don't see why it's bad to just move and find a better spot keeping those guys on my right.

For one, when they're on your left you have to open less and c-bet less. You also end up getting squeezed a lot more if the players in the blinds have any clue what's going on. At nl100 there is no reason imo to bother with that when you can almost always find a better seat at another table.
Even if every table at NL100 is populated with guys that are 60% loose/bad (which suprises me), this won't be the case as you move up. You will want to learn how to handle having the big fish at the table on your left. I don't know that you need to open too much less, just dramatically adjust your cbet frequencies, value bet marginal hands, possibly double barrel more, and profit.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 04:48 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiggs73
oh, both hands, btw.
Would you semi-2barrel here against all types of villains? How often would you 3barrel a blanc turn and against which types of Villains would you do or not do that?
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 04:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wuwei
Even if every table at NL100 is populated with guys that are 60% loose/bad (which suprises me), this won't be the case as you move up. You will want to learn how to handle having the big fish at the table on your left. I don't know that you need to open too much less, just dramatically adjust your cbet frequencies, value bet marginal hands, possibly double barrel more, and profit.

No, I'm not trying to say every table has these guys at nl100 but I only play 3 or 4 tables so I don't have to move around too much to find a table and a seat I like.

Point taken about learning to deal with all player types. I think that's fine if it's a deliberate decision.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote
02-18-2008 , 05:49 PM
On table selection...

How short stacked has one bad player be in NL100 (where still many fish swim) to start hunting for bad players with bigger stacks?

Scenario:

I sit down into table and have a VPIP 45 player on my right. VPIP is the only info I gave. He has xxBBs. I decide to leave and go to another table because I know I can find a table in a short to medium notice where an equally bad player sits with a bigger stack.

What's the biggest xx for Hero to make the right decisions.

**** this foreign lanuage but I hope you get my point.
STTF SNG -> Cash Thread #2 Quote

      
m